88mm flack gun

[Lusche]

What I could imagine... and note that I have absolutely no idea what HTC is really doing... well, what I could imagine as an easy "solution":

With the new icon system, give the 88 - and only this one - unlimited icon range. You can see the enemy planes, you get an icon ("12K"). And the fuse is set by time (perhaps mappable to any analog control axis). This would on one hand simulate radar or optical rangefinder data data, whole on the other hand it would still not be anywhere like "magic" hit probability. (...)
But this way the gunner would have at least a chance to engage high flying targets, while not having to fall back on something like radar fused rounds. And, at least for me, that would add another new, interesting thing to learn  

Well, it seems it's almost that way, just max 12k icons instead of 'unlimited' 

[chaser]

I played around with the 88 a little today and its sure not going to be the bomber destroyer some people thought it would be. Getting range and aim spot on is basically impossible at extreme ranges between 6-12K yds.

[Ruah]

so this means we get more puffy ack?

[Lusche]

so this means we get more puffy ack?

Yes, but very different from any we had before.

[Trukk]

How many rounds were fired by flak for every bomber brought down over Germany?

[Lusche]

How many rounds were fired by flak for every bomber brought down over Germany?

According to the comprehensive book on German heavy AA "Die schwere Flak 1939-1945" by Werner Müller:

16,000 rounds for the 88 Flak 36/37
8,500 rounds for the 88 Flak 41

[Trukk]

So let's say that ingame they are even 10x better than real life. Very few guys are going to have the patience to fire that many rounds to take a level bomber down.

[Lusche]

So let's say that ingame they are even 10x better than real life. Very few guys are going to have the patience to fire that many rounds to take a level bomber down.

In AH, most buffs fly considerably lower than in real life, and use very suicidal tactics. A formation B-17's that is passing over the town at 'realistic' 25,000 feet will be very, very difficult to hit from the airfield.

Quick & rough computation:
If the town is 5k yards away from the field and the bombers are at 24K feet... if directly over the town the icon range should be about 9.4k The rounds take about 21 seconds to get there, during that time a formation of B-17s will travel something like 2500 yards = ~ 100 plane lengths. And of course that 21 seconds means you would shoot when the bombers icon range would display a different readout than 9.4k. Also you would have to aim for a point way in front of the town, as the bomb release point is not directly over it and bombers often change course right after dropping the bombs.

Lots of variables, many guesstimates and enormous room for error.  


But stil: Given the laws of probability it's just a matter of time until such a thing happens - and we can already bet on how long it will take for the first "ridiciously overmodeled crap" whine to show up  

[Karnak]

But stil: Given the laws of probability it's just a matter of time until such a thing happens - and we can already bet on how long it will take for the first "ridiciously overmodeled crap" whine to show up  

I, for one, will be greatly amused if I get hit.  Even more so if it one shots my Mossie XVI that is moving at 380mph at 28,000ft.  Should such an event occur I could no nothing other than congratulate the gunner on his excellent shot.

[SAJ73]

I was playing around with the 88flak last night in the beta, and shooting at some dots on the radar way inland. I maxed out the distance, and let the flak arch down towards the horizon in the direction I saw the dots.. And I saw someone comment that a few of those flak shells came really close and seemed quite deadly, wonder if they were speaking about MY flak shells?! If that were the case, then I can imagine how perfecting the aim in these guns may affect overall gameplay. Just imagine.. The dots were almost a sector away.. 

[Lusche]

I, for one, will be greatly amused if I get hit.  Even more so if it one shots my Mossie XVI that is moving at 380mph at 28,000ft.  Should such an event occur I could no nothing other than congratulate the gunner on his excellent shot.

When the new version goes live, I will deliberately fly over fields at 20k in my B-17 to see how it works out. 

[MK-84]

When the new version goes live, I will deliberately fly over fields at 20k in my B-17 to see how it works out. 

Excellent, just let me know your speed as well and I will deliberately man one of the 88's 

[Oldman731]

Lots of variables, many guesstimates and enormous room for error.

Sounds pretty accurate to me.  If real world ack was as effective as it is in AH, all nations would have given up on level bombers in 1940.

- oldman

[Ack-Ack]

 If real world ack was as effective as it is in AH, all nations would have given up on level bombers in 1940.

- oldman

If ack in AH was effective as it was in real life, no one would play Aces High.  You are seriously kidding yourself if you actually believe acks in game are more effective than what they were in real life.

ack-ack

[Lusche]

Sounds pretty accurate to me.  If real world ack was as effective as it is in AH, all nations would have given up on level bombers in 1940.

- oldman

Did they fly the same suicidal way bombers and basically all other planes do fly here?