1946

[Karnak]

First you want specs you claim don't exist, when those are provided, that's not good enough ... You got some special knowledge, You know what nobody else does ... You seen the captured documentation? Russian SPY here boys, trying to sabotage the development program at AH ... Call out the firing squad !!!

I asked for data that has not been provided.  You provided what you in your ignorance you thought was the data requested and when it was pointed out to you that it was not the data that is needed you get huffy.  The fact that you cannot understand very basic concepts is not my problem.

[B-17]

Anyone else notice this discrepency, and its clear implication of ignorance of the subject?

There was no Russia between 1926 and 1991. There was the Russian Federated Socialist Republic, which was part of the larger collective USSR (Union of Soviet Socialist Republics, for EVZ, as he probably doesn't know the acronym). Yet he explicitly says the USSR, the place of origion for the Migs, didn't have access to the data that the Migs were suposedly based off of. He goes on to say that a defunct government (Russian Empire..... that or hes talking about the current Russian Federation) captured a German factory in WWII, during which time neither of those governments existed.

Clearly he doesn't know his subject matter. Call out the firing squad for Karnak? I say call out the truant officer to take you back to school.

Oh, PLEASE, SPARE me the DRAMA!!!!!!!!!!!

You're what? 16? 18?

[Ack-Ack]

Oh, PLEASE, SPARE me the DRAMA!!!!!!!!!!!

You're what? 16? 18?

The funny thing is it's Nemesis that is showing his ignorance with his last post. 

ack-ack

[B-17]

Who's Nemesis?

[EVZ]

Russian aviation historian Yefim Gordon, wrote a detailed and comprehensive book on the Russian development of the MiG 15 and showed quite clearly that, although the MiG 15 did bear a slight resemblance in layout, it was an entirely independent development.

Yeah!  ??? Q: Who writes a book about WHO DIDN'T INVENT SOMETHING ??? A: RUSSIANS ... They invented Coffee, Donuts, and the Buffalo Nickel too ... according to typical Communist Literature ... What they DIDN'T do was let anyone get a good look at the TA-182.

Wiki has the SAME data everyone else does, As I understand it? It was included with the Blueprints the Swedes Got from the Germans.

[EVZ]

Who's Nemesis?

I think that's one of Moriarity's Aliases ....

[Wmaker]

And what are the performance numbers for the Ta183?  Oh yeah, nobody knows so they would just be fantasy guess numbers.

Considering the considerable amount of number crunching that goes into a design of any aircraft, the fact the aircraft never flew doesn't make the numbers "fantasy guess numbers".

[Karnak]

Considering the considerable amount of number crunching that goes into a design of any aircraft, the fact the aircraft never flew doesn't make the numbers "fantasy guess numbers".

I have seen said numbers be wildly off on designs from back then.  Would they have been for the Ta183?  I don't know. 

[Wmaker]

My point is that numbers doesn't need to be "guessed" or drawn out of a hat for the Ta183. Saying that the numbers would be "fantasy guess numbers" is just as false as saying that, if built, the aircraft would hit the said numbers with absolute certainty.

[fullmetalbullet]

wasnt a version of the Ta-183 built for the argentinian airforce after the war by FW. or was that just a false story?

[EVZ]

wasnt a version of the Ta-183 built for the argentinian airforce after the war by FW. or was that just a false story?

From one of my earlier posts:
What is known about the design comes from 2 sources  ...  Sweden received complete development info on the aircraft thru industry contacts. The info was used extensively in designing the 1st Swedish jet, the SAAB J 29 "Tunnan." -AND- plans were smuggled out by at least one German who made it to Argentina where the plane was actually produced as the FMA IAe 33 Pulqui II, after the war. It failed to be a commercial success for Argentina due to the fall of Juan Perone and the availability of CHEAP SURPLUS F-84s & F 86s after Korea.

[Butcher]

wasnt a version of the Ta-183 built for the argentinian airforce after the war by FW. or was that just a false story?

Kurt Tank left for Argentina after the war, and attempted to finish his projects like the Ta-183 - only problem was the lack of funds, because his projects were just to expensive, eventually things fell apart and his projects were canceled. Tank felled out of favor and Argentina pretty much decided on War Surplus F-86s which were far cheaper then finishing his 183 project.

This book : DESIGN FOR FLIGHT The Kurt Tank Story by Heinz Conradis is one of the most interesting books you can find about Tank, although I think very few exist - if you do find it don't pay $40 like I did (i dont feel bad its $60 now on amazon).

[Tilt]

He 162



It did fly, it did see some sort of combat.

Whilst not representative of WWII military aircraft it is closer to the spirit of AH2 than some of the fantasy stuff above........................ .........

[Butcher]

He 162

(Image removed from quote.)

It did fly, it did see some sort of combat.

Whilst not representative of WWII military aircraft it is closer to the spirit of AH2 than some of the fantasy stuff above........................ .........

I agree, as much as I would like a 1946 Arena, the biggest problem is choosing only aircraft that went into production - rather then prototypes, However really cool designs like the AD-1 Skyraider was just about to come into production when the war ended.

Still prop driven, it carried 4x 20mms and 8,000lbs of ords while only doing like 325mph at alt. Early Jets didn't have the thrust to carry heavy ords, and it pressed the Skyraider into combat in Korea and Vietnam.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWtMTCXOynM
Gives me a chance to play one of my favourite Youtube videos, an F4u-4 Starting up, as well as a Skyraider taxing in, listen to both engines - the Skyraider was total monster!

[Karnak]

If HTC decide to add stuff based on calculated numbers rather than fight test numbers that is up to them, but I would rather they did not.

The He162 meets the currently understood criteria for inclusion in AH.