Author Topic: Frame Rates with new build  (Read 1733 times)

Offline Skuzzy

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Re: Frame Rates with new build
« Reply #30 on: February 14, 2012, 08:42:17 AM »
Which 4800 series video card did you have before?  If it was a 4850, then you should know the 6950 may not be any faster and could be slower than the 4850, as the 2GB version of the 6950 has pretty slow video RAM.

If you do not have any of the new options checked, the only difference between this version and the last version is the additional plane and ground stuff which does take up more resources.  It would only impact a system which was on the very edge of using up all available resources.

You set the distance slider to 0.5 miles and go no gain in performance?  If that is the case, then you are looking at a video card which may be overwhelmed by the resolution you are asking it to run.  Or the CPU is just to busy to keep the video card running at full speed.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2012, 08:46:07 AM by Skuzzy »
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Offline doc1kelley

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Re: Frame Rates with new build
« Reply #31 on: February 14, 2012, 10:29:52 AM »
The first thing that stood out to me was this:

Current Mode: 1680 x 1050 (32 bit) (30Hz)
          Monitor: Generic PnP Monitor


At least one of your monitors is running at 30Hz, which is going to max the frame rate to 30.  That could be the culprit.

Your other monitor is running at the normal 59Hz that Vista and Windows 7 users see.



The first thing that stood out to me was your ATI HD 4800 series video card.  It can't handle much eye candy in this version of AH. 

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Offline TheRapier

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Re: Frame Rates with new build
« Reply #32 on: February 14, 2012, 07:07:24 PM »
Hmm, I'm not getting this. Your specs for running the game are:


Game Requirements
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Minimum                                                                          Recommended
Operating System
 
2000/XP/Vista/7                                                               2000/XP

CPU
 
1.8GHz Pentium 4                                                            2Ghz Intel Core 2, or faster

System RAM/Memory
 
512MB1                                                                          1GB1
 
Video Card
 
DirectX 9 compatible
with 64MB of RAM2                                                          DirectX 9 compatible
                                                                                      with 256MB of RAM
 
The specs imply that anything my computer does that is better than this gets me off of the bottom rung of detail. My computer spec BLOWS that recommended spec away so how the hell can I have a system that is on the very edge of using all available resources? My system:

CPU
Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Extreme CPU Q6850  @ 3.00GHz (4 CPUs), ~3.0GHz

4GB RAM

Vid Card with 2GB of RAM

What exactly do the specs mean? I thought the idea was that this would give folks a way to decide what to buy to try and run the game. It sounds like (and I don't want to put words in your mouth, I'm trying to understand this), that these specs are meaningless in trying to make these decisions. Where then do we turn to get this info so we can make good decisions about what to buy?

I'm guessing that most of the people here are similar to me. They don't have an unlimited well of money to throw at this, nor do they have unlimited amounts of time to spend researching every component in a system. Even if they did have the time to research it, the way that AH code handles things is a black box, there isn't way for a user to know how its handling its various tasks.

On the other hand, the information on what works and doesn't is all on the HTC side. You guys build the code and test it. You have a good idea of what systems are working and which ones aren't.   

I want to put this as gently as possible. From my view, telling me that the 6950 might not be faster than the 4850s I left doesn't help me AFTER I've spent the time and money. Where I'm going with this is that specs might need some updating. Additionally, when you have a game update like this last one, a list of recommended CPUs, vid and sound cards might also be good. You should have an idea of what is working and what is not by the time you get to release.

I can only speak for myself but once I've spent the money I can justify for playing a game like this and I still can't get to a playable level, then I'll leave. It's not a threat or bluster, its economics. That is the only rational way to deal with the problem. I can't buy a new computer everytime there is an update. There is no point in continuing to throw money at a problem where there is insufficient data to make decisions. This is a HOBBY, not my life. When I have time, I want to be playing and not researching and working on my computer. Right now I've spent two weeks of my spare time and buckets of money to move exactly no where.
--)-Rapier--
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They thought it would be a disgrace to go forth in a group.  Each entered the forest at a point that he had chosen where there was no path and where it was darkest. La Queste de St G

Offline FLS

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Re: Frame Rates with new build
« Reply #33 on: February 14, 2012, 08:45:52 PM »
What are you seeing for frame rates with one monitor?

Offline katanaso

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Re: Frame Rates with new build
« Reply #34 on: February 14, 2012, 09:57:47 PM »
Rapier,

What is your anti-aliasing setting?

If you installed ATI's Catalyst Control Center, check the Gaming/3D Application menu and see if "Use application settings" is checked.  If so, open AH and check the anti-aliasing settings in the game and make sure the slider is not all the way to the right. 

If "Use application settings" is not checked, what is the setting that you have?

Also, what are the rest of your settings in the Gaming/3D Application menu?

For comparison to your system, I have an E8400 processor overclocked to 3.8GHz, 8GB of RAM, and an ATI 5850 significantly overclocked, and allowing AH to run with full anti-aliasing is a resource hog that gives me terrible frame rates.  This is on one monitor, so I could imagine three monitors would be very taxing.

I'm hoping this is the cause of the problems for you. 
mir
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Offline Skuzzy

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Re: Frame Rates with new build
« Reply #35 on: February 15, 2012, 06:10:56 AM »
If you set the resolution to 1280x1024, I bet the game will run very well with most of the new options turned on.

You are asking more of your hardware than the hardware is probably capable of.  The specs to run the game do not take into account anyone trying to get thier hardware to run unreasonable resolutions for that specific hardware.

To run the three monitor resolution you want to run, you really should have opted for a 6970 video card.

There may be other things impeding the performance of your computer.  If the CPU activity of the computer is at 0 percent (task manager), when nothing is running, then you probably are getting what you can out of it.  Did you shutdown any unneccessary services in Windows 7?  Did you shut off the Aero desktop?

There are things you can do to get more performance out of your hardware, but there is not much that can be done when you are potentially asking the hardware to perform outside of its performance envelope.

=========================
I have a 4850 video card in my computer at home.  From Sapphire, it was overclocked.  It only has 512MB of video RAM.  My CPU is an E8400 Intel running at 3.6Ghz.  My OS is Windows XP.  I do not run the Catalyst Control Center.  Now, I probably have one of the cleanest running systems in the game, so it will typically run a bit better than another comparable system.

To start off, under Windows 7, with the Catalyst Control Center running and at default clock rates, another 4850 will run about 25% slower than mine system will, given the overhead of Windows 7, a default clock rate card, and running Catalyst Control Center.  I mention that as an attempt to give a performance base line.

In the game, I tested with all the options checked in Options->Graphic Detail->Advanced, with the shadow texture size set to 1024.  The sliders in Options->Graphic Details are all at the default location.  In the "Video Settings" I set one notch of anti-aliasing, the resolution to 1280x1024 and a Maximum Texture Size of 1024.  For the purposes of this test I disabled vertical sync.

Using the ndisles terrain and launching a P51D at field 7, my worst case frame rate was 64, while looking at the buildings on the field.  When looking anywhere else, it was above 85 and panning was smooth when changing views.

I really do not consider this playable as that frame rate would drop very quickly once in a crowd.  Basically I am asking too much of the video card.  I compared the specs of your 6950 against my 4850 and my 4850 is somewhat faster than your 6950.  Once you toss in the performance loss of your operating system and Catalyst Control Center, I really do not see how your video card is going to be able to run that three monitor resolution at playable frame rates.

When I disable all the options, except "Detailed Terrain", "Detailed Water", "Bump Mapping", and "Local Water reflections" and disable clutter in the Options->Graphic Detail panel, I get frame rates from 169 to 185 at the same location and looking from side to side.  Very playable.  This is almost exactly what I had with the previous version of the game.

If anyone is successfully running a three monitor configuration, using an ATI 6950, I would like to hear about it.
« Last Edit: February 15, 2012, 08:47:45 AM by Skuzzy »
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Offline FLS

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Re: Frame Rates with new build
« Reply #36 on: February 15, 2012, 08:56:50 AM »
It's surprising that the 4850 ran the same 3 monitors with a software triple screen but the 6950 chokes with a hardware triple screen. It seems like SoftTH handled the 30mhz refresh rate monitor better than AMD does.

Offline Skuzzy

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Re: Frame Rates with new build
« Reply #37 on: February 15, 2012, 08:59:33 AM »
The ATI/AMD triple screen support is mostly software, not hardware.  However, it should be more efficient than SoftTH.
« Last Edit: February 15, 2012, 09:03:22 AM by Skuzzy »
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Offline Noir

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Re: Frame Rates with new build
« Reply #38 on: February 22, 2012, 05:09:25 AM »
It is odd that numerous people including me lost performance over the patch 2 without enabling any bump mapping...all our systems can't be wrong.
now posting as SirNuke

Offline Skuzzy

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Re: Frame Rates with new build
« Reply #39 on: February 22, 2012, 05:43:09 AM »
Oh, it is always possible to lose some performance.  If any particular resource was near its edge, then any update containing a new shape/sounds/art could push it over causing some performance loss.

Also note, it will depend on what anti-xxxx software installed.  Please note, I said "installed".  Many of those programs cannot actually be disabled due to the way they are installed.  They just stop complaining about things when they are disabled.

So far, Kaspersky and AVG have been causing some issues, that I can confirm.

I can also state, not everyone lost performance.

Software is very consistent, in its own behavior.  It is the nature of the beast.  When it acts differently, from one computer to another, it is strictly due to various interactions with the different hardware and other software installed within the computer.
Roy "Skuzzy" Neese
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