Unbeatable pilot

[Midway]

I would like to fight/practice offline against an AI pilot that pushing the flight envelope to the max always in each aeroplane and therefore is unbeatable or highly likely to be unbeatable.

[matt]

+1

[ink]

I would like to fight/practice offline against an AI pilot that pushing the flight envelope to the max always in each aeroplane and therefore is unbeatable or highly likely to be unbeatable.

wont happen...offline AI are predictable, no way around that, practicing with off line AI will make you easier kill to a real live person.

so many people have told you, if you want to get better get out of the spit, get out of the hoards....stay off 200 and just fight.

[Wiley]

But...  It doesn't work that way.  The best sticks I've seen are only "pushing their plane to the limit" if they've made a mistake.  Being able to ride the edge of your plane's capability is swell when you have to do it, but being good means you aren't always pulling hard and riding the edge for that low percentage shot, instead you've set the guy up to be in front of your guns for a nice, easy pull and a short burst to obliterate him.

That's also nearly impossible to code in an AI.  AI can't adapt to what you're doing like a human can.

Additionally, if I recall correctly AI isn't bound by the flight models in this game.

Wiley.

[Ruah]

AI is good for gunnery - but you have st up the angles to make it feel more lifelike - there are a few offline missions I would practice in for gunnery and those were always very enjoyable - especially when going 1 v 5 or so to get a good sense for moves.

Overall though, AIs are just not going to compete with a real player - not without a huge budget and lot of coding - which is a total waste of time and energy.

good wish, but very much a wish

[ink]

But...  It doesn't work that way.  The best sticks I've seen are only "pushing their plane to the limit" if they've made a mistake.  Being able to ride the edge of your plane's capability is swell when you have to do it, but being good means you aren't always pulling hard and riding the edge for that low percentage shot, instead you've set the guy up to be in front of your guns for a nice, easy pull and a short burst to obliterate him.

That's also nearly impossible to code in an AI.  AI can't adapt to what you're doing like a human can.

Additionally, if I recall correctly AI isn't bound by the flight models in this game.

Wiley.

completely disagree....you don't get good enough to push your plane beyond, from doing it only when you "have to"

but then again what you consider "good" and what I consider "good" are most likely 2 different things.

[Debrody]

The New FPH
the one, the only, the unbeatable... wait, thats Sauron...  hehe
Chuck Norris shot down the AI...  in his dreams.

[Wiley]

completely disagree....you don't get good enough to push your plane beyond, from doing it only when you "have to"

but then again what you consider "good" and what I consider "good" are most likely 2 different things.

You and I get our fun from opposite ends of the spectrum, that's all.  I'm only TnBing on the deck in the middle of a group of enemy if I've messed up.  You go out and actively look for it.

I get the way you fight.  You go into a fight with the express intent of getting overwhelmed and taking as many of them as you can with you.  I've seen what you do, and think it's awesome.  I just don't find it fun because it carries with it the inevitability of death.

I more admire the guy that is aggressive but keeps alive in the pack of enemy, taking kills from the other side while giving himself the ability to survive the engagement as more come in.

Wiley.

[ink]

You and I get our fun from opposite ends of the spectrum, that's all.  I'm only TnBing on the deck in the middle of a group of enemy if I've messed up.  You go out and actively look for it.

I get the way you fight.  You go into a fight with the express intent of getting overwhelmed and taking as many of them as you can with you.  I've seen what you do, and think it's awesome.  I just don't find it fun because it carries with it the inevitability of death.

I more admire the guy that is aggressive but keeps alive in the pack of enemy, taking kills from the other side while giving himself the ability to survive the engagement as more come in.

Wiley.

staying fast and picking off furballs takes no skill except for Aiming and maybe SA to watch for hi cons....

I truly don't have issues with How one plays, except for vulchers...and the guy you just totally owned for him to run away and then come back and pick when you are engaged....

but I think you missed my point....unless you push your plane to and beyond its limits you will never be able to get down and dirty....with good results, if all you do is BnZ when it comes time to truly utilize your plane to kill someone who knows How to fight, you will be at a loss of what to do.

also its not that I expect to die every sortie, I am just working on my goal of being able to win a 20vs1 

I don't mean any disrespect to you...please don't take it that way.

[FLOTSOM]

this is actually very possible and when compared to the creation of an entire game a very simple feet to accomplish.

they have all that they need already in the game.....if you record the flights and fights of the top 5 fighter pilots in the game every month for an entire month then you are most likely going to have the majority of the best "if then" maneuvers and counter moves available and encoded already. you just assign them to an AI in the practice arena or off line and there is you practice fighter pilot.

most other games that are not MMO based already have this in the settings, when you check the box for easy medium or hard in the difficulty selection. its going to set you up against a me (easy) a Midway (medium) or a Grizz/Bruv (hard). if their pattern and habits are recorded already then the AI simply jumps from one maneuver to the next most logical maneuver depending upon the AI's difficulty settings and the instant environment.

[ink]

this is actually very possible and when compared to the creation of an entire game a very simple feet to accomplish.

they have all that they need already in the game.....if you record the flights and fights of the top 5 fighter pilots in the game every month for an entire month then you are most likely going to have the majority of the best "if then" maneuvers and counter moves available and encoded already. you just assign them to an AI in the practice arena or off line and there is you practice fighter pilot.

most other games that are not MMO based already have this in the settings, when you check the box for easy medium or hard in the difficulty selection. its going to set you up against a me (easy) a Midway (medium) or a Grizz/Bruv (hard). if their pattern and habits are recorded already then the AI simply jumps from one maneuver to the next most logical maneuver depending upon the AI's difficulty settings and the instant environment.

they still don't have the ability to change in mid stride....take Fighter Ace, I played against the AI for about a month before I could easily kill 40 planes and not one time would they even get close to me, on ACE level....AI does not have the ability to react or change tactics in mid stride.

[Flench]

Or just figh Bighorn , I don't think he can be beat . I for one don't know anyone that can beat him . I'm goig to start flying with him ntill I get as good as he is and get all his moves on video .

[Wiley]

but I think you missed my point....unless you push your plane to and beyond its limits you will never be able to get down and dirty....with good results, if all you do is BnZ when it comes time to truly utilize your plane to kill someone who knows How to fight, you will be at a loss of what to do.

Agreed.  The difference of opinion between us is simply on when to do it.  In fact, we're both really working toward the same thing:

I am just working on my goal of being able to win a 20vs1 

Yep.  It's just that you're working at it from the bottom of the attacking pile, I'm working at it from the top.

I don't mean any disrespect to you...please don't take it that way.

None taken at all.  I know there are playstyles that take more 'capability' and familiarity with your aircraft than what I do.  I am an unrepentant altmonkey, I like to think I'm a bit different from the average one you see in the main in that I won't run from a 1v1 at high alt, I will generally try to disengage from a 2v1 or higher if I'm able.  If I'm 'picking' you it's usually (not always) because you're coming in on a friendly who's lower than you.  Put another way, given a choice, I feed on the other side's pickers.

My point on the initial post was, you don't want to start off a fight pulling your plane to the edge of its capability generally speaking.  A smart pilot will conserve his E and have his way with you once you've spent all of yours pulling to maximum as you come around on him.

You're not ALWAYS pulling to the edge of your plane's capability when you're TnBing, you're pulling the correct amount to put you where you want to be, if that makes sense.

FLOTSOM's idea seems to make the most sense, but I know jack about AI coding.  They are all predictable in some fashion.

Wiley.

[FLOTSOM]

they still don't have the ability to change in mid stride....take Fighter Ace, I played against the AI for about a month before I could easily kill 40 planes and not one time would they even get close to me, on ACE level....AI does not have the ability to react or change tactics in mid stride.

its because the AI in fighter ace was only given 4 moves. now think if you gave that AI (which can and does react much faster and wthout the adrenaline flaws of a human) the skill set library to dra upon such as yours Grizz Bruv's ect ect.......the machine is only as smart as the programer allows it to be. if you record 100 hours of Bruv's (only in action) fights then how many possible manuvers and counter manuvers do you think your AI will have to draw upon the AI can read all the variables perfectly ever time and will never over/under estimate its or your E states. a human cannot consistantly beat an AI when the AI has complete programing of all possible variables. this was proven by the world chess masters back in the 80's. you cant think concentrate or react as fast as flawlessly or as consistantly as AI can.........inside of an AI world that is.

now in the real world the exact opposite is true, but AI cannot develope the seat of the pants feel that you can being made of flesh and blood.

[waystin2]

A Chuck Norris pilot.  Me likey...