Oscar

[Ack-Ack]

First off, the plane matters. Pilot skill being equal, the plane will determin the fight.

Pilots being equal, the one that makes the first mistake will determine the outcome of the fight.

ack-ack

[Tank-Ace]

Pilots being equal, the one that makes the first mistake will determine the outcome of the fight.

ack-ack

Arguable. Not all mistakes are fatal, and the second one to make a mistake could screw up even worse.

However, a better preforming plane gives the pilot a better chance than if he were in a worse plane, regardless of who makes the first mistake. The Ki-43 is much more able to recover from a mistake than the Ki-61 is. Same with the P-40N compared to the P-40C. Or the Bf 109K compared to the E, or even the G2.


Either way, the point is that preformance is not irrelvent in a fight, as High-Tone was implying.

[Debrody]

Whats right in Tank-ace's post:
flying it against literally any other aircraft would be very simple: come with altitude, dont let him escape, force him to turn and then you only have to copy your opponents moves, the plane is winning the fight for you. Just like a zeek, but the weak guns would make your job real hard (the opponet might dive away, you have to catch him on the deck, etc)
In the other hand, in a ki43 vs ki43 1v1...  now that would be crazy. Even the spit9s are a bit uncomfortable for me as the action is happening sooo freakin fast... now imagine this aircraft. Wild, isnt it? : )
One awesome KOTH ride too.

Ack-ack: in my experience, given a fight between totally equally skilled pilots, the plane is the main deciding factor is the plane. Then who is still cold, who is warmed up, who is tired, theese are deciding who has the more chance to gain some profit from the opponent's mistake. Still, in an extreme case, in a spit16 vs p47D match, the spit pilot can do many mistakes and still win easily against a nearly perfectly flown jug... Sometimes the tiredness-factor can overtake the plane choice tho... ask IrishOne haha  

[Butcher]

Arguable. Not all mistakes are fatal, and the second one to make a mistake could screw up even worse.

However, a better preforming plane gives the pilot a better chance than if he were in a worse plane, regardless of who makes the first mistake. The Ki-43 is much more able to recover from a mistake than the Ki-61 is. Same with the P-40N compared to the P-40C. Or the Bf 109K compared to the E, or even the G2.

Either way, the point is that preformance is not irrelvent in a fight, as High-Tone was implying.

If two equal pilots fly a P51-D and one makes a mistake the other can't run/recover from being killed, only Drastic performance can change that - a 109E vs P51D a P51D can run away, leaving a veteran in the dust.

Pilot skill always wins over performance.

[Vinkman]

It is not slower than the A6M and the A6M, other than the 2, is not the best turning fighter in AH.

The Ki-43-III would do about 365mph at best altitude, 10-15mph faster than the A6M5b, while still out turning the Hurricane Mk I and Brewster B239.

The addition of the fowler flaps is another difference between the Ki-43 and A6M.  The Ki-43's power to weight ratio should also be better.

I don't believe the speed diffrences you mentioned make any difference to my analysis. 

[Wmaker]

Additionally the wing area will increase when the Fowlers are deployed in the Ki-43 and not with anything else on that list. Are the flap deployment speeds known?

Yep, rest of the fighters listed have split flaps.

[W7LPNRICK]

Or maybe an Me-410 in 2 weeks...

[HighTone]

Arguable. Not all mistakes are fatal, and the second one to make a mistake could screw up even worse.

However, a better preforming plane gives the pilot a better chance than if he were in a worse plane, regardless of who makes the first mistake. The Ki-43 is much more able to recover from a mistake than the Ki-61 is. Same with the P-40N compared to the P-40C. Or the Bf 109K compared to the E, or even the G2.


Either way, the point is that preformance is not irrelvent in a fight, as High-Tone was implying.

The pilot that used his plane to the best of its ability, mistake free will win the fight 90% of the time regardless of the planes performance. And really the Ki43 would be more able to recover from a mistake than a Ki61? When was the last time you have taken up a Ki61? It's faster, dives better, has pilot armor and self sealing fuel tanks and is much more able to recover from a bad pilot move than the Ki43 would ever be able to do. Your lack of understanding of these aircraft is clouding your thoughts.

When you do start subscribing to AH again, I challenge you to a fight. I'll take the D3A and you can take any plane with a prop. I will show you then how a pilots tactics and decision making plays more into the out come of the fight than your planes on paper stats.

[Torquila]

H-tone, I dont suppose your judging the possible outcome on some random lucky occurances in the MA where your d3a seemed to take advantage of "skill" instead of the sheer laughability and novelty of it, are you?

Its usually best not to confuse the two....

[Karnak]

H-tone, I dont suppose your judging the possible outcome on some random lucky occurances in the MA where your d3a seemed to take advantage of "skill" instead of the sheer laughability and novelty of it, are you?

Its usually best not to confuse the two....

Lack of skill can cause a P-47N to lose to a D3A1.

[Torquila]

LIES< CAKE< UND MOAR LIES!!

lulz

[Torquila]

PS: Lack of skill could also make the p47 crash on take off; if that fits the requirements here. ZOMG 

[Wmaker]

Also, the Ki-43-III could do about 365, which isn't that much slower than the Ki-61.

Do you remember any source which listed this speed? Sounds rather optimistic IMO.

Francillon lists 358mph @ ~22k (which is pretty good in itself). And Aero Detail #29 on Ki-43 mentions 345mph.

As a general note from various sources, Zeke was the faster aircraft until Ki-43 caught it or almost caught it up with the -III variant.

[Karnak]

PS: Lack of skill could also make the p47 crash on take off; if that fits the requirements here. ZOMG  

No, there is a skill threshold between crashing on its own and still lacking the skill needed to not get shot down by said D3A1.

The P-47N in question dove down onto me, I avoided his attack, and proceeded to do a descending spiral turn to the deck with me on his tail the whole way.  We did a 720 or 1080 degree turn on the deck with me pecking away at him when he decided to make a run for it and leveled out.  I shot his elevators off while he started to pull away from me.  Once he lost his elevators he was no longer able to avoid, as he had shown he had the skill to do before, the collision with the ground.

That was a pure lack of skill on the part of the P-47N's pilot that caused it to lose a fight with a D3A1.



wmaker,

The 365 was from memory.  I was likely thinking of the 358 number for the -III.  I agree that the A6M2 was faster than the -I and the A6M3 likely faster than the -II.

[Torquila]

I disagree; there is *no* thresh-hold of skill; just as there is no thresh-hold in a plane's ability and capability; as what is claimed here.

You got lucky, like a camel pilot who found a 262 taxi'ing on the runway.

Pretty much sums it up.