410 Rounds disapere

[bustr]

Someone like Lusche, Krusty, Karnak, Morefeind or Hitech would have that answer.

[Krusty]

As they should.

They will disappear closer than some rounds, and further away than others.

All rounds disappear after the same time, but they don't all fly the same distance.  Cannon rounds will generally disappear at a shorter range than MG's.  It depends on velocity.

Not exactly... Most disappear over 1000 yards. The Mk103 had a significantly higher muzzle velocity than MG151/20 or Mk108. It has a very fast, very flat, trajectory. If anything this type of round should persist in-game longer than other rounds. Similar to the 37mm rounds.

I seem to recall HTC has said it is distance-based, and not time-based, though. Smaller rounds up to 20mm or mk108 30mm go up to 1.2k or whatever, and 37mm are longer, 40mm longer still, 50mm longer, 75mm longer, etc...

[chris3]

moin

however, the mk103 round disapear way to early for a 30mm round.

cu christian

[Scherf]

Yeah, they do indeed disappear over 1000 yards, 50 cals seem to go longer?

[mtnman]

Yeah, they do indeed disappear over 1000 yards, 50 cals seem to go longer?

Yes (they travel faster so fly further before they "time out").

[Scherf]

That's bass-ackwards for the Me 410, according to the original handbooks anyway. The 13mms have the worst ballistics for any of the ammo listed - the 131s are as good as useless past 500m.

[Scherf]

OK, just had a quick look, I was wrong, the cannon (not sure which ones, though I assume it's both) do hit at 1000, the 131s not.

The point remains though, the 103s have better ballistics than the 20mms, they should be hitting further out.

Would also be interested in seeing how the cannon compare for velocity to the US 50 cals of WWII, which as I know to my cost are lethal out past 1000 yds in AH.

[Scherf]

I mentioned above some tables from the 410 manuals, thought it might be worthwhile to include, shows a variety of weapons.







If I'm reading this right, the LW reckoned the BK 5 would be right on the gunsight dot at 900m, the 103s and 20mms at 800, despite the 103s being located nearly 60 cms below the 20mms in the aircraft.

Bustr, in your experience, is it possible to replicate similar charts in AH? What I mean is, in the hangar, should I set convergence for the 103s to 200 y190 meters or so, in the expectation that the shells will come back down again onto the pipper at 800m as predicted? Same for the BK 5 - shall I set convergence to 210 meters, or to 650 yards(as that's the longest which AH allows)?

Some interesting little notes in the charts. One of them says the dispersion charts aren't presented as the weapons are located so close together - a spread of 1.2 can be reckoned with at all ranges!

I wants. Now if only I can master the stall...

[Denniss]

Something to note: bothe the Me 410 A-1/U4 (5cm gun) and B-2/U1 (2x MK 103) are referring to the 15mm version of the MG 151, not the 2cm version. The image 15b, noting the Geschoßflugbahn MG 151/20, is obviously an error as all other tables talk about the 15mm version.

I remember reading another manual which was stating the MG 151/20 rounds crossed the line of vision at 550m.

[Charge]

If you mean that the manual only mentions "MG151" it does not mean a 15mm version but merely that both of that type could be fitted, 15 or 20mm type.

-C+

[icepac]

I can hit the target at d1310 with the mk103.

[titanic3]

Film? Or even easier...screenshot? Not doubting, just curious. Like your story of 1K+ NS-37s shots. Again, not starting a war, just curious since I don't think I ever saw film or screenshot of it. (I probably missed it).

[icepac]

It would surely take less time for you to test it yourself........which will only confirm what I said earlier.

While you're at it, test the ns37 as well and spare the forums this kind of bs.

[titanic3]

I don't think I'm good enough.  Can you show it for me? Pretty please. 

[bustr]

Target is at 940 yards because past that 20mm are absorbed. You will notice that the MG151\20 hits 40 feet below the MK103 and 20 feet below the MG131 13mm.

This is why I beleive for stand off shooting at bombers using the ZFR4 telescope gunsight at 1000 yards only the MK103 was fired just like the BK5. Otherwise there was no reason in the armerors manual to specify the ZFR4 as the gunsight to be mounted along with the exact same weapons selector switch SZKK4 for both weapons packages.

The MK103 patterns at 1000 yards about the same places as in these screen captures with about a 30ft dispersion. The real dispersion was about 30ft at 1000m for the MK103 and 60ft at 900m for the MG151\20. You cannot make the MG151\20 pattern with the MK103 much past 650 yards becasue the MG151\20 slows down and drops off due to the following from bench firing tests at Rechlin.

MG131\13 -- 750m\sec
MG151\20 -- 720m\sec
MK103\30 -- 860m\sec

Gun -----------600m-----700m-----800m------900m---drop at distance
MG131\13----1.92m-----3.05m-----4.56m-----6.55m(21.4ft)
MG151\20----5.02m-----7.85m----11.20m---14.06m(46.1ft)<---this is why the MK103 was fired like the BK5.
MK103\30----3.03m-----4.27m-----5.79m-----7.62m(25ft)

Each Ring on the Target is 10ft wide.

30mm - 150 conv, 13mm and 20mm - 650 converg.





30mm - 325 conv, 13mm and 20mm - 650 converg.





30mm - 650 conv, 13mm and 20mm - 650 converg.