Firebird

[CAP1]

Still puts out a nice 200hp. Like I said, I'm not interested in it for the performance so much as for the styling.

200hp??  the newer/better camaros and mustangs top that easily.......

[JOACH1M]

Still puts out a nice 200hp. Like I said, I'm not interested in it for the performance so much as for the styling.

I don't really understand this.

*This isn't directed at you, just everyone that does this*


I don't understand why people would by the cheapest model camaro, mustang, vet or any other type of car of that sort just to say they have a car that sounds cool. I see people with 3.5 liter chargers decking them out with every aftermarket part they can imagine...I don't get it! Buy the SRT or even R/T go big or go home. I also know people who buy the v6 mustang going around town saying they got a mustang and that makes them a badass.

[eagl]

200hp??  the newer/better camaros and mustangs top that easily.......

Yea, but kudos to him for trying to keep a realistic price cap on the whole thing.  Yea he could find some nicer more expensive car to go into debt for, but then he'd be trapped in the American debt nightmare instead of rolling in a nice looking "classic" set of wheels.

My parents never had a car loan and I'm very fortunate I followed their example for the most part.  I know 40 yr olds making 6 figures who still have a car loan and almost no retirement savings.  Car-poor is a dumb way to live and once you start down that road it's hard to get out.  But avoiding it in the first place can be done early and in only a few years.  Get a beater hoopty to start, and then save CASH for each upgrade.  Do that for a few iterations and next thing you know you're paying cash for a new vette or whatever turns yer crank.  That's the way to do it, own a series of nice cars without worrying one second about payments and getting way ahead on financing your entire life.

On the other hand... yea, the newer V6s are putting out around 300hp.

The kid that bought my trans-am...  That made me really happy.  The kid was a year or two out of high school working his first or second job, and his Dad was going to help him buy his first "new" car.  He happened to LOVE the 98-02 trans-am look, and after shopping around he found mine.  Because he had a job and his Dad was helping, he probably could have made payments on a new mustang or ricer but he was both sensible about his expectations and also loved the older car styling.  Good decision for him, that car is fast as heck, reliable, and he dynoed it about 40hp above expectations so it may have been one of a handful of early 98 firebirds and camaros that took vette motors out of the factory due to a shortage of f-body detuned LS1s.  He got the car he loved because he insisted on paying cash instead of a loan, and didn't insist on getting the latest whatever.

Made me feel good about the sale even though I REALLY hated selling that car.

[CAP1]

Yea, but kudos to him for trying to keep a realistic price cap on the whole thing.  Yea he could find some nicer more expensive car to go into debt for, but then he'd be trapped in the American debt nightmare instead of rolling in a nice looking "classic" set of wheels.

My parents never had a car loan and I'm very fortunate I followed their example for the most part.  I know 40 yr olds making 6 figures who still have a car loan and almost no retirement savings.  Car-poor is a dumb way to live and once you start down that road it's hard to get out.  But avoiding it in the first place can be done early and in only a few years.  Get a beater hoopty to start, and then save CASH for each upgrade.  Do that for a few iterations and next thing you know you're paying cash for a new vette or whatever turns yer crank.  That's the way to do it, own a series of nice cars without worrying one second about payments and getting way ahead on financing your entire life.

On the other hand... yea, the newer V6s are putting out around 300hp.

The kid that bought my trans-am...  That made me really happy.  The kid was a year or two out of high school working his first or second job, and his Dad was going to help him buy his first "new" car.  He happened to LOVE the 98-02 trans-am look, and after shopping around he found mine.  Because he had a job and his Dad was helping, he probably could have made payments on a new mustang or ricer but he was both sensible about his expectations and also loved the older car styling.  Good decision for him, that car is fast as heck, reliable, and he dynoed it about 40hp above expectations so it may have been one of a handful of early 98 firebirds and camaros that took vette motors out of the factory due to a shortage of f-body detuned LS1s.  He got the car he loved because he insisted on paying cash instead of a loan, and didn't insist on getting the latest whatever.

Made me feel good about the sale even though I REALLY hated selling that car.

 in my instance, i could've paid cash for my stang......i chose the payments, due to stupidly low interest, and not as much of a savings for cash as i would have expected....so in this instance, payments lets me keep my cash in hand.

 i understand what you're saying though about keeping expectations realistic though.

[Seanaldinho]

Ugly if you ask me 

To smooth no real lines to the car.

[Shuffler]

i pay more than any of you guys mentioned.....but i'm insuring 3 vehicles, one of which has full coverage.....and i live in prnj

I have 8 vehicles insured... full coverage

[eagl]

Ugly if you ask me 

To smooth no real lines to the car.

I personally liked the chopped nose of the '98 and later firebird, but lots of people love the older lines too.  If he can find one that is still in good shape it will probably remain reliable too.

[CAP1]

I have 8 vehicles insured... full coverage

 i don't make the kinda money you make. i;m thinking i;m gonna have to take the dakota or jeep off of the policy in order to insure my rollback........

[Tank-Ace]

I don't really understand this.

*This isn't directed at you, just everyone that does this*


I don't understand why people would by the cheapest model camaro, mustang, vet or any other type of car of that sort just to say they have a car that sounds cool. I see people with 3.5 liter chargers decking them out with every aftermarket part they can imagine...I don't get it! Buy the SRT or even R/T go big or go home. I also know people who buy the v6 mustang going around town saying they got a mustang and that makes them a badass.

Don't get me wrong, if I could get one with the Camaro's V8 for a decent price and afford the insurance, I'd buy it without hesitation. But as it is, I could get a nice looking car that captures the feel and styling of the sport car, and retains decent performance without having enough to let me be overly stupid with it. And frankly, I'd probably get in trouble for peeling out in the school parking lot the first week.

[Golfer]

I don't really understand this.

*This isn't directed at you, just everyone that does this*


I don't understand why people would by the cheapest model camaro, mustang, vet or any other type of car of that sort just to say they have a car that sounds cool. I see people with 3.5 liter chargers decking them out with every aftermarket part they can imagine...I don't get it! Buy the SRT or even R/T go big or go home. I also know people who buy the v6 mustang going around town saying they got a mustang and that makes them a badass.

Well maybe his parents aren't buying it for him.

Nothing wrong with a V6 Firebird when you're in a *RED ALERT* insurance group. When kids are having monthly insurance payments higher than my car payment I can empathize. My first car was a 4 cylinder Grand Am that still went 115 before the governor kicked in. It was cheap to insure, cheap to feed and had room for 5, golf clubs and 2 Rockford Fosgate 15" subwoofers in the back because that was what was important then.  Nevermind I don't think a kid should have access to 300 real wheel drive horsepower without some experience first.

At any rate I have a '12 Mustang.  It's a V6 for a very good reason and it's not because I couldn't afford a GT, Boss 302 or GT500. Actually Caps car and mine weren't that far off in price. Know why?  I wanted a convertible and I wanted to race. The GTs are too fast to race as convertibles, the GT500s are way too fast to race as convertibles and the Boss 302 rightfully so doesn't come as a convertible which doesn't mean much because it would be too fast to race as a convertible. Without cutting up the brand new interior and putting in a roll bar, anyway. Girls aren't really that crazy about roll bars or caged street cars I've found. Now the fuel economy is nice as is the insurance. $55/mo for full coverage. Only $5 more than my truck. First year the car saw 22,500 miles at a year average 25.4 mpg which included 200 passes down the drag strip.

My problem now is a stick car isn't consistent as a bracket race car, at least consistent enough to go rounds against guys putting together <.020 packages. That's what the Corvette is for once I get it off the jack stands and finish the LS6 swap. Even it has a T-Top and will run 11.50 in the heat of summer so no roll bar required. It ran yesterday and all the stuff that's supposed to stay in the car stayed in the car which is progress.

If you want a cheap street car buy a driver late run C3 (78-82) Corvette. They don't have any factory power, 190-200hp and the fuel economy sucks. They're at least easy to work on and parts are cheap. This one drove on and off the trailer for $4,000. You could brag about how you have a V8 on the interwebs though and run a 16 second 1/4 mile.

[jimbo71]

I had a 2000 model Firebird.  Suspension was done by Lotus.  Was really fun to drive through the hills of TN.  My only real gripe about the car was that the nose sat so close to the ground that when either pulling off the road into a parking lot or driveway (or vise versa) the nose would scrape the pavement on the left or right corners scraping the paint.

Not sure if the '95 model sits that low in the front or not. 

Only drove the car for 9 months when a couple of 18 year olds slid through a curve on a wet road sideways and knocked the front end off it. 


Instead of buying a sporty car again, I opted for a 2000 Toyota 4Runner.  Still driving it and can honestly say it's been the best vehicle I've ever owned.  Front of the owners manual says "This is not a sports car so don't drive it like one"  LOL

[The Fugitive]

I don't really understand this.

*This isn't directed at you, just everyone that does this*


I don't understand why people would by the cheapest model camaro, mustang, vet or any other type of car of that sort just to say they have a car that sounds cool. I see people with 3.5 liter chargers decking them out with every aftermarket part they can imagine...I don't get it! Buy the SRT or even R/T go big or go home. I also know people who buy the v6 mustang going around town saying they got a mustang and that makes them a badass.

That's the difference between a middle class car guy, and a rich one 

I'm 54. For most of my life I couldn't afford the corvette I wanted (always the bestest newest one they had  ) I finally realized that I don't have to have the biggest baddest vette on the road, and if I buy an older one that I like I would STILL be in a vette.

Guess whos working on finally getting his vette?   

[CAP1]

That's the difference between a middle class car guy, and a rich one 

I'm 54. For most of my life I couldn't afford the corvette I wanted (always the bestest newest one they had  ) I finally realized that I don't have to have the biggest baddest vette on the road, and if I buy an older one that I like I would STILL be in a vette.

Guess whos working on finally getting his vette?   

WTG dude!! you darn well better post pics for us!! 

[Gman]

Eagl what tires were on your car?  I had a 97 and a 2002.  The 97 was a Ws6 Firebird with 275/40s on 17 inch rims that were Z rated from the factory and I tried to drive it in winter once.  And only once.  We get 6 months of winter driving up here, and it was impossible to even get it to move on any ice or snow covered surface with those tires on it.  As in it took me 20 minutes to move it from its regular spot on my parking pad into my garage once the snow flew that one time I considered trying it, and that was only about 70 yards.  I remember my wife at the time and I sitting in it laughing to the point of tears as it would just barely move no matter what tricks you tried with the clutch/throttle etc. It was literally like driving on four hockey pucks.  Just let the clutch out, and the back tires would just slowly spin, and give you the slightest movement forward, about turtle crawling speed at best.  Turning the front tires had almost negligible effect on direction.  

I know the Ws6 and SS models had the lower profile 275/40 performance z/speed rated tires on them, but the other V8 models didn't.  Those tires on the other non ws6 models had to have been set up for all season driving, as the tires on mine were literally suicide for any snow/ice at all.

  I never tried it with the 2002, which yes, had TCS unlike the 97 I believe, but I can't remember the tires on the 2002.  Did you have all seasons of some kind on yours?  


As for the OP, get the Firebird, they are a great first car.  If gas isn't a huge issue, get a V8 one as well, but the v6 still are a nice looking car, although like others has said, don't have the 300 hp of the modern V6 in the Camaro.  Heck, the regular Firebird V8 didn't have 300 hp in the 93-97 models as I recall, I think it was 275.  The ws6/ss had more, especially the 98-02 models, but not a lot more.

[eagl]

The OEM eagle RS-As were actually pretty good in '98.  Those tires were "good" for about 30,000 miles and had legal tread until about 40,000 miles but were pretty darn hard and had lost a lot of wet and dry traction.  I got some bridgestone potenza pole position (or something like that) that were ok for about 10,000 miles but then developed a very strange wear pattern and then every time I used the brakes it felt like my brakes were grinding or something bad was happening up front.  I even bought and installed new front rotors and pads based on that, to no effect.  Those tires were OK in light snow though, including that trip to Vail.  Those tires also got very hard after only 20,000 miles and started to lose dry traction.  After I replaced those tires, the front grinding sound/vibration went away completely.

My next tires were Goodyear Eagle F1-GS-D3 summer/rain tires, which were extremely aggressive continuous swoopy tread pattern tires, sort of like continuous army enlisted chevron rank.  Those tires were awesome in the rain and dry and dangerous in any amount of snow/ice.

The next set of tires were (if I recall correctly) bridgestone RE 960AS tires, which were very very nice all-season tires.  The only fault with them is that in the summer they would flat-spot a bit if the car was left more than overnight, so the car would shimmy a bit for the first few miles the next time it was driven as the flat spot worked itself out.

My G8 has OEM RS-A tires and this time they are awful.  Bad dry, wet, and snow traction.  Nothing at all to recommend them except they were on the car when I drove it off the lot.  I'm looking for any excuse to replace them, except that they are currently balanced PERFECTLY which solved a problem inherent in some G8s, bad front-end shimmy and horrible steering wheel wobble.  The wobble is currently very small so I'm hesitant to change anything at all.  Even a few PSI pressure change in the front tires makes it come back.  So I'm going to use these tires until they either cord out or the wobble comes back, and then I'll have to find some nice all-season or touring tires for the G8.