Stick stirring

[bustr]

My statement has nothing to do with flight sim vs game. The post has to do with what are you trying to simulate, do you wish to simulate what people did in the war, or what the machinery they used can do.

HiTech

If the physical equipment back then was capable of performing in every moment as we use the simulated equipment today in the game. What would have happened to those equipment and the pilots performing our game actions back then?

[ToeTag]

If the physical equipment back then was capable of performing in every moment as we use the simulated equipment today in the game. What would have happened to those equipment and the pilots performing our game actions back then?

I'm confused by this...but I think I get it...The equipment was capable of the manurevers, but were the pilots? ( I meant to spell it that way)

[kvuo75]

just push -1g barrel roll.  you'll win every fight. 

[Butcher]

I've seen enough aerobatic pilots throw a plane around, what happens in aces high is a pilots last ditch effort to stay alive other then that I see nothing usual that would show its unrealistic.

once you understand the stick stirring, you can realize two things - if a pilot is to low of speed - simply reverse and climb, he cannot match this - someone like ghi waits on the deck in a hurri-2c for you to overshoot then he takes your wing off. If you reverse quickly and reset the fight, you can slow down to where the negative G dive is useless, you can line up if not straddle.

If someone is high speed, you wait until they are completely upside down trying to stick stir, and then reverse,  once then nose down and head upwards, simply climb shallow and dive down again - you still end up on their six.

Stick stirring will work if you are to close and didn't take the shot, to fast to actually have time to respond to the move - however if you are far enough away and the person pulls it to quick - you have enough time to react, and adapt.

[pervert]

Lets be clear what I actually mean here is the plane turning into a flickbook, like its moving at 1 frame per second ie exploiting the fact the internet is a connection to us. If I can see whats happening in real time its not really a problem, having a guy jerking his stick up and down and then ramming me and flying off is a problem.

[hitech]

Lets be clear what I actually mean here is the plane turning into a flickbook, like its moving at 1 frame per second ie exploiting the fact the internet is a connection to us. If I can see whats happening in real time its not really a problem, having a guy jerking his stick up and down and then ramming me and flying off is a problem.

I do not understand your reference to 1 frame a second? And what does stick stirring (which no one seems to really have tested what other people see yet) have to do with collisions?

HiTech

[Butcher]

I do not understand your reference to 1 frame a second? And what does stick stirring (which no one seems to really have tested what other people see yet) have to do with collisions?

HiTech

I have an idea what he's talking about, every time someone just flips their aircraft all over the sky and you ram into the person, he usually ends up without any damage at all (I know I've had this happen 3 times with PanosGR) 3 times in a row I had absolutely no damage done why he flies away usually hurt pretty good.

I Can't explain it, but each time he'd dive in and I would start jynxing at 800 out, he would ram from behind and I'd just get a collision message but no actual damage on my part, him however - first time he lost a wing, second time he lost his radiator last time was an oil hit, .
Each time he rammed from behind, I flew away with no damage what so ever, him however I think he bailed twice in that situation.

Ironic part we were not testing anything, it just was unfortunate that it happened to us 3 separate times.

[hitech]

I have an idea what he's talking about, every time someone just flips their aircraft all over the sky and you ram into the person, he usually ends up without any damage at all (I know I've had this happen 3 times with PanosGR) 3 times in a row I had absolutely no damage done why he flies away usually hurt pretty good.

I Can't explain it, but each time he'd dive in and I would start jynxing at 800 out, he would ram from behind and I'd just get a collision message but no actual damage on my part, him however - first time he lost a wing, second time he lost his radiator last time was an oil hit, .
Each time he rammed from behind, I flew away with no damage what so ever, him however I think he bailed twice in that situation.

Ironic part we were not testing anything, it just was unfortunate that it happened to us 3 separate times.

But what does that have to does with the 1 sec reference? And if you are hit from behind you will never suffer a collision simply because at collision time on the plane following , the lead plane will see the colliding plane well behind him. Is just the Nature of time lag and nothing to do with stick stirring.

HiTech

[pervert]

I do not understand your reference to 1 frame a second? And what does stick stirring (which no one seems to really have tested what other people see yet) have to do with collisions?

HiTech

I would guess its to do with the smoothing code trying to predict what the stick stirring plane is doing, the plane in this case the other night is a spitfire flying normally, I open fire at 600 he jams the stick back seems to stay motionless for a split second then his plane is pointing straight up then straight down with no movement in between then like it was at 1 frame per second, collision, hes beside me coming up now, my wings off, spit flys off un hurt.

Another thing while I understand collisions I do not understand why both planes don't hit the dirt from a collision, much like people will run for miles to avoid dying in this game you might find that if everyone understands a collision is fatal to both aircraft they would avoid it like the plague. For some reason you seem in this game to get punished for trying to avoid a collision, I went down 3 times last few nights to guys in better turning planes attempting to turn nose to nose for a HO, spotting what was going to happen I pull up and away from the collision bang we hit I go down he does not.

[Butcher]

And if you are hit from behind you will never suffer a collision simply because at collision time on the plane following , the lead plane will see the colliding plane well behind him. Is just the Nature of time lag and nothing to do with stick stirring.

HiTech

Ahh this makes sense, thanks. I honestly have no idea how the collision coad works and don't want to figure it out, I just know if someone rams me from behind im pretty safe vs if I hit them

[LilMak]

Stick stirring only buys you a couple seconds. If you don't have a friendly to bail you out, you're wasting E and going to die anyway.

On the collision issue. I receive damage all the time from guys riding up my butt and missing with their guns. The collision model is my biggest gripe about the game. I have a reasonable understanding of lag but I still don't understand why it can't be coaded that a collision only occurs when both FE see it.

[Karnak]

Another thing while I understand collisions I do not understand why both planes don't hit the dirt from a collision, much like people will run for miles to avoid dying in this game you might find that if everyone understands a collision is fatal to both aircraft they would avoid it like the plague. For some reason you seem in this game to get punished for trying to avoid a collision, I went down 3 times last few nights to guys in better turning planes attempting to turn nose to nose for a HO, spotting what was going to happen I pull up and away from the collision bang we hit I go down he does not.

You clearly do not understand collisions.

[hitech]

On the collision issue. I receive damage all the time from guys riding up my butt and missing with their guns. The collision model is my biggest gripe about the game. I have a reasonable understanding of lag but I still don't understand why it can't be coaded that a collision only occurs when both FE see it.

Then you do not have a reasonable understanding of lag and collisions. What you really are asking for (And I am not overstating this) is that any time you are approaching a plane from the rear or top you can keep guns firing as you fly right threw the center of your target airplane, with no need to worry about a collision.

Because it is impossible for 2 planes to see a collision when the are on a parallel course. As example if you have 2 computers side by side, and both see themselves pass a tree at the same time. Both will see the other plane on their computer pass that tree at a later time.  I.E. both planes will see the other plane behind them. So when ever you hit a plane when making a pass from the rear, the other player is seeing you pass well behind him.

HiTech

HiTEch

[hitech]

For some reason you seem in this game to get punished for trying to avoid a collision.

This is 100% opposite of how things really work. You are rewarded for avoiding a collision, no ifs and's or buts. If you avoide a collision you will NEVER EVER threw time immortal be punished ,take damage from a collisions.

And your once again, your request for both taking damage would have the exact opposite effect , what you believe.

People would not try to avoid collisions more, they would avoid them less. Now if you avoid a collision you will not ever take damage, with what YOU ask if you avoid a collision and the other guy doesn't you will take damage. So you are punished by not having the last seconds of shooting if you avoide the collision where the other guy is not. So on a merge what is your choice if you  try to avoid and he doesn't you collide, hence almost everyone's response would be, now there is NOTHING I can do to avoid a collision if the other guy wants to collide with me, therefor I might as well collide with him also.

HiTech

HiTech

[pervert]

This is 100% opposite of how things really work. You are rewarded for avoiding a collision, no ifs and's or buts. If you avoide a collision you will NEVER EVER threw time immortal be punished ,take damage from a collisions.

And your once again, your request for both taking damage would have the exact opposite effect , what you believe.

People would not try to avoid collisions more, they would avoid them less. Now if you avoid a collision you will not ever take damage, with what YOU ask if you avoid a collision and the other guy doesn't you will take damage. So you are punished by not having the last seconds of shooting if you avoide the collision where the other guy is not. So on a merge what is your choice if you  try to avoid and he doesn't you collide, hence almost everyone's response would be, now there is NOTHING I can do to avoid a collision if the other guy wants to collide with me, therefor I might as well collide with him also.

HiTech

HiTech

I disagree completely, its like guys who HO the minute they see you start to HO them back they start ducking, people will go extreme lengths in this game to avoid any danger to themselves or even combat.

The collisions I experience are not on the first merge, the situation would be lets say a brewster and me diving on him, he turns into the attack every time, every time I try and pull up and away and we collide he flys off with a lollypop and I lose a wing. Perhaps its because I am going faster? I certainly cannot turn nose to nose with a brewster in a d9. So basically I have gun solution and the slower better turning plane turns nose to nose for a HO every time I go down.