Updated Ordnance System

[Krusty]

Back to actual topic -
I think for historical reasons - if the C.205 cannot get a drop tank in Aces high even though it was available and simply not used

Actually the C.202s operating from a certain region had a general order signed allowing the use of drop tanks due to the range of their missions. Since the C.205 was integrated into C.202 units there's no real reason the DT isn't available in-game.

We're not talking some experimental weapons system here. We're not talking 20mms on a P-40, or 20mm gondolas on a P-47. We're talking weapons that were used in combat in this thread, on combat tested hardpoints.


P.S. Drop tanks weigh MORE than bombs. You're not OVERLOADING it with 3 bombs. You're loading it less than the DT/bomb combo, even.

[Butcher]

We don't have photographic evidence of the D model jugs carrying 2500lbs of bombs, and 10 HVAR rockets. But apparently a manual says it could therefore it did?

So, a friendly word of advice son, you might wanna get your story strait before your open your mouth.

   
Re: Fiat G.55/l
« Reply #42 on: June 28, 2012, 11:22:24 PM »
Quote
Quote from: Tank-Ace on June 28, 2012, 10:58:04 PM
I think he meant it would be interesting to see both options for the G.55, simmilar to the 7mm guns in the wings of the C202 and 205.

Difference is I seen photos of both options in the G.55, I cannot show proof c202/205 had different options, then again this thread is about the G.55 which had both series in combat.
I can prove the C.205 had drop tanks in combat, although the handful of 2-3 photos have circulated the internet for years, its not exactly 100% proof, however what else can anyone go on since there is no actual proof or data, even then it was common in north africa, not afterwards.

Want to lose the 7mm option for the C202 and C.205 get your own thread for it, not the topic which says Fiat G.55, different aircraft and production model.

Your information is a little backwards Tank-ace, I never objected to the Drop tanks - I actually supported it since day one and hopign when it gets remodeled they are added along with c.202. I never mentioned bombs, thats all on you.

[Butcher]

Actually the C.202s operating from a certain region had a general order signed allowing the use of drop tanks due to the range of their missions. Since the C.205 was integrated into C.202 units there's no real reason the DT isn't available in-game.

We're not talking some experimental weapons system here. We're not talking 20mms on a P-40, or 20mm gondolas on a P-47. We're talking weapons that were used in combat in this thread, on combat tested hardpoints.
P.S. Drop tanks weigh MORE than bombs. You're not OVERLOADING it with 3 bombs. You're loading it less than the DT/bomb combo, even.

i understand that Krusty, and I get your point - instead of having two wing drop tanks they can simply of taken bombs even with a center line bomb, however I am trying to find technical information to show if this was ever used. nothing but hear say so far, I am just trying to research and make sure its factual rather then hear say.

Its known 190s were tested with 1000kg and 1800kg bombs along with torpedoes, but I can't get any information on this period, is there any information to support it at all?

[LCADolby]

I can show proof 190F/G's flew with 8x 50kg bombs, I can show all specifications and details on a dozen different armament configurations, same with pair of 250kg's on the wings, or a 500kg under the centerline, but no book or manual I have will show any regards to a 190 carrying all 3 ords.

Please present this information as soon as possible, thanks. It will make great reading.

[Butcher]

Please present this information as soon as possible, thanks. It will make great reading.

http://www.367thdynamitegang.com/upload/butch/fw190.rar

Its a very Large Pdf file, enjoy

I'm working on getting a copy of the 109 series, should be quite interesting, ill forward it once i get it.

[Krusty]

i understand that Krusty, and I get your point - instead of having two wing drop tanks they can simply of taken bombs even with a center line bomb, however I am trying to find technical information to show if this was ever used. nothing but hear say so far, I am just trying to research and make sure its factual rather then hear say.

Its known 190s were tested with 1000kg and 1800kg bombs along with torpedoes, but I can't get any information on this period, is there any information to support it at all?

I don't think it falls into the same category as 1000kg bombs and torpedoes.

Hitech has said he doesn't want to limit people in ways that they can combine weapons loadouts (re: discussion of P-51s with rockets AND bombs). The way I see it, they carried bombs on the wings. They carried bombs centerline. Hitech doesn't want to limit combinations. Therefore, as long as any one loadout is historically accurate, we ought to be able to mix and match in this game.

That's how I see it.

[Butcher]

I don't think it falls into the same category as 1000kg bombs and torpedoes.

Hitech has said he doesn't want to limit people in ways that they can combine weapons loadouts (re: discussion of P-51s with rockets AND bombs). The way I see it, they carried bombs on the wings. They carried bombs centerline. Hitech doesn't want to limit combinations. Therefore, as long as any one loadout is historically accurate, we ought to be able to mix and match in this game.

That's how I see it.

Well that make sense, I don't know hitech's input I only assume its historical and seen combat. This argument can go 100 which ways, honestly I am no way against the 190 carrying 3 ords, for me it just means the 190 is sluggish, slow and will not maneuver. However I just want to make sure its historically accurate first.

Del had a great argument a while back, why don't the P-38 carry a single 2,000lb bomb in which they did... historically accurate, yet no thread was ever made on this.

[Krusty]

I understand your point. I don't intend to pick on your or anything.

This may be a bit of a tangent, but I believe the P-38s carried a number of documented loadouts but all were literally field-mods with bolted-on external racks. I don't recall the issue with the 2000lb bomb specifically but it may have been similar.

I know there are some loadouts not present on other airframes, but I also know that sometimes HTC moves very slowly 

Sometimes they don't, but for things like loadout additions it really can take ages to see new ones added. I figure folks will keep making their petitions for different craft and many discussions will be held over the years. Just like this thread. Just like C2 drop tanks. Just like P-38 bombs. Just like F4u tiny tims, etc.

[Ack-Ack]

This may be a bit of a tangent, but I believe the P-38s carried a number of documented loadouts but all were literally field-mods with bolted-on external racks. I don't recall the issue with the 2000lb bomb specifically but it may have been similar.

You are incorrect.

ack-ack

[Krusty]

So be it. Like I said, I rememberd all the other racks bolted on, wasn't sure if the 2k egg was one of them.

[Tank-Ace]

   
Re: Fiat G.55/l
« Reply #42 on: June 28, 2012, 11:22:24 PM »
Quote
Quote from: Tank-Ace on June 28, 2012, 10:58:04 PM
I think he meant it would be interesting to see both options for the G.55, simmilar to the 7mm guns in the wings of the C202 and 205.

Difference is I seen photos of both options in the G.55, I cannot show proof c202/205 had different options, then again this thread is about the G.55 which had both series in combat.
I can prove the C.205 had drop tanks in combat, although the handful of 2-3 photos have circulated the internet for years, its not exactly 100% proof, however what else can anyone go on since there is no actual proof or data, even then it was common in north africa, not afterwards.

Want to lose the 7mm option for the C202 and C.205 get your own thread for it, not the topic which says Fiat G.55, different aircraft and production model.

Your information is a little backwards Tank-ace, I never objected to the Drop tanks - I actually supported it since day one and hopign when it gets remodeled they are added along with c.202. I never mentioned bombs, thats all on you.

Well, for one thing, that doesn't show you support DT's for the 202 and 205. All that shows is that in that one specific post, you didn't object to the Dt's on the 202/205.

And, again IIRC, it was more directed at the issue of the bombs on the c.205, of which we have some technical data saying such a loadout was possible and official, but no photographic evidence confirming it.


But either way, that doesn't invalidate my argument.

It wasn't a field mod, we have photographs confirming its use, therefore it should make it in, regardless of a lack of manuals saying such a loadout was possible. It clearly was, since it used the mountings in official loadouts, and we can confirm that it was carried.

The precedent for this being set by the fact that we have abiguities in other manuals that were ignored for AH.

[Butcher]

Well, for one thing, that doesn't show you support DT's for the 202 and 205. All that shows is that in that one specific post, you didn't object to the Dt's on the 202/205.

And, again IIRC, it was more directed at the issue of the bombs on the c.205, of which we have some technical data saying such a loadout was possible and official, but no photographic evidence confirming it.

I've been a major supporter for past 6 years of upgrading the 202 and 205 to having Drop Tanks, a number of threads point this out, mostly because I want the G.55 added as a series 5 italian fighter.

There is data that shows it was equiped with 2x drop tanks - wikipedia says it carried 2x 350lb bombs on the wings, however nothing I have ever says it carried bombs, only DTs.
Maybe someone else can get that info, I have only 3 books on the italian airforce, so I can't exactly compare to other sources to verify it.

Wikipedia lists the Data from The Great Book of Fighters, while I don't have this book I can't tell where the actual numbers come from or what source they used.

[Tank-Ace]

Not a big history buff on the Italian stuff either. we'll have to find someone else with the stuff, then.

[Babalonian]

...circles, they keep on turning...