The Co-Pilot

[tuton25]

Why can't the Co-Pilot in a mossie or B-17 take over the plane when you get a pilot wound     
just my $0.02

[Lusche]

Have you ever seen one in the plane? 

[tuton25]

yes I have

[Lusche]

yes I have

I want to see a picture

[tuton25]

How do I do that???

[chaser]

Have you ever seen one in the plane? 

For that matter I've never seen the pilot of the B17 

[Karnak]

Planes in AH that had co-pilots:

B-17G
B-24J
B-25C
B-25H
B-26B
B-29A
C-47A
G4M1
Ju88A-4
Ki-67

Mosquitoes did not have a co-pilot.  They had a pilot and a navigator and the flight controls were not duplicated on the navigator's side of the aircraft.  Lancasters also did not have a co-pilot.

[tuton25]

Thats not to say the navigator couldn't take over the plane if something happened to the pilot......

[Karnak]

Thats not to say the navigator couldn't take over the plane if something happened to the pilot......

Could, but not very effectively.  No rudders, limited, if any, training and holding the stick from a very awkward position with the pilot's limp body in the way.

I am aware of at least one case in which a Mosquito was flown back to England by the navigator, but the pilot recovered enough to land it as I recall.  The navigator would certainly not be performing combat maneuvers.

[Fish42]

Lancasters also did not have a co-pilot.

No, but they had a flight engineer who could and in quite a few cases did pull wounded pilots out of the seat and take over the plane.

[B3YT]

should he be called Otto?

[Karnak]

No, but they had a flight engineer who could and in quite a few cases did pull wounded pilots out of the seat and take over the plane.

Flight Engineers were often guys who had washed out of pilot training so they had some idea of how to fly the aircraft.

[Fish42]

Flight Engineers were often guys who had washed out of pilot training so they had some idea of how to fly the aircraft.

yep, but that did not stop them getting the kites home.

[Karnak]

yep, but that did not stop them getting the kites home.

Not at all.  The intention was bluntly exactly that.  If the pilot was incapacitated or killed if the flight engineer had at least basic flight training he would have a fighting chance to get the plane home.


I recall Saburo Sakai describing a return flight from a raid on Darwin in which one of the G4Ms was having a lot of trouble maintaining position in its formation.  After landing it turned out that everybody on the plane had been killed except for, IIRC, the engineer, who had no flight training, and the pilot who had been knocked out.  The engineer flew the G4M back to Rabaul and the pilot regained consciousness in time to land it.  Apparently the plane had quite an effect on the A6M pilots as they were normally so insulated from the effects of combat, but in this case he said there was blood running out of bullet holes in the fuselage and it was a charnel house inside.

[Wagger]

My father was a top turret gunner and flight engineer on B-17's.  He had some flight time for militarization.  If I can find the record he has showing it I will post it.