SPAAG Wishes

[tunnelrat]

For the self-propelled AAA in the game:

I think the Ostwind and Wirbelwind are great.

However, the M16MGMC - while decent in the right situation - could use some love.

First off, it has 4,000 rounds... only 800 more than the Wirb, and the combined fire MIGHT be as effective as one of the Wirb's 4 guns, assuming you are hitting at a range where the kinetic energy is still effective on the .50s.

Every source that I have been able to find, none of which I would exactly call definitive, shows the M16MGMC variant of the M3 as being loaded with 5,000 rounds of ammunition.

While even that bump would be a step in the right direction, 8,000 or 12,000 rounds would be even better.

Before you say "That's gamey!" (which would be correct), consider that the real-world counterpart of the Wirbelwind was fed via ammunition box magazines that had to be reloaded on each gun, individually - although a full crew did have 2 gunners, one manning each pair left and right.  (The Ostiwind could - with a decent a-gunner - maintain a constant rate of fire until the barrel melted or the ammo within reach dried up).

Now, the M16MGMC was also fed via boxes, but they contained far more rounds than an individual 20mm Flak 38 clip (I believe 200:20 or 800:80).

I know there is no reload mechanism/delay for (it would seem) guns with a bore size of less than 50mm, and I am not at all asking for the Wirb to be gimped, rather that the M16 get a bit of love to make it more competitive.  As it stands, it has the worst K/D of all the SPAAG in the game (it's even worse than the C.202 this tour, in fact), and is used far less than either of the other two options.


T28E1 or M15CGMC

That we have "enough" SPAAG in game is probably true, but with the pre-existing M3 chassis as a foundation, perhaps enough merit could be found in adding one/both of the above when time permits?

The T28E1 was used in 1942, making it available far earlier than either of the German options in game currently.  

The 2x .50's and 1x 37mm would be effective as well, though the T28 would get crippled by everything down to a bailed pilot (though the M15 was armored).

It will never touch the Wirb as far as sheer killing power, but it would round out the Allied SPAAG options.

[Eric19]

+1

[Wildcat1]

i like the idea of early to mid-war German AA platforms

[SmokinLoon]

The biggest thing that could help the M16, Wirby, and Osty is to give them a but more mojo when it comes to being able to take a hit to the turret.  IMO, they are far too fragile.

If a plane in AH can take 1, 2, or 8 hit from a 20mm Wirby and stay flying then I'd like to think that the same courtesy could be afforded to the FLAK department.  For game play at least.

[TheMercinary60]

+1

[Babalonian]

The biggest thing that could help the M16, Wirby, and Osty is to give them a but more mojo when it comes to being able to take a hit to the turret.  IMO, they are far too fragile.

If a plane in AH can take 1, 2, or 8 hit from a 20mm Wirby and stay flying then I'd like to think that the same courtesy could be afforded to the FLAK department.  For game play at least.

(to cut short an arguement heard many times before on this forum)

Right after planes get damage-repairing rearm pads (with or without the door-to-door delivery service option), too.  (  )

[RTHolmes]

-1

If M16s really had 5,000 rounds then fair enough, but asking for way more than they commonly had is gamey.

reload time should be enabled, especially for wirbs and M16s.

[MK-84]

The biggest thing that could help the M16, Wirby, and Osty is to give them a but more mojo when it comes to being able to take a hit to the turret.  IMO, they are far too fragile.

If a plane in AH can take 1, 2, or 8 hit from a 20mm Wirby and stay flying then I'd like to think that the same courtesy could be afforded to the FLAK department.  For game play at least.

They can! They really can!  But if you land a 20mm shell inside the unroofed and cramped fighting compartment everyone inside is going to have a bad day!  Theres NO ARMOR on the top!  If you hit anywhere else a wirble can definatly take a hit, but a shot into the fighting compartment doesnt even hit the wirble, it hits people.  I understand it might somewhat miss that person inside. Then what? it now hits the armored part of the turret thats somewhat shaped like a Jacuzzi of death that houses those people to ricochet all around inside.

What can possibly be more fragile than a target that has litterally no material on its roof protecting the inhabitants?

[MK-84]

Actually from my perspective and imho the biggest thing that can help a wible or m16 driver is to pay attention to their surroundings.  I sight most of my targets first when their trigger happy tendencies cause them to fire off at myself or someone else at such extreme ranges they have little hope to hit.  Secondarily, if they are firing at someone else this gives me a perfect visual of where their gun is pointed.  They just set my attack run up for me.  You could even turn tracers off.

My point is, you AAA tankers have options.  Don't fire willy nilly, and pay real attention to the aircraft above you.  Is one up there circling and waiting for you to obviously draw your attention away?  Could you use trees and vegitation to make yourself harder to spot and hit?  In some cases is taking tracers a worse idea than not?  Could parking on a steep hill make your unarmored roof a harder target for an attacking target?

[Volron]

A steep hill is a double edged sword.  While it will limit angles that a plane can come in (common, inpatient fliers), to those skilled, it will in-fact make it easier for them to knock them out.  I love it when a wirb is on a hill, especially a steep one.  Their movement is dead slow, as is their maneuverability.  Going up the hill, I can take much longer ranged shots.  Going across, it's easy to predict their move, which is quite often down the hill.  A harder shot, but if predicted correctly, it can be landed.  Oddly enough, them going down the hill makes it a little tougher, at least for me.

But as pointed out, the best way is to "bait" the wirb.  Then its VERY easy to knock em out.   Carried out properly (and a spot of luck), the wirb will ALWAYS get knocked out with little to no damage received to the "bait".  Tactic is real simple; 2 planes go in at the same time from opposite angles.  Wirb can only shoot at one.

One thing to note, turning off tracers works against the one gunning (unless that is how you roll).  Tracers ALWAYS show for me from flak's.  I've yet to encounter a flak that doesn't put up tracers when firing.  So far, only single bombers and fighters will not put up tracers if they have them turned off, at least this has been my experience.

[tunnelrat]

One thing to note, turning off tracers works against the one gunning (unless that is how you roll).  Tracers ALWAYS show for me from flak's.  I've yet to encounter a flak that doesn't put up tracers when firing.  So far, only single bombers and fighters will not put up tracers if they have them turned off, at least this has been my experience.

Take a gunner who has tracers off =)

[F89]

I say bring on the 37mm varant. I have seen them in lost of musums and I would love to play with it.

[Ack-Ack]

How about a Crusader AA Mk I with a 40mm Bofors gun?


Or a Crusader AA Mk II with a triple Oerlikon 20mm cannon?


ack-ack

[tunnelrat]

How about a Crusader AA Mk I with a 40mm Bofors gun?
(Image removed from quote.)

Or a Crusader AA Mk II with a triple Oerlikon 20mm cannon?
(Image removed from quote.)

ack-ack

Both of those look awesome!!  And I had never seen the second one before... very cool!

[JVboob]

i like the idea of a 2 turret 8 .50 m16 id love it. my biggest whine in the game is perk the dern whirbs!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! osti and m16 can stay fine but perk the whirbs!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


PERK THE WHIRBS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
that is all
<S>49Boobz