Welcome Screen Logon Blues

[2bighorn]

So tell me, how long exactly have you used windows 8 to give such an expert opinnion on it?

Since August 2012

[MrRiplEy[H]]

Since August 2012

(Image removed from quote.)

Ok, now I guess you can specify what in your expert opinnion makes Windows8 a worse option compared to W7. Leave the user interface out of the discussion as it takes only a few minutes to adapt to.

[2bighorn]

Leave the user interface out of the discussion as it takes only a few minutes to adapt to.

Are you serious? We are not talking embedded appliance PCs or servers here. Key words: Desktop OS. Without touching one of the most important aspects of any modern desktop OS, which is UI, any discussion is moot.

[Skuzzy]

Sort of like talking about how dangerous a rocket launch is, but forbidding the discussion of the rocket itself.


Windows 7 has far more flexibility that Windows 8 does.  Windows 7 has also been available long enough to be stable and documented enough to work around various issues.

That is just the tip of that Windows 8 iceberg.


Windows 8, just say no.

[Chalenge]

Ever studied digital design, Ripley? Windows 8 has been the topic of discussion in many classes. Windows 8 is designed to attract people into computers that have no business using computers. It is designed to appear friendly and easy and openly invites users to trust the computer with all aspects of their lives.

See any problem there? I dont mean for hard core users that are already suspicious of sharing. . . I mean for the bambi in the woods type of user.

[ebfd11]

So if I am reading this right I am being told Windows 8 is tha bomb and better than windows 7?

Well I tried windows 8 and all I can say is it is pure trash, simply put.

1st reason it is a touch screen based OS, for this without the convience of a touch screen it is awkward to use.

2nd reason it actually removed drivers for some of my MB basically rendering my USB 3 ports totally useless.

3rd reason it is a pain in the ( i ) to get to shut down, move courser to upper right side, click setting, then click power management, then click power off. Vs  click start, then power off.

3rd reason If I want to go visit adult sites to view things I don't want what I view no matter to be going into a data base. Yes I know you will tell me that Windows's 7 does the same thing but alas not to the extent of windows 8.

4th reason  I want to start on my desktop not on a separate screen then have to click on another icon to get to the desktop, can you say redundancy?

And those are just a few of the easy ones that are noticeable,

Ohh and per someone else's thread. http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,342960.0.html

If I want to back up my computer I will do it without having to go through 90 friggen steps to do it.


Rant off

Crazylwn

[MrRiplEy[H]]

Ever studied digital design, Ripley? Windows 8 has been the topic of discussion in many classes. Windows 8 is designed to attract people into computers that have no business using computers. It is designed to appear friendly and easy and openly invites users to trust the computer with all aspects of their lives.

See any problem there? I dont mean for hard core users that are already suspicious of sharing. . . I mean for the bambi in the woods type of user.

You're totally wrong. There are no people 'who have no business using computers'. You're very racist in saying so. It's similar to saying that handicapped people have no business going to public offices. Who needs ramps and elevators, right?

I've seen first hand that people who have 5 thumbs as fingers using computers adapt nicely to W8. It may be inconvenient for the rest of us who already learned the "windows way" of thinking but it can be overcome easily if you leave your prejudice home. I went through this process already with Apple/OSX and that was very irritating to say the least. But doing that for the second time with W8 is not so bad anymore. You have to adapt and evolve. The only thing that IS irritating is that the previous versions are still used and as a computer professional you need to learn and/or remember all the different approaches of UI now.

The GUI aside Win8 is pretty much the same as W7 with some improvements in functionality.

[MrRiplEy[H]]

So if I am reading this right I am being told Windows 8 is tha bomb and better than windows 7?

Well I tried windows 8 and all I can say is it is pure trash, simply put.

1st reason it is a touch screen based OS, for this without the convience of a touch screen it is awkward to use.

No, it's a hybrid. I'm not a fan of this decision either.

2nd reason it actually removed drivers for some of my MB basically rendering my USB 3 ports totally useless.

So you didn't do the hardware compatibility check before installing the OS. Your mistake. Did you try searching for updated drivers?

3rd reason it is a pain in the ( i ) to get to shut down, move courser to upper right side, click setting, then click power management, then click power off. Vs  click start, then power off.

Oh the pain. W8 both boots up and revives from sleep many times faster than W7 or XP out of the box. It's not meant to be rebooted daily, just set your power options to put it to sleep after a few minutes of idle.

3rd reason If I want to go visit adult sites to view things I don't want what I view no matter to be going into a data base. Yes I know you will tell me that Windows's 7 does the same thing but alas not to the extent of windows 8.

Why do you worry about that? Are you going to illegal sites or what? The windows database is the _least_ of your worries. Google along facebook is the one you should worry about as it tracks every single movement you do online. Nearly every website nowadays has Google based functions or ads which track every single webpage you happen to use. And sell that info forward - something that MS AFAIK does not. Google streetview has mapped your neighborhood, ripped off your wireless network info if you have one and eavesdropped on your traffic to see your hardware id:s. So Google knows where you live, which computers you use / own and what are their IP:s and which pages you visit. They sell this info to anyone willing to pay for it. With augmented reality and virtual targeting ads coming live soon you're going to be precision bombed with ads of your personal preference such as has happened to some sorry bastages who had their active facebook logins ripped by adult sites and advertised on their profile LOL!

4th reason  I want to start on my desktop not on a separate screen then have to click on another icon to get to the desktop, can you say redundancy?

You can make w8 boot straight into desktop very easily - and even get the old start menu. Install startisback, start8 or similar.

If I want to back up my computer I will do it without having to go through 90 friggen steps to do it.

The backup is just a couple mouseclicks away - you just need to know where to look.

[Bizman]

The windows database is the _least_ of your worries. Google along facebook is the one you should worry about as it tracks every single movement you do online. Nearly every website nowadays has Google based functions or ads which track every single webpage you happen to use. And sell that info forward - something that MS AFAIK does not. Google streetview has mapped your neighborhood, ripped off your wireless network info if you have one and eavesdropped on your traffic to see your hardware id:s. So Google knows where you live, which computers you use / own and what are their IP:s and which pages you visit. They sell this info to anyone willing to pay for it. With augmented reality and virtual targeting ads coming live soon you're going to be precision bombed with ads of your personal preference such as has happened to some sorry bastages who had their active facebook logins ripped by adult sites and advertised on their profile LOL!

AFAIK Google can make guesses about my whereabouts only based on my IP address. With the dynamic IP policy they can't even tell for sure in which town I live. Mobile broadband can give even more erraneous results concerning physical existence. Alright, they have my house displayed but how can they connect that picture to my current IP address?

OTOH MS likes to get all kind of optional information alongside with the Windows registration. Same goes for Hewlett-Packard, Symantec etc. If you give them your name, address, e-mail and whatever for "enhanced service facilities, information of updates and special offers only for you", then they really have or can get all the information discussed above.

You can make w8 boot straight into desktop very easily - and even get the old start menu. Install startisback, start8 or similar.

Can such 3rd party programs be trusted to work even after ServicePacks? I mean, no harm done if my own rig goes awry with some modification, but would you take the same risk with a customer?

The backup is just a couple mouseclicks away - you just need to know where to look.

Most people don't even know what a backup means, not to mention the built-in facilities their current OS gives. Just think about it: You still can find a bunch of 100 year old photos in some attic, even someone who still can recognize the people and places in them. Even with the corners folded or torn. Do you think your descendants would be able to restore a DVD, or a USB stick or an outboard HDD even if they were intact? I've got some floppies from the dawn of the era of digital photography (about 13 years old), made by the developer from negatives. How many of you still have a floppy drive? How many of you have re-backupped such rarities to a more modern media?

How did all this relate to the Welcome Screen Logon Blues? 

[MrRiplEy[H]]

AFAIK Google can make guesses about my whereabouts only based on my IP address. With the dynamic IP policy they can't even tell for sure in which town I live. Mobile broadband can give even more erraneous results concerning physical existence. Alright, they have my house displayed but how can they connect that picture to my current IP address?

Google can and will harvest much more information from your computer than just the IP, especially those who have installed Chrome spyware on their computers Also your dynamic IP is not very dynamic at all unless you're still using a dial-up modem. In reality your modem routers MAC address keeps a steady IP that's selected from the ISP:s IP pool for you on first contact. If you happen to use any services that uses Google ad sense or embedded search, you can bet they know your e-mail address and possibly even the true name along with banking information etc. You'd be surprised how many websites actually incorporate some Google API such as in-site search. It all conveniently flows back to them.

OTOH MS likes to get all kind of optional information alongside with the Windows registration. Same goes for Hewlett-Packard, Symantec etc. If you give them your name, address, e-mail and whatever for "enhanced service facilities, information of updates and special offers only for you", then they really have or can get all the information discussed above.

That information is optional, Google then again spies on you like it or not - and gains billions collectively in doing so. In fact selling peoples information is the main business for it.

Can such 3rd party programs be trusted to work even after ServicePacks? I mean, no harm done if my own rig goes awry with some modification, but would you take the same risk with a customer?

Who knows. Then again it takes about 5 minutes to familiarize yourself to the new start screen and a couple key shortcuts (such as pressing win key and typing to start a search etc.)

Most people don't even know what a backup means, not to mention the built-in facilities their current OS gives.

That's not the issue when the person I responded to was claiming it takes 90 steps to perform a backup. This is not true. http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,342960.0.html

[Bizman]

Sounds scary, especially the banking information part. Do you mean that we even can't trust sites using https for sensitive information? I have seen even banking sites that have both secure and nonsecure items on them, and I've learned that in the very worst scenario the nonsecure part might be contaminated. But do you really mean that a site with a Google API or such can spy for information given on secure sites not related to the site where the API is?

For what I've seen in my modem's admin tools, my IP seems to change every once in awhile, although staying the same for at least days if not weeks. Sometimes I stumble upon a page that tries to "offer local services" based on my IP, but for the most part they miss by some 50 km. With mobile broadband I've noticed that the location is given to the operator's headquarter town, at least some of them.

[MrRiplEy[H]]

Sounds scary, especially the banking information part. Do you mean that we even can't trust sites using https for sensitive information? I have seen even banking sites that have both secure and nonsecure items on them, and I've learned that in the very worst scenario the nonsecure part might be contaminated. But do you really mean that a site with a Google API or such can spy for information given on secure sites not related to the site where the API is?

For what I've seen in my modem's admin tools, my IP seems to change every once in awhile, although staying the same for at least days if not weeks. Sometimes I stumble upon a page that tries to "offer local services" based on my IP, but for the most part they miss by some 50 km. With mobile broadband I've noticed that the location is given to the operator's headquarter town, at least some of them.

What I meant by 'banking information' is that at least theoretically Google could intercept your saving credit card information to some paid service online. Theoretically...

They go to great lengths to harvest information from people and they know well how scary it is. That's why they created the motto 'we're not evil'

At least my adsl connection never changes IP unless I spoof the mac address or change hardware.

[Chalenge]

You're totally wrong. There are no people 'who have no business using computers'. You're very racist in saying so. It's similar to saying that handicapped people have no business going to public offices. Who needs ramps and elevators, right?. . .

Wrong. My mother would get her identity stolen within the first few hours if she just went to town, bought a laptop with Windows 8, and started surfing the net for friends, family, sewing, quilting. . .

The net is unsafe for the uninitiated and unfortunately Windows 8 appeals to older people that do not have a clue how to protect themselves. Its designed that way. Worse, the 'brilliant' programmers at MS have never been good at closing security holes.

So she uses it for a few years if she is really lucky and then throws it away and buys a new one. Someone retrieves it from the bin and BOOM! . . . open book.

[Happy1]

Merry Xmas & A Happy New Year every1  

I was the one (1) who started this thread, & must admit I sincerely appreciated & learned much from the controversy this thread started    For one (1) I followed MrRiplEy's advice re. Windows8 (W8), downloaded it & was briefly lost in what to do next, thereby I started my internet browsing in search for W8, short cuts, tips , etc to further my studious nature.  I was rewarded with tons of info to make my W8 experience pleasurable. Woops no "Start Button", solution 'Start8.com'.

Further search enabled me to locate a choice of menus from Classical, XP, Vista &  Windows7, I selected Windows XP start menu, my all-time favorite with Start Button.   My memory came back as to how everything was setup in XP, I'm happy & quite familiar with
W8, but am studying, online, W8 tutorials to become better versed
in the intricacies of something very new, so far so good & NO problems.  I love W8 & all the info I'm gleaning from it!

Btw, I no longer have any probs with "Windows Logon Screen' thx to
Chalenge's solution to my query.  Hope this helps, education is the key to SUCCESS.

Happy1

[MrRiplEy[H]]

Wrong. My mother would get her identity stolen within the first few hours if she just went to town, bought a laptop with Windows 8, and started surfing the net for friends, family, sewing, quilting. . .

The net is unsafe for the uninitiated and unfortunately Windows 8 appeals to older people that do not have a clue how to protect themselves. Its designed that way. Worse, the 'brilliant' programmers at MS have never been good at closing security holes.

So she uses it for a few years if she is really lucky and then throws it away and buys a new one. Someone retrieves it from the bin and BOOM! . . . open book.

So in your opinnion your mother should not be able to handle her affairs online. Nice way to make her old days as difficult as possible. To do banking she'll have to walk to the office and wait in line, I'm sure that's a hoot when you're 80 and tired. I wouldn't want that to my relatives.