Unrecoverable stall/spin in ta152

[RedBull1]

Oh oh oh ooooh ooooch ouch, yikes the pain make it stop. 

Is that all you've got Chalenge, after the reputation-spanking you just received? You argue like I'm told you fly. Run along now and gather your energy advantage. Pffft.

IT'S CALLED EXTENDING!!!! TACTICAL STUFF HERE SHIDA, SHEESH

[68ZooM]

Oh oh oh ooooh ooooch ouch, yikes the pain make it stop. 

Is that all you've got Chalenge, after the reputation-spanking you just received? You argue like I'm told you fly. Run along now and gather your energy advantage. Pffft.

Nrshida if you want to duel him you best be looking in the stratosphere you might be able to drag him down to 30k anything under that and his tuck tail reflex kicks in.  

[nrshida]

IT'S CALLED EXTENDING!!!! TACTICAL STUFF HERE SHIDA, SHEESH

Oh yeah. I'm such a moonbat.

Nrshida if you want to duel him you best be looking in the stratosphere you might be able to drag him down to 30k anything under that and his tuck tail reflex kicks in. 

I'm afraid of heights ZooM 

[Zoney]

I like Chalenge.  I like flying with him and have many many times.  Yeah, he flys with some alt but I have not observed him unwilling to give it up and have fought with him on the deck also.  He has also dove in to save my butt many times and then I'm very thankful that he has the alt to convert to speed.  My observation is, that he is a defender, which does not work at low alts when the inbound agressors are at alt.  We talk quite a bit while flying and I have found him to be intelligent and a gentelmen, I look forward to winging with him upon my return.

[ink]

I like Chalenge.  I like flying with him and have many many times.  Yeah, he flys with some alt but I have not observed him unwilling to give it up and have fought with him on the deck also.  He has also dove in to save my butt many times and then I'm very thankful that he has the alt to convert to speed.  My observation is, that he is a defender, which does not work at low alts when the inbound agressors are at alt.  We talk quite a bit while flying and I have found him to be intelligent and a gentelmen, I look forward to winging with him upon my return.

wohoooo

[skorpx1]

I like Chalenge.  I like flying with him and have many many times.  Yeah, he flys with some alt but I have not observed him unwilling to give it up and have fought with him on the deck also.  He has also dove in to save my butt many times and then I'm very thankful that he has the alt to convert to speed.  My observation is, that he is a defender, which does not work at low alts when the inbound agressors are at alt.  We talk quite a bit while flying and I have found him to be intelligent and a gentelmen, I look forward to winging with him upon my return.

I'm not entirely sure if you're serious or just trolling here.

[FLOOB]

The Ta152 defies the laws of physics in this game. It flies like there's no stabililzers on it in many cases, when in fact it's an absurd stall code. Even in low-fuel (low weight) situations the stall is outrageous and unsubstantiated for how AH portrays it.

Likely the result of a conspiracy of jewish labor at the factory sabotaging production. I suggest we send a staff car and summon Mr Schindler at once!

[greens]

<SIGH> thot this was about a unrecoverable stall/spin in a TA152? sheesh. id still pwn 99.9 percent of yall in a duel of TA152s and i aint even flown in about yr and a half besides one time couple weeks ago. crash landed 4 kills    btw anyone w know how in the ta152 can recover an uncontrollable stall tail spin if they know how.
i gots my Polar Bear chest out bigger!!

[JunkyII]

Greens....I would  and deflate that chest for you

[danny76]

And yet the last time we met this is how I left you (1k off my field of course). You tried twisting and turning and flopping, but you're nothing like what I've seen out of Grizz and Junky. The smack you got down, but the flying needs polish just like everyone else. I checked my entire film cache. No other films feature you at all and I keep everything.

(Image removed from quote.)

I read this twice, just to be sure....it sounds as though you arerelating an incidence of ack hugging to me. 1k off your base, screenshot from inside the damaged aircraft. You should delve into your archive and show us the film of you killing redbull. Otherwise the credit should go to HiTech for his laser guided ack

[Krusty]

Yes, bomber kills which is what the 152 was designed to do.

No. It was not. The Ta152 was designed as a high alt fighter, meant to engage other fighters. It was not intended as a bomber hunter nor was it used as one. Your use of it as one doesn't mean you have the same experience as somebody like moot (or, to a lesser extent, myself) that push this plane to places where it actually might stall. When you're hunting bombers, it is a chase, a hunt, but not a dogfight.

Doesn't matter if you had 100-1 ratio against bombers. You can get that in many/any plane in the game. When hunting bombers you're never going to get into the situation where you would experience the tail-stall.

So, frankly, it doesn't matter what others say about you... it matters what you described about yourself. You're not using the 152 in any way remotely aggressive enough to bring about the topic of this thread.

Which, by the way, is NOT to have a pissing contest between shida and chalenge.

[ink]

No. It was not. The Ta152 was designed as a high alt fighter, meant to engage other fighters. It was not intended as a bomber hunter nor was it used as one. Your use of it as one doesn't mean you have the same experience as somebody like moot (or, to a lesser extent, myself) that push this plane to places where it actually might stall. When you're hunting bombers, it is a chase, a hunt, but not a dogfight.

Doesn't matter if you had 100-1 ratio against bombers. You can get that in many/any plane in the game. When hunting bombers you're never going to get into the situation where you would experience the tail-stall.

So, frankly, it doesn't matter what others say about you... it matters what you described about yourself. You're not using the 152 in any way remotely aggressive enough to bring about the topic of this thread.

Which, by the way, is NOT to have a pissing contest between shida and chalenge.

Krusty...just a heads up........you know you are arguing with the smartest guy here right.....the best there is......you are wrong obviously...cant you see that....durrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

I was hoping he would go to DA with me and teach me his elite skills and knowledge of fighting......Alas I am afraid he is just so good all he has to do is type out that he is the best....

[tunnelrat]

No. It was not. The Ta152 was designed as a high alt fighter, meant to engage other fighters.

Where are you getting this?

The Ta-152H was a high-altitude interceptor, designed to hit fast bombers north of 20k.  This was also in response to reports of the B-29.  Everything I have ever read on the subject points to this, I would be more than interested to read anything to the contrary.  Just the inclusion of 30mm cannon screams bomber-interceptor...

Just because the situation over Europe when the handful of Ta-152's saw combat ended up with them taking on enemy fighters doesn't mean that the entire project wasn't designed, from the start, to create a fast high-altitude bomber interceptor.

[Krusty]

Where are you getting this?

The Ta-152H was a high-altitude interceptor, designed to hit fast bombers north of 20k.  This was also in response to reports of the B-29.  Everything I have ever read on the subject points to this, I would be more than interested to read anything to the contrary.  Just the inclusion of 30mm cannon screams bomber-interceptor...

Just because the situation over Europe when the handful of Ta-152's saw combat ended up with them taking on enemy fighters doesn't mean that the entire project wasn't designed, from the start, to create a fast high-altitude bomber interceptor.

You really don't know what you're talking about. It had 30mm so it must have been designed for bombers, huh? Bzzzt! Wrong! It flew high, so it MUST have been to hunt B-29s, huh? Bzzzt! Wrong! 109K had both a high blown engine and a 30mm cannon, and they weren't designed for bomber hunting either.

The Ta152 was a continuation/modification of the Fw190 line, simple as that. The dora took the FTH up higher to contend with US fighter planes, as compared to the A8, but it wasn't enough. The 152 series had multiple lines, including the 152C and the 152H, C being the lower altitude variant, and H being the high-altitude FIGHTER variant. It was not an interceptor. That term really doesn't apply much until the jet ages and the cold war.

Its goal, its mission, and its purpose, was to give the Luftwaffe pilots an edge (or at least, an equal footing) to the P-51s and P-47s flying well over 30,000 feet, where the LW had previously not been able to fight.

It was intended to win dogfights, not hunt bombers. The Ta152 is a direct product of the early-1943 testing on a Fw190C prototype, though turbosuperchargers were deemed too complicated and too expensive when high-blown superchargers were just as good and far more reliable. In 1943 the Germans still had a chance (or at least high hopes) of winning the war against the Allies.


If you want to make a bomber killer you go the heavily armored and heavily armed route. You make it fast and you make it small so it's hard to hit. The 152 had such long slender wings so that it could turn and dogfight at extreme altitudes. It was significantly lightened, including REDUCING the ammo load. There's no need for this when hunting bombers. However, this was done on the 109 FIGHTERS as well, sometimes reducing ammo load to save weight for dogfighting. None of this adds up to "bomber hunter"... That's just bad info.

[tunnelrat]

You really don't know what you're talking about.

Why should I have expected anything other than this kind of jerk-off response?  I ASKED you to prove what you are saying, since it flies in the face of everything I have read.  Your response is above.

You are not just wrong, you're arrogantly ignorant.

Specifically:

If you want to make a bomber killer you go the heavily armored and heavily armed route. You make it fast and you make it small so it's hard to hit. The 152 had such long slender wings so that it could turn and dogfight at extreme altitudes. It was significantly lightened, including REDUCING the ammo load. There's no need for this when hunting bombers. However, this was done on the 109 FIGHTERS as well, sometimes reducing ammo load to save weight for dogfighting. None of this adds up to "bomber hunter"... That's just bad info.

The Ta-152 had **330 POUNDS*** of armor added to the cockpit and engine areas.  I guess so it could HO real good, right partner?  YEEEHAAAW!!!   

You DON'T put a 30mm cannon on anything that is supposedly purpose built to dogfight.  We're talking reality here, the war that happened, not players able to learn to lob taters in a sim.

Since you have nothing but an enthusiast's heart and your own conjecture, let me throw just a FEW quotes out there to assist in illustrating why I found your assertion to be somewhat radical:

Due to the difficulties German interceptors were having when battling American heavy bombers at altitudes above 20,000 feet, and in light of rumors of new B-29 bombers with better altitude capabilities, the Reichsluftfahrtministerium (German Air Ministry, or "RLM") requested proposals from both Focke-Wulf and Messerschmitt for a high-altitude interceptor. Messerschmitt answered with the Bf 109H, and Focke-Wulf with the Fw 190 Raffat-1, or Ra-1 (fighter), Ra-2 (high altitude fighter) and Ra-3 (ground-attack aircraft).

The Fock-Wulf Ta 152 was a short-lived, high-level interceptor fielded by the German Luftwaffe in the latter part of World War 2.  She was developed from the existing Fw 190 fighter series family and incorporated a new wing, lengthened fuselage, high-altitude/high-performance capabilities utilizing a new nitrous oxide power boosting system (one of the first known uses of such a system) and powerful cannon armament to contend with the ever-growing presence of Allied bombers wreaking havoc against German interests across Europe.

By 1944, German infrastructure and manufacturing capabilities were being ravaged on a daily basis by hundreds, sometimes thousands, of American bombers in the day and British bombers at night.  Additionally, word of the new high-altitude, long-range Boeing B-29 Superfortress had soon spread throughout the German authority and a pressing matter for defense of its war industry soon became critical. As such, the Air Ministry (RLM) looked to fulfill a new requirement for a high-altitude interceptor and tapped both the proven Messerschmitt and Focke-Wulf firms for a viable solution.

As the Ta 152 was intended to kill enemy bombers, she would require a heavy "punch" in the armament department.  As such, armament centered around a 30mm Mk 108 series cannon mounted in the propeller hub and set up to fire through the center of the spinning propeller.

The Ta 152C with the lighter DB 603 engine was otherwise identical to the Ta 152B. It was considered primarily as a Zerstorer. The MW 50 boost installation for the enhancement of low-altitude performance was standard. An Fw 190D prototype had been rebuilt and flown with a DB 603 engine in support of the Ta 152C program, and this plane took to the air for the first time in October 1944. During December 1944 and January 1945, the first Ta 152C-O service test aircraft joined the test program. The definitive production version was to be the Ta 152C-1, and it was hoped that the first examples could be rolling off the production lines in April of 1945. However, series production of the Ta 152C was only just beginning when Allied forces overran the assembly plants, so this fighter never entered service with the Luftwaffe.

Ta 152H/H-1/H-1

A high altitude fighter with a pressurised cabin and a long span wing, increased to 47 ft 6 3/4 in (14.50 m) span. The Ta 152H-0 pre-production aircraft were mostly rebuilt from Fw 190A-1 airframes and had a Junkers Jumo 213E engine with MW-50 water/methanol injection. The production Ta 152H-1 began to leave the Cottbus lines in November 1944, armed with one engine mounted 30 mm MK 108 cannon and two 20 mm MG 151/20 cannon in the wing roots.

Adding a pressurised cabin and a long span wing a fighter from a Zerstörer does not make.

If you can find the thread that unravels the great conspiracy to re-write history by dozens of books and websites, I will be more than happy to re-evaluate my opinion.  Until then, I am sorry you are wrong.  I do like your avatar.