cant maintain formation

[Kenne]

throttle is full at 0
zero at 65535.

but if im in formation with other buffs, they just pull away from me.

any insight?

[ImADot]

You carrying more fuel or bombs? Your flaps/gear down? Engine RPM lower?

Maybe they don't know the throttle of these airplanes have more positions than just closed or wide open - that seems to be an epidemic amongst players of this game.    If the rest of the guys in the formation cared about flying a good formation they wouldn't be running flat out from takeoff to bailing after the bombs drop.

[Kenne]

this is in senarios.
same AC
same ord
same fuel.

[ImADot]

Do you use auto-takeoff and they don't? Do you fly manual, combat trim? Do you use the auto-speed or auto-level autopilot? There must be something different between how you fly and how they fly.

If they slow down so you can form up, can you then keep up by using the same manifold and rpm settings?

[Kenne]

Do you use auto-takeoff and they don't? Do you fly manual, combat trim? Do you use the auto-speed or auto-level autopilot? There must be something different between how you fly and how they fly.

If they slow down so you can form up, can you then keep up by using the same manifold and rpm settings?

i use auto TO..dunno about them.

combat trim is on.

altX for climb. then x at alt.

if they slo for me and then speed up..they walk away.

but if the throt is full forward, and the prop setings are full forward..what other settings are there?

[Kenne]

quick n dirty test.
K4 in the MA, no drop, no WEP lvl at 10k full throt. lvl with 'X'

speed at 327 at time of scrn sht.

ar these the same inst reedings yall get.

[Babalonian]

this is in senarios.
same AC
same ord
same fuel.

A film would help, otherwise were throwing ideas at the wall.  The screen shot with the K4 doesnt show us how much time you've allowed at full throttle for it to accelerate up to its current speed or your processes in getting there... ontop of that, things look fine....

Lets disect your screenshot:  First, you're actualy doing (true AS/red needle) ~385 mph in your screenshot, with only an indicated (big white needle) of ~327.  You can also verify/cross-check with the E6B and the speed/altitude it gives you.  (we can elaborate more on true and indicated airspeeds, ala the two needles your seeing/misinterpreting on the instrument, if you would like/need....  ).  Second, references -

As you can see for yourself, all is operating fine... your K4 isn't going slow at all....
(Next opportunity, try to film or screenshot during a problematic buff run)

In scenarios usualy the formations dont fly at full throttle, so you should be able to catch up using full throttle (which means then that you're definetley doing something differen't than they are to generate so much drag you cant catch up at full power).  If, however, they are at full power then nothing you will do is going to make you go fast enough to catch up unless you took less fuel or ditch some ord and make yourself lighter.

Flaps are down on some bombers at spawn (the K4 spawns with them up), unless you retract them they will remain down possibley throughout the flight.  Open bomb bays generate drag... all these things would be obvious though at somepoint on the long flight through a instrument check though.

Since you stress scenarios, but have a screenshot prooving full speed capability, I'm leaning twords you selecting more fuel than the others as the most likely reason.  In scenarios the fuel burn rate/arena setting is usualy 1.0 (in the MAs it's 2.0).  They rarely take a lot of fuel, often because 50% in a buff will yeild well over 2-hours flight time at full throttle, and air spawns negate the lengthy climbout process.  And snapshots or multi-round scenarios which feature at most 1-1.5 hours of flying (and often air starts) per round, it isn't unheard of for buffs to only need 25% fuel.

[FLS]

Kenne this isn't a tech problem it's just the nature of formation flying.

The lead aircraft should be at less than full throttle to make available extra power if you need it. If the lead wants to let you close the distance they should fly a zig zag while you fly straight. Geometry works better than throttle for adjusting large gaps in formation.

When you pull your nose up a little you slow down immediately then it takes time to regain your speed flying level. Put your nose down and you speed up immediately and it takes time to slow down flying level. Therefor you have to be careful not to pull up and slow down in formation. When you do get behind you can put your nose down and gain speed, fly below and ahead of the position you want to be in, then pull up. This will work but is slower than lead using geometry, i.e. flying a longer distance off course while you fly straight.

If you need help with this just make an appoinment for the Training Arena.

[VonMessa]

Take the offer from FLS!

Also:

Make sure RPM and manifold pressure are the same as the planes you are trying to maintain formation with.

Also, heading has a LOT to do with it.  Use compass degrees (i.e. 090 for East, 045 for NE, etc) as this is more specific than saying NE, SW, etc.

Being even a little bit off will make you overshoot or lag.

 

Good luck

[Rayon]

I used to fly a lot in buff formations (Combat Boxes) for several years with an old squad so I know there are a very wide range of reasons that the buffs are not "keeping up" with the lead plane. 

I went on a buff run last night and my wingman had the exact same problem, couldn't keep up at full power - so I had to adjust my climb speed and eventually my RPM's when level.  It was a short run and two of us, so we didn't troubleshoot the problem.

As stated previously, make sure you have the exact same A/C, fuel, ord configuration, and confirm .speed with formation when climbing (Alt X) if not in default.

If the buffs have the same configuration and you still can't maintain the speed, the first thing I would do is calibrate your throttle axis or all the controls to ensure the game is reading the throttle correctly. 

Adjustments: When in formation, you will in auto pilot 99% of the time.  To minimize lost energy, I make my turning adjustments in a gunner F5 (nose) and use rudder to turn without disrupting the climb or alt if in level flight.  I use my trim (hat on my throttle) to make minor adjustments.  Keeping the buff in auto pilot helps minimize potential for falling out of formation.



When there are laggers in a formation, the lead plane should extend a courtesy and fly for the formation pattern and do everything he/she can to keep it tight for max protection.

[Kenne]

its the wed night slap shots that i do. and we all take the same ord and fuel.
last wed we were in bostons.
leader slowed to let me n another catch up.
then when caught up, he went back to full MP and they pulled away from me.

iv taken 'auto take off' off. perhaps some flaps are down as you suggest.

i dont know what  more i can do about calibrating my controls. when my throt is full
the ressitnce is '0'..isnt that the most?

i used the K4 just as a quick example, i cant fly fighters do to 'the shakes' so im now
doing buffs.  been flying since AW in '93.

but it just bothers me that EVERY time i fly buffs for the slap shots, i cant keep up.

[Kenne]

if i go a test (to show yall)
in a boston, should i test (with film) in the MA or offline?

[FLS]

Kenne your throttle showing 0 doesn't mean it's calibrated, that just shows that the full range is being read by Windows. You still have to calibrate the throttle in Aces High. For a quick test, if your aircraft has WEP and you can turn it on, then your throttle is probably at 100%. You can also look at the E6b on the clipboard, it will tell you what the manifold pressure should be at full throttle. On your K4 screenshot the MP is 1.45 which is normal for full throttle so it looks like your calibration is OK.

[Kenne]

thx
hopefull there is a 'buff' mission sometime tonight and i can get this on film.

[Babalonian]

its the wed night slap shots that i do. and we all take the same ord and fuel.
last wed we were in bostons.
leader slowed to let me n another catch up.
then when caught up, he went back to full MP and they pulled away from me.

iv taken 'auto take off' off. perhaps some flaps are down as you suggest.

i dont know what  more i can do about calibrating my controls. when my throt is full
the ressitnce is '0'..isnt that the most?

i used the K4 just as a quick example, i cant fly fighters do to 'the shakes' so im now
doing buffs.  been flying since AW in '93.

but it just bothers me that EVERY time i fly buffs for the slap shots, i cant keep up.

A suggestion if I may that you may or may not have tried or knew about - I've heard of other players in a similar boat as you with the 'shakes'.  They also preffer alternatives to playing fighters for the most part too.  Anywho:

For finite/delicate adjustments in your cource while autopiloting with say other buffs in a large formation, try to use manual trim and their buttons instead of the stick for minor-er cource adjustments.  The two hurdles immediatley is learning to constantly toggle auto/combat-trim on and off regularly and frequently and memorising the 6 trim buttons on the keyboard.  BUT, for the hastle of teaching an old dog a new trick, you can make _very_ delicate adjustments to cource without touching the stick.

Back to the original problem, rapid and frequent 'jerks' with the stick can cost ya speed. 

Good luck!