« previous next »
Pages: 1 [2] 3   Go Down

Author Topic: Tank killer that can't kill tanks.  (Read 4273 times)

Offline SmokinLoon

  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 6168
Re: Tank killer that can't kill tanks.
« Reply #15 on: February 06, 2013, 05:15:26 PM »
Quote from: R 105 on February 06, 2013, 09:20:13 AM
Lets get some real tank killers in the game like the JagdPather the Panzer IV/70 or Jagdtiger. I would even settle for a Sturmgeschultz IV or the sd.Kfz 142 Stug & Jagdpanzer 38 Hetzer. Even the Stug III G 75mm assault gun would be great. Anyone with a good throwing arm and a larger rock can knock the turret out of the M-18. Lets get a mans tank killer in here. while we are at it lets put the correct 360% turning MGs back on the German rides. I have personally saw the ring mounts on Tigers & Panthers at the Patton museum and the MGs came with an anti aircraft ring sight as part of the TO&E. Even the Infantry had a tripod MG stand and it too had a aircraft ring sight issued with it. Like my old man always said" If you are going to do something do it right.

 :headscratch:  Did you forgot to take your meds this morning?  Settle down, else you'll soil your drawers.   ;)

A "real" tank destroyer? I'm sorry if your M18 bas been damaged by a rock tossing Neanderthal, but I think you're missing the point of the M18. It was one of the best tank destroyers in WWII.  You mention the StG III and its 7.5cm gun, mind you it is the same exact thing as AH's current Panzer IV H but the StG has a far less field of fire. Same goes for the Hetzer.  Now the Jagdtiger, Panzer IV/70, etc, they might be alright.  Ditto goes for the Su-100.

As far as the MG rings on the turrets of German tanks, as yourself *how* a TC fires those MG's when he is incapable of pivoting around the gun mount like the TC's on the Shermans are able to do. The shooter on the M4's MG's usually get out of the turret to use them while the shooter in the German tanks stay in the turret.  Yes?
Logged
Proud grandson of the late Lt. Col. Darrell M. "Bud" Gray, USAF (ret.), B24D pilot, 5th BG/72nd BS. 28 combat missions within the "slot", PTO.

Offline GScholz

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 8910
Re: Tank killer that can't kill tanks.
« Reply #16 on: February 06, 2013, 08:37:49 PM »
The pintle mount revolves around him. To fire directly aft the commander would have to move the mount all the way to either side and lean out a bit to aim.

Logged
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."

Offline GScholz

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 8910
Re: Tank killer that can't kill tanks.
« Reply #17 on: February 06, 2013, 08:49:35 PM »
A modernized system is still being used on tanks of German manufacture today.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H_gPUfWd__U
Logged
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."

Offline SmokinLoon

  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 6168
Re: Tank killer that can't kill tanks.
« Reply #18 on: February 07, 2013, 08:19:42 AM »
Nice. So in other words HTC modeled that correctly?  :aok   :D
Logged
Proud grandson of the late Lt. Col. Darrell M. "Bud" Gray, USAF (ret.), B24D pilot, 5th BG/72nd BS. 28 combat missions within the "slot", PTO.

Offline GScholz

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 8910
Re: Tank killer that can't kill tanks.
« Reply #19 on: February 07, 2013, 08:50:35 AM »
I'm not a GV guy in this game; can the TC lean out and fire to the rear?
Logged
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."

Offline SmokinLoon

  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 6168
Re: Tank killer that can't kill tanks.
« Reply #20 on: February 07, 2013, 09:10:33 AM »
Quote from: GScholz on February 07, 2013, 08:50:35 AM
I'm not a GV guy in this game; can the TC lean out and fire to the rear?


While in the King Tiger, Tiger, and Panther, (I think the Panzer IV too), the TC can pivot his MG left to about the 10 O'clock, then around to the right to not quite 6 O'clock.  According to the example you've posted... that would be exactly how it should be modeled.  The tank hatch opens to the 7 or 8 O'clock.  :D

So yes, HTC does have it modeled correctly.   :D   :aok
Logged
Proud grandson of the late Lt. Col. Darrell M. "Bud" Gray, USAF (ret.), B24D pilot, 5th BG/72nd BS. 28 combat missions within the "slot", PTO.

Offline GScholz

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 8910
Re: Tank killer that can't kill tanks.
« Reply #21 on: February 07, 2013, 09:16:38 AM »
You seem to ignore the fact that the MG itself is movable on its mount. It's a pintle mount with a movable vehicle attachment. It should easily cover 360 degrees.
Logged
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."

Offline WWhiskey

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3122
Re: Tank killer that can't kill tanks.
« Reply #22 on: February 07, 2013, 09:23:06 AM »
Moving that gun requires not only the gun itself but also the mount,, which is another key command,,, I don't use it e nought to remember off the top of my head which one though maybe position 4 or 5
Logged
Flying since tour 71.

Offline GScholz

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 8910
Re: Tank killer that can't kill tanks.
« Reply #23 on: February 07, 2013, 01:41:18 PM »
If that is how it works then it is indeed correctly modeled.
Logged
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."

Offline Fish42

  • AvA Staff Member
  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 862
Re: Tank killer that can't kill tanks.
« Reply #24 on: February 07, 2013, 01:51:13 PM »
3 lets you aim and fire from the flex mounting point. 4 lets you reposition the mount on the ring.
Logged

Offline GScholz

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 8910
Re: Tank killer that can't kill tanks.
« Reply #25 on: February 07, 2013, 06:49:56 PM »
Sounds perfect.
Logged
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."

Offline R 105

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 978
Re: Tank killer that can't kill tanks.
« Reply #26 on: February 08, 2013, 07:40:51 AM »
Quote from: GScholz on February 06, 2013, 08:37:49 PM
The pintle mount revolves around him. To fire directly aft the commander would have to move the mount all the way to either side and lean out a bit to aim.

(Image removed from quote.)

Thank you for posting the correct MG mounting ring.
Logged

Offline R 105

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 978
Re: Tank killer that can't kill tanks.
« Reply #27 on: February 08, 2013, 07:45:21 AM »
Quote from: SmokinLoon on February 07, 2013, 08:19:42 AM
Nice. So in other words HTC modeled that correctly?  :aok   :D

 No it is not. Take a trip to a WWII Musem and look at the MG rings on the late war German tanks. I have even seen twin mounted MGs on a ring.
Logged

Offline R 105

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 978
Re: Tank killer that can't kill tanks.
« Reply #28 on: February 08, 2013, 07:46:40 AM »
Quote from: GScholz on February 07, 2013, 09:16:38 AM
You seem to ignore the fact that the MG itself is movable on its mount. It's a pintle mount with a movable vehicle attachment. It should easily cover 360 degrees.

Correct.
Logged

Offline SmokinLoon

  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 6168
Re: Tank killer that can't kill tanks.
« Reply #29 on: February 08, 2013, 08:11:16 AM »
Quote from: R 105 on February 08, 2013, 07:46:40 AM
Correct.

The gun can cover °360 around the tank perhaps thanks to the pivot mount, but the turret mount that covers the 10 O'clock to the 5 O'clock position simply cant get there if there is no rail for it to traverse on.  I understand that there may have been some LW German tanks with a complete or near complete turret rail, but in AH these tanks do not.  So for the tanks that HTC has represented in AH I'd say they are spot on.  IIRC, it is debatable as to whether or not the Panther G came standard with the pintle gun at all?   
Logged
Proud grandson of the late Lt. Col. Darrell M. "Bud" Gray, USAF (ret.), B24D pilot, 5th BG/72nd BS. 28 combat missions within the "slot", PTO.
Pages: 1 [2] 3   Go Up
« previous next »