Author Topic: Ki-84's Most Absurd Feature  (Read 9910 times)

Offline nrshida

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 8632
Re: Ki-84's Most Absurd Feature
« Reply #105 on: June 16, 2013, 03:34:19 PM »
It's not so bad that you have to top yourself Scholz, just accept other people can have opinions you disagree with but are of equal value and face that you have to share the world and indeed this forum with them  :P
"If man were meant to fly, he'd have been given an MS Sidewinder"

Offline GScholz

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 8910
Re: Ki-84's Most Absurd Feature
« Reply #106 on: June 16, 2013, 03:37:19 PM »
I do expect people to back up their opinions with something more than "you misunderstand" and "you're a troll". Not in your case though; you've made that abundantly clear.  :aok
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."

Offline dirtdart

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1847
Re: Ki-84's Most Absurd Feature
« Reply #107 on: June 16, 2013, 06:33:51 PM »
Flutter can result in failure very quickly after start of the flutter (so quickly that the pilot can't do anything about it) -- it depends on the aerodynamics and the structure.  It's not due to the pilot exerting control-stick pressure.

Some planes could experience, say, aileron flutter and survive it.  Others didn't.  It depends entirely on the aerodynamics and structure, not just one or the other.  As an engineer, think resonance frequencies, structural failure, etc.

A reasonable experiment would be to see if the ki sheds without input...
If you are not GFC...you are wee!
Put on your boots boots boots...and parachutes..chutes...chutes.. .
Illigitimus non carborundum

Offline Brooke

  • Aces High CM Staff
  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 15717
      • http://www.electraforge.com/brooke/
Re: Ki-84's Most Absurd Feature
« Reply #108 on: June 16, 2013, 07:20:11 PM »
A reasonable experiment would be to see if the ki sheds without input...

My recollection is that it does.

Offline GScholz

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 8910
Re: Ki-84's Most Absurd Feature
« Reply #109 on: June 16, 2013, 07:40:00 PM »
Don't forget trim...
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."

Offline ink

  • Persona Non Grata
  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 11274
Re: Ki-84's Most Absurd Feature
« Reply #110 on: June 16, 2013, 07:40:52 PM »
My recollection is that it does.

absolutely correct :aok

get it fast enough....after 500 for me....will shed with no inputs :aok

Offline GScholz

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 8910
Re: Ki-84's Most Absurd Feature
« Reply #111 on: June 16, 2013, 07:48:24 PM »
Even when trimmed neutral? Trim changes the deflection of the control surfaces.
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."

Offline ink

  • Persona Non Grata
  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 11274
Re: Ki-84's Most Absurd Feature
« Reply #112 on: June 16, 2013, 07:56:17 PM »
Even when trimmed neutral? Trim changes the deflection of the control surfaces.

I use combat trim...never mess with it....so I am not sure :headscratch:

Offline GScholz

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 8910
Re: Ki-84's Most Absurd Feature
« Reply #113 on: June 16, 2013, 08:02:18 PM »
Combat trim will trim nose down to compensate for the increasing speed. Turn off combat trim and set all trim to neutral and try it. You will have problems keeping it in a dive without control input though... Try a shallow inverted dive.
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."

Offline nrshida

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 8632
Re: Ki-84's Most Absurd Feature
« Reply #114 on: June 16, 2013, 10:05:49 PM »
I do expect people to back up their opinions with something more than "you misunderstand" and "you're a troll". Not in your case though; you've made that abundantly clear.  :aok

I would explain if it were anyone but you. You aren't interested in discussion, you just want to hear it so you can devalue and dismiss it one piece at a time and impose your opinion on everyone else instead.

All it took to set you off this time was you thinking I was criticizing German engineering, when I refused to explain my comment (which you clearly didn't understand) you immediately resorted to insults: I said nothing about the car industry, nothing about British engineering, mentioned German engineering incidentally & certainly didn't deride Norway.

I'm curious, a few months back you had a parole status. Then Skuzzy said something about how you'd mellowed. Did you get a PNG for your 'pick up the gun' shenanigans in the past?  :D


Anyway now I'm hijacking my own thread  :rofl

I do not use combat trim, I manually trim at a certain speed and if I make a medium or less-than-slo-mo input at > 450 off something pops. I can trim out of a dive with no problem. At 480 things pop off even if I am control neutral.



"If man were meant to fly, he'd have been given an MS Sidewinder"

Offline GScholz

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 8910
Re: Ki-84's Most Absurd Feature
« Reply #115 on: June 16, 2013, 10:45:35 PM »
I would explain if it were anyone but you. You aren't interested in discussion, you just want to hear it so you can devalue and dismiss it one piece at a time and impose your opinion on everyone else instead. [Disregard rest of your troll post...]

Oh, now I'm the one not interested in a discussion? The irony is strong in this one...  :rofl

You're awesome!  :aok
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."

Offline Brooke

  • Aces High CM Staff
  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 15717
      • http://www.electraforge.com/brooke/
Re: Ki-84's Most Absurd Feature
« Reply #116 on: June 16, 2013, 10:48:41 PM »
Flutter doesn't depend on control input, by the way.  It is an aerodynamic instability of the control surface, not a steady-state force because of control-surface deflection.

Offline danny76

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2583
Re: Ki-84's Most Absurd Feature
« Reply #117 on: June 16, 2013, 11:21:54 PM »
Oh, now I'm the one not interested in a discussion? The irony is strong in this one...  :rofl

You're awesome!  :aok


:bhead

"You kill 'em all, I'll eat the BATCO!"
The GFC

"Not within a thousand years will man ever fly" - Wilbur Wright

Offline nrshida

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 8632
Re: Ki-84's Most Absurd Feature
« Reply #118 on: June 16, 2013, 11:40:13 PM »
Oh, now I'm the one not interested in a discussion? The irony is strong in this one...  :rofl

You're awesome!  :aok

Well let's see, the Glock thread, the JSF thread, the straight edged sword thread...

The transference is strong in this one  :D

"If man were meant to fly, he'd have been given an MS Sidewinder"

Offline GScholz

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 8910
Re: Ki-84's Most Absurd Feature
« Reply #119 on: June 17, 2013, 12:02:13 AM »
Well let's see, the Glock thread, the JSF thread, the straight edged sword thread...

The transference is strong in this one  :D

Well... The Viking sword thread I started apparently insulted your Katana or something and you threw a hissy fit; no biggie. In both the Glock thread and F-35 thread my opinions were in line with many other participants of those discussions. Usually these other individuals were actual gun owners (people like me who have actually owned and shot a Glock), and people actually in the know with regard to the F-35 program (including a USAF crew chief and a fighter pilot (maybe even two if I remember correctly)). I guess all us "trolls" whose opinions differ from yours (and who don't argue from a position of ignorance, unlike you) are just out to "impose" our opinions on you. Poor downtrodden you.  :cry
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."