Author Topic: aircraft "dot" range  (Read 1171 times)

Offline SKurj

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aircraft "dot" range
« on: August 19, 2001, 07:18:00 PM »
Okey...

Being able to see clearly an aircraft, which is camoflaged at 5k while flyin at 30k is a bit errmmm well it helps the Alt Warriors.

As a possible solution how about shorter range contact "dots"
Right now I am unsure how far away u can see a black dot, but its a bit ridiculous +)  how about making it around 15kft

or any other suggestions?

SKurj

Offline funkedup

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aircraft "dot" range
« Reply #1 on: August 19, 2001, 07:54:00 PM »
Maybe they could be... the color of the plane... instead of black.   Make them flicker a little too.

[ 08-19-2001: Message edited by: funkedup ]

Offline R4M

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aircraft "dot" range
« Reply #2 on: August 20, 2001, 05:39:00 AM »
Nice idea, funked!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Offline Zigrat

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« Reply #3 on: August 20, 2001, 10:00:00 AM »
i would not want to shorten the dot range, but definitely i would make the dots the color of the airplane. the problem is that the dots are black. black shows up alot more against the background than the green of a zeke or the blue of a f4u might.

Offline Furious

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« Reply #4 on: August 20, 2001, 11:01:00 AM »
I am pretty sure I can see an aircraft alot further away that 15,000 ft.  Chuck Yeager said we could see enemy craft up to 50 miles away.  Decreasing the distance at which an aircraft is visible is not a valid solution to our ability to pick out aircraft from the background.  Coloring the dots might help.

F.

BTW  I think it is much easier for lower pilots to spot higher aircraft, there’s just fewer options…as it should be.

Offline Eagler

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« Reply #5 on: August 20, 2001, 12:03:00 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Furious:
Chuck Yeager said we could see enemy craft up to 50 miles away.

that was a helluva big enemy aircraft  :)
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Offline Buzzbait

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aircraft "dot" range
« Reply #6 on: August 20, 2001, 01:17:00 PM »
S!

I raised a point similar to this earlier.

I fly a P-47 a lot, and I guess for that reason you could call me an `Alt Monkey`.  I have noticed a few things when at high altitude looking for contacts:

1)  You can see a contact well at 10.0+ distance.  At these ranges, the contact is a single black dot.  This stands out well against any background.

2)  At shorter ranges, 6.1-10.0, the contact`s visual characteristics change.  The dot becomes coloured and multi-pixelled.  This makes it almost impossible see against ground clutter.  Often I find a contact I`ve spotted will dissapear, and I have to head to the what I can estimate to be the correct area, and wait for the Red Icon to appear.  Many times I find myself overshooting, or losing contact completely.

In real life, it was true that aircraft were often less noticeable against multi-textured and coloured ground when viewed from above.

The opposite was true of aircraft silhouetted against solid overcast clouds or against ground covered with snow.

Experienced pilots when in a situation where a solid overcast existed, would often go down to the deck, rather than fly just above or below a solid mass of cloud.

I like the idea of a target being difficult to pick up against ground clutter.

My problem is with the ease at which one can pick up an aircraft a longer ranges, as the single black dot.  

Perhaps as suggested, the dots could be coloured, so they are less visible against the ground.

Or perhaps the overall range at which the dots can be seen could be reduced.  Of course that solution would remove the possibility of seeing an aircraft in ideal situations as when it is silhoetted against a cloud formation etc.

Offline SKurj

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aircraft "dot" range
« Reply #7 on: August 20, 2001, 01:59:00 PM »
Furious... perhaps Chuck could see an aircraft at that range if the air was as clear and cloud free as AH.
I dunno if any of you have checked out ww2ol... its hard to spot an aircraft at distance there, and it can be even harder to maintain sight.
If we must have unlimited vision, then we need more haze, clouds etc etc

The coloured dot was suggested aloong time ago, by yours truly, and yes thats at least better than what we have now.  Colour the dot the main colour of the aircraft and then lighten it abit so it blends in abit better to the sky.  Just main colour when viewed from above.

Chuck likely could see the reflection of the sun off a shiny part of the AC

SKurj

SKurj

Offline funkedup

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« Reply #8 on: August 20, 2001, 02:31:00 PM »
Remember that we are looking at a 90 degree field of view compressed down to about 30 degrees, depending on how big your monitor is and how close you are sitting.  Actually 30 degrees is probably more than most players.  But it's a round number.

So with 90 degrees displayed in only 30 degrees, aircraft appear about 3 times smaller than in real life.  At long ranges the apparent size of an object is inversely related to the viewing distance.  So if they appear 3 times smaller than real life, it's like they were 3 times more distant.  Therefore we're going to need some kind of crutch if we want to spot them as well as in real life.

That (and a few other similar display limitations) is why I want the flicker if they get rid of the black dots.

Offline funkedup

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« Reply #9 on: August 20, 2001, 02:35:00 PM »
PS
Doing some quick calcs:

Seeing an object one pixel wide at 1024 resolution in a 30 degree field of view requires the same acuity as spotting a 30 foot wide object at 11 miles.  That's 19.6k in AH units.  Think about that one.

[ 08-20-2001: Message edited by: funkedup ]

Offline Dinger

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« Reply #10 on: August 20, 2001, 05:40:00 PM »
Yeah, the problem isn't whether we can see the object, but whether we notice it.  As it is, a black dot of color X against a texture/sky background of color Y shows up a lot easier than it does in real life.

Funked's right.  The answer is to make it flicker between transparent and general fuselage color.

Offline funkedup

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« Reply #11 on: August 20, 2001, 05:44:00 PM »
Well I don't know if it's the answer.  I do know that the flickering dots in WB work great.  Except for the Wonder Woman P-47D graphics error.   :)

Offline Sancho

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« Reply #12 on: August 20, 2001, 05:50:00 PM »
hehe invisible p47s.  all you see is wingtips.  gotta love it  :)

Offline popeye

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« Reply #13 on: August 21, 2001, 02:43:00 PM »
No radar, hide the dots...    Why not just turn your monitor off?     ;)
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Offline Fury

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« Reply #14 on: August 21, 2001, 03:34:00 PM »
I agree with what Dinger said.  It's easier to track a black dot.