Author Topic: Trojan  (Read 1871 times)

Offline earl1937

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Trojan
« on: September 08, 2013, 04:08:52 PM »
 :airplane: While this is not an aircraft in Aces High, nor would we have any use for it, but since thousands of military, both Air Force and Navy, Marine and Coast Guard trained in this great aircraft, and there are probably some in this game that trained on this bird, I thought it might be of interest to look at. Designed to replace the World War II era T-6 trainer, the T-28 possessed higher performance than its forerunner and was easier to maintain. Also, the Trojan's tricycle landing gear taught pilots to take off and land in the same fashion as the high-performance aircraft they were training to fly.The first T-28 flew in September 1949, and the T-28A entered production in 1950. An 800-hp engine powered the U.S. Air Force version (T-28A) while the later U.S. Navy versions (T-28B and C) were powered by a 1,425-hp engine. When production ended, North American had built a total of 1,948 T-28s. Beginning in 1962 the USAF modified more than 200 T-28As as tactical fighter-bombers for counterinsurgency warfare. Equipped with 1,425-hp engines, these airplanes (redesignated the T-28D "Nomad") were effective weapons for close air support against enemy troops in Southeast Asia. The USAF replaced the T-28 as a primary trainer in the mid-1950s with the piston-engined Beech T-34 Mentor and jet-powered Cessna T-37. Trojans, however, continued to be flown by the Air National Guard until the late 1950s, and by the U.S. Navy into the 1980s.
The Air Force's T-28A

The U.S. Navy version of this aircraft was the T-28B, with a slightly larger engine, but was basically the same aircraft.
This is a pic of a restored T-28B which is privately owned.

The T-28 was a good trainer, had a lot of dihedral in the wings, good power, R-1300, was a very good instrument trainer. I had the pleasure of doing my advance and instrument training in this bird and enjoyed every minute of the time I had in it.
The durability of this aircraft was proved to me one night in Florida, as I was scheduled to take my first night cross country flight from Graham to Mcdill, to Jacksonville, to Moody at Valdosta and return. Tallahassee was reporting 8K broken, Tampa, 5k, 10k overcast with light rain showers. Orlando, Jacksonville, both with 15k scatted, 25k high cirrus. Gosh, this is going to be a snap, and try out my brand new instrument citation.
 First leg over the gulf, with a touch and go at Mcdill. After takeoff, I had filed for 11,000, thinking that would put above the cloud layer at 8k, but after entering clouds if I remember right around 6 or 7k, was IFR for sure all the way to Mcdill. Shot the approach, departed on 2nd leg to Orlando, Daytona Beach, then to Jax Naval air station. After climbing out I finally broke on top at 11K and I then notice to the Northwest, a LOT of lightening in the distance. After leaving Daytona VOR, and turning to the North, the lightening was getting closer and more pronounced towards my intended path of flight. Poof, I am back in the clouds, and talking to Jax center about weather. Suggested I fly 060 for a few minutes to go around TS directly in my path. OK, then he turned me back 330 and cleared me to Naval Tacan at Jacksonville and that was the last thing I hear on the radio the rest of the flight. Nav was OK, so had to make sure and fly my filed route, so as to not run into anyone. Everything OK until about 1/2 way between Jax and Moultrie VOR, then heavy, heavy rain and hard jolts of turbulence and was having difficulty holding heading, so just decided to forget heading and keep it right side up and when I get thru, I will re=establish my VOR track. After about 10 min's of shark raving mad bumps and up-drafts and down-drafts, I broke out into to clear air. First thing I noticed was vehicle traffic on my right and I am thinking, I-10 should be on my left, so cross checked everything, returned to my VOR track and finally figured out that was traffic on I-75 which was East of Moultrie and lo and behold, there was Moody AFB on my left, right where it was supposed to be. Rest of flight, pc of cake, but after that, never worried about pulling a wing off that T-28A Trojan. Great Aircraft!!
Blue Skies and wind at my back and wish that for all!!!

Offline earl1937

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Re: Trojan
« Reply #1 on: September 11, 2013, 05:15:05 PM »
:airplane: While this is not an aircraft in Aces High, nor would we have any use for it, but since thousands of military, both Air Force and Navy, Marine and Coast Guard trained in this great aircraft, and there are probably some in this game that trained on this bird, I thought it might be of interest to look at. Designed to replace the World War II era T-6 trainer, the T-28 possessed higher performance than its forerunner and was easier to maintain. Also, the Trojan's tricycle landing gear taught pilots to take off and land in the same fashion as the high-performance aircraft they were training to fly.The first T-28 flew in September 1949, and the T-28A entered production in 1950. An 800-hp engine powered the U.S. Air Force version (T-28A) while the later U.S. Navy versions (T-28B and C) were powered by a 1,425-hp engine. When production ended, North American had built a total of 1,948 T-28s. Beginning in 1962 the USAF modified more than 200 T-28As as tactical fighter-bombers for counterinsurgency warfare. Equipped with 1,425-hp engines, these airplanes (redesignated the T-28D "Nomad") were effective weapons for close air support against enemy troops in Southeast Asia. The USAF replaced the T-28 as a primary trainer in the mid-1950s with the piston-engined Beech T-34 Mentor and jet-powered Cessna T-37. Trojans, however, continued to be flown by the Air National Guard until the late 1950s, and by the U.S. Navy into the 1980s.
(Image removed from quote.) The Air Force's T-28A

The U.S. Navy version of this aircraft was the T-28B, with a slightly larger engine, but was basically the same aircraft.
(Image removed from quote.) This is a pic of a restored T-28B which is privately owned.

The T-28 was a good trainer, had a lot of dihedral in the wings, good power, R-1300, was a very good instrument trainer. I had the pleasure of doing my advance and instrument training in this bird and enjoyed every minute of the time I had in it.
The durability of this aircraft was proved to me one night in Florida, as I was scheduled to take my first night cross country flight from Graham to Mcdill, to Jacksonville, to Moody at Valdosta and return. Tallahassee was reporting 8K broken, Tampa, 5k, 10k overcast with light rain showers. Orlando, Jacksonville, both with 15k scatted, 25k high cirrus. Gosh, this is going to be a snap, and try out my brand new instrument citation.
 First leg over the gulf, with a touch and go at Mcdill. After takeoff, I had filed for 11,000, thinking that would put above the cloud layer at 8k, but after entering clouds if I remember right around 6 or 7k, was IFR for sure all the way to Mcdill. Shot the approach, departed on 2nd leg to Orlando, Daytona Beach, then to Jax Naval air station. After climbing out I finally broke on top at 11K and I then notice to the Northwest, a LOT of lightening in the distance. After leaving Daytona VOR, and turning to the North, the lightening was getting closer and more pronounced towards my intended path of flight. Poof, I am back in the clouds, and talking to Jax center about weather. Suggested I fly 060 for a few minutes to go around TS directly in my path. OK, then he turned me back 330 and cleared me to Naval Tacan at Jacksonville and that was the last thing I hear on the radio the rest of the flight. Nav was OK, so had to make sure and fly my filed route, so as to not run into anyone. Everything OK until about 1/2 way between Jax and Moultrie VOR, then heavy, heavy rain and hard jolts of turbulence and was having difficulty holding heading, so just decided to forget heading and keep it right side up and when I get thru, I will re=establish my VOR track. After about 10 min's of shark raving mad bumps and up-drafts and down-drafts, I broke out into to clear air. First thing I noticed was vehicle traffic on my right and I am thinking, I-10 should be on my left, so cross checked everything, returned to my VOR track and finally figured out that was traffic on I-75 which was East of Moultrie and lo and behold, there was Moody AFB on my left, right where it was supposed to be. Rest of flight, pc of cake, but after that, never worried about pulling a wing off that T-28A Trojan. Great Aircraft!!
:airplane: I am having a hard time believing that out of 97 views on this aircraft, that no one else in here ever flew the T-28!!
Blue Skies and wind at my back and wish that for all!!!

Offline GScholz

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Re: Trojan
« Reply #2 on: September 11, 2013, 08:17:07 PM »
I've always thought is was one of the coolest looking trainers ever made.
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Offline Puma44

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Re: Trojan
« Reply #3 on: September 11, 2013, 09:52:38 PM »
:airplane: I am having a hard time believing that out of 97 views on this aircraft, that no one else in here ever flew the T-28!!
I'll tag up Earl.  Two different friends have owned them.  I got LOA from a friend at Valdosta.  He was a pure bred war bird nut.  He and his son had a pristine Stearman (got an hour or so in that too).  They had a T-34.  Didn't fly that, spar issues kept it in the hangar.  They acquired a nice T-28 out of the Tucson boneyard.  My bud, Coke Stuart, "checked me out" one Saturday morning and signed me off with a now extinct LOA.  It was a fun aircraft to fly and certainly has that "Big" feel to it, but very responsive.  Coke later traded his T-28 and acquired a TBM.  One day he got a call from D.C. asking if his aircraft could be used for President Bush's inaugural parade.  They told Coke all his expenses would be paid and they would like him to sit in the aircraft which would ride on a flat bed during the parade, and oh, by the way, could they paint the aircraft in the President's wartime unit colors, and they would pay to repaint it back to a scheme of his choice after the parade.  Talk about a sweet deal!  
« Last Edit: September 11, 2013, 09:54:16 PM by Puma44 »



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Offline Zacherof

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Re: Trojan
« Reply #4 on: September 11, 2013, 09:53:21 PM »
to me the gear and wing look to close to the engine but what do i know :rolleyes:
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Offline Tupac

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Re: Trojan
« Reply #5 on: September 12, 2013, 12:41:49 AM »
I got to fly in a T28 when I was 7 or 8 - too young to appreciate it at the time. Been looking all over for a picture of it - it was called chitty chitty bang bang.
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Offline earl1937

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Re: Trojan
« Reply #6 on: September 13, 2013, 03:00:07 PM »
to me the gear and wing look to close to the engine but what do i know :rolleyes:
:airplane: The C.G. envelope dictates to the designer sometimes to move "Capitol" items, such as wing, engines, (sometimes they have extenders on the dynafocal mounts to adjust CG travel envelope), landing gear attach points and etc. It depends entirely on how much the designer wants the CG to move forward and back. Back in the WW2 days, the test aircraft would usually tell the engineers if the CG needed to be moved forward or backward, depending on how the aircraft trimed out. Example: if the elevator trim had to be all the way forward or nose down, to maintain level flight at design cruise speed, then the CG needed to be moved to the rear. The ideal trim settings would be 0 for elevator, 0 for rudder and 0 for ailerons at the design cruise speed. The trims are for other than normal cruise speeds, and or weight considerations.
Blue Skies and wind at my back and wish that for all!!!

Offline GScholz

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Re: Trojan
« Reply #7 on: September 13, 2013, 09:48:06 PM »
The ideal trim settings would be 0 for elevator, 0 for rudder and 0 for ailerons at the design cruise speed. The trims are for other than normal cruise speeds, and or weight considerations.

An often overlooked detail. Trimming an aircraft incurs a drag penalty. The Concorde transfered fuel between fore and aft tanks to balance trim; if it would have had to use conventional trimming of control surfaces it would never have made a transatlantic flight.
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Offline Rich46yo

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Re: Trojan
« Reply #8 on: September 14, 2013, 04:04:26 AM »
Saw this one again when I went down to lackland to see my kid graduate.

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Offline bustr

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Re: Trojan
« Reply #9 on: September 14, 2013, 07:09:42 AM »
Nope, I only helped herd Holsteins 30ft off the ground around a pasture, then chased a school bus down a back country road, and finally bounced several twins on the way to BWI looking for my father ferrying a twin baron from Harrisburg to BWI for John K. Hinson of Hinson Airways.

Now the lie we told the FAA was monumental when we got to BWI. "Honest sir, it was the other T-28 in orange and white heading north". I still remember the look on the faces of the two kids in the back seat of the bus when we pulled up behind them.

My father has passed on but, this is the old man who soloed on his own dime at the London gliding club while a Sgt in the USAF at Dunstable Downs, England. Was taught powered flight in an Austor by the Mayor of Peshawar at the Peshawar Airfeild and eventualy worked his way up to 4 engine commercial instructor. For a time he was chief pilot and instructor for John K. Hinson. All while in the beginning earning his certs he was a Russian Linguist for the USAFSS and then a code breaker for NSA and not considered pilot worthy by the regular USAF. He was working on his commercial jet ticket in his 60's when he was grounded for a bad ticker requiring a pacemaker. For a man considered not pilot worthy....

His legacy WEB page: http://www.oocities.org/cd19/

At the bottom of his page is a picture of him in the glider he soloed in to get his Silver Cert. His web page tells you he was a pilot not a web designer.

My father delivered a heart that saved a child on a Christmas Day in bad weather. It was her last chance for a transplant. My father wrote articles after he retired and here is the story.

http://www.oocities.org/cd19/foggy.html

Bio on John K. Hinson who was also a friend of Charles Lindbergh.

http://www.oocities.org/cd19/hinson.htm
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Offline earl1937

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Re: Trojan
« Reply #10 on: September 14, 2013, 08:39:03 AM »
Nope, I only helped herd Holsteins 30ft off the ground around a pasture, then chased a school bus down a back country road, and finally bounced several twins on the way to BWI looking for my father ferrying a twin baron from Harrisburg to BWI for John K. Hinson of Hinson Airways.

Now the lie we told the FAA was monumental when we got to BWI. "Honest sir, it was the other T-28 in orange and white heading north". I still remember the look on the faces of the two kids in the back seat of the bus when we pulled up behind them.

My father has passed on but, this is the old man who soloed on his own dime at the London gliding club while a Sgt in the USAF at Dunstable Downs, England. Was taught powered flight in an Austor by the Mayor of Peshawar at the Peshawar Airfeild and eventualy worked his way up to 4 engine commercial instructor. For a time he was chief pilot and instructor for John K. Hinson. All while in the beginning earning his certs he was a Russian Linguist for the USAFSS and then a code breaker for NSA and not considered pilot worthy by the regular USAF. He was working on his commercial jet ticket in his 60's when he was grounded for a bad ticker requiring a pacemaker. For a man considered not pilot worthy....

His legacy WEB page: http://www.oocities.org/cd19/

At the bottom of his page is a picture of him in the glider he soloed in to get his Silver Cert. His web page tells you he was a pilot not a web designer.

My father delivered a heart that saved a child on a Christmas Day in bad weather. It was her last chance for a transplant. My father wrote articles after he retired and here is the story.

http://www.oocities.org/cd19/foggy.html

Bio on John K. Hinson who was also a friend of Charles Lindbergh.

http://www.oocities.org/cd19/hinson.htm
:airplane: What a great story about a part of aviation history!  :salute Thanks for sharing this with us! :angel:
Blue Skies and wind at my back and wish that for all!!!

Offline earl1937

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Re: Trojan
« Reply #11 on: September 14, 2013, 08:41:36 AM »
Saw this one again when I went down to lackland to see my kid graduate.

(Image removed from quote.)
:airplane: A truly great trainer and for those who did not get to fly this little bird, you missed out on a pleasure each time you strapped it on. This pic looks like the way all of ours were painted at Graham.
Blue Skies and wind at my back and wish that for all!!!

Offline swareiam

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Re: Trojan
« Reply #12 on: October 24, 2013, 09:32:07 PM »
I have flown a T-6 but not a T-28  :cry
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Offline earl1937

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Re: Trojan
« Reply #13 on: October 25, 2013, 02:24:08 PM »
I have flown a T-6 but not a T-28  :cry
:airplane: Whole different aircraft! If you can fly the T-6, the 28's would be no problem. Plenty of power, good cruise speed and very docile at slow speeds. In addition to being an advanced trainer for aerobatics, it was and is a great instrument platform for IFR work. The dihedral in the wing makes it a very stable aircraft and the rudder is large enough to make pretty decent 4 point rolls. If you make a bad landing in the "Trogan", its was because you tried to! As a ground attack aircraft, from the stories I have been told about them, they were a very stable platform to fire weapons from and could take a beating from ground ack and still get the guy home!
Blue Skies and wind at my back and wish that for all!!!

Offline swareiam

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Re: Trojan
« Reply #14 on: October 26, 2013, 06:28:44 AM »
:airplane: Whole different aircraft! If you can fly the T-6, the 28's would be no problem. Plenty of power, good cruise speed and very docile at slow speeds. In addition to being an advanced trainer for aerobatics, it was and is a great instrument platform for IFR work. The dihedral in the wing makes it a very stable aircraft and the rudder is large enough to make pretty decent 4 point rolls. If you make a bad landing in the "Trogan", its was because you tried to! As a ground attack aircraft, from the stories I have been told about them, they were a very stable platform to fire weapons from and could take a beating from ground ack and still get the guy home!

ET,

I Remember about 14 or 15 years ago, I was standing on the edge of the taxiway at College Park Airport Maryland. It was our annual airshow there. A T-28 taxied by and the amount of noise coming out of that radial engine was horrendous. As the pilot made his low crowd pleasers during his demo, the engine reminded me of an out of maintenance washing machine. It made sort of a "Jing Jing Jing BANG!" "Jing Jing Jing BANG!" sound. I'll never forget that.

Is that your experience with the aircraft?
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Aces High Scenario, FSO, and Combat Challenge Teams
Don't let your ego get too close to your position, so that if your position gets shot down, your ego doesn't go with it. General Colin Powell