Author Topic: Global.....Cooling?  (Read 1927 times)

Offline Changeup

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Re: Global.....Cooling?
« Reply #30 on: November 05, 2013, 07:54:40 AM »
Unfortunately, the scientific community is not objective as they should be. Know who paid for a study, know who is paying a scientists paycheck and you can make an educated guess on which way the conclusions will fall out.

One big telltale about the increase in our planets mean temp is the fact that the oceans mean temp, the biggest Earth heat sink going, has risen 1 degree. This is measurable. Coral reefs are dying from the increase in temp. From Florida to the great barrier reef, all are at hazard. This is the bottom of the worlds food chain with issues. One cannot look at year to year fluxuations, its the longer spans of time that show trends.

500 years from now, Earth's crude oil will be depleted. Oil is the basis for so many modern day materials that to burn it in cars is insane behavior. As oil disappears all things will cost more, food and materials alike. Rudolph Diesel invented the diesel combustion engine to run on peanut oil, PEANUT OIL! Cannot get anymore renewable than that. Yet...................... Rudolph Diesel boarded a boat, I forget to where, he never got off that boat, he disappeared while on the water, never to be seen again.

Henry Fords wife drove an electric car. Imagine where battery tech would be now if we did not discover crude oil or had it forced on us by the few who reap the profits.

Now mistakes happen, we learn, we grow, we progress, hopefully. But once the obvious has been pointed out, those mistakes should not be allowed to perpetuate further. Whats the definition of insanity...............doing the same thing over and over again, expecting a different result..............

Right now our culture is about making billionaires, not everyone can be a billionaire. Why do peeps need more money than there are people on the planet?
Why do we consistently allow the ships captain to guzzle moonshine, whilest at the helm, at low tide, in reef infested waters?
Its beyond me.

Sweet crude is done in 60 years
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Offline pembquist

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Re: Global.....Cooling?
« Reply #31 on: November 05, 2013, 12:03:47 PM »
I was thinking the other day about energy and I had a thought, what would the world look like today if nuclear power had been discovered in the 19th century,(I don't mean the bomb.) The nuclear power advocates say it is green power and I was wondering if we would all be driving electric cars and the legacy of oil/coal's downside wouldn't exist and how bad the radioactive waste etc. would be by comparison. Better? Worse? The same?
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Offline Changeup

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Re: Global.....Cooling?
« Reply #32 on: November 05, 2013, 02:14:23 PM »
I was thinking the other day about energy and I had a thought, what would the world look like today if nuclear power had been discovered in the 19th century,(I don't mean the bomb.) The nuclear power advocates say it is green power and I was wondering if we would all be driving electric cars and the legacy of oil/coal's downside wouldn't exist and how bad the radioactive waste etc. would be by comparison. Better? Worse? The same?

Until nuclear power becomes portable (SSBN's notwithstanding) you won't be able to measure it's affect.
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Offline pembquist

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Re: Global.....Cooling?
« Reply #33 on: November 05, 2013, 07:53:11 PM »
I was thinking with regard to portability that battery technology would have had much more of an impetus. It's counter factual history day dreaming anyway.
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Offline Brooke

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Re: Global.....Cooling?
« Reply #34 on: November 05, 2013, 11:16:37 PM »
Nuclear power has the potential to be an excellent power source (safe, non-polluting, abundant).  Unfortunately, for a lot of reasons (non-standard reactor designs, bureaucracy-induced ossification, etc. and public opposition), it never achieved that potential.

I started out in high school as being anti fission.  I went into plasma physics and fusion reactor design thinking that the world needed fusion.  But in nuclear engineering where I was (BSE in nuclear engineering from the University of Michigan), even when you are studying fusion, you thoroughly learned about fission reactors as well.  I went from being anti fission to pro fission as a result of the knowledge gained.

Offline Scherf

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Re: Global.....Cooling?
« Reply #35 on: November 06, 2013, 08:08:05 AM »
I can't see why anyone would be anti-fusion.

Some of the best times I've ever had have involved some form of fusion or another.

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Offline Slate

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Re: Global.....Cooling?
« Reply #36 on: November 06, 2013, 10:54:07 AM »
   Weather forecasting is the easiest job in the world.  :old:

    You can be wrong half the time and never get fired as long as you look good.  ;)

    There's a chance the world may get warmer, there's also a chance it will get colder.  :D

     I predict there is a 50% chance of rain where you live.  :bolt:
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Offline Megalodon

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Re: Global.....Cooling?
« Reply #37 on: November 06, 2013, 02:16:53 PM »
Nuclear power has the potential to be an excellent power source (safe, non-polluting, abundant).  Unfortunately, for a lot of reasons (non-standard reactor designs, bureaucracy-induced ossification, etc. and public opposition), it never achieved that potential.



 Little things like earthquakes...

Hydrogen,
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Offline Brooke

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Re: Global.....Cooling?
« Reply #38 on: November 06, 2013, 02:25:54 PM »
Little things like earthquakes...

Hydrogen,

Those things are not difficult to deal with using appropriate designs.

Little things, like knowing a lot about nuclear reactor design, tell me that.  ;)

Offline MADe

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Re: Global.....Cooling?
« Reply #39 on: November 06, 2013, 03:50:24 PM »
Brooke,
Why do you say that nuclear fission plants are clean power?
The fuel rod leftovers are far from safe. The primary heat transfer coolant is far from safe. Both these items have a radioactive half life of thousands of years. We currently stockpile them in underground bunkers that will always be there full of radioactivity. Its currently far from a clean power supply.

I did see recently that radioactive thorium is being tested as a replacement for uranium, its preliminary testing shows great promise but it is years away. 

Solar and wind are currently the only true clean power, yet our current industry leaders insist on centrally located power generation facilities that can meter out electricity for profit. The northeast power blackouts of late have shown the folly of centrally located power distribution. Our power grid is flawed, old and drastically behind the times. The recent catastrophe in Japan should have been a wake up call. Stupid planning and greed do not mix with nuclear power generation. We have yet to see the consequences of Japans idiocy, those plants are leaking radioactivity directly into the ocean as I type.

I'm not against nuclear power by any means, I am just against how we currently go about it. Again, no one alive today will pay the price. Those in the future will bear the brunt.
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Offline Brooke

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Re: Global.....Cooling?
« Reply #40 on: November 06, 2013, 06:32:43 PM »
I say that nuclear is clean in that there are ways to do it that result in no air pollution and no CO2 production and such that the waste produced is handled without any threat to people or using up any useful land.

Radioactive half life is irrelevant.  Just about everything has a half life.  You have a radioactive half life.  The longer the half life, the less radioactive it is, generally speaking.  The world naturally has lots of radioactive stuff in it already, and we don't fret all that much about it.  The best way to have waste is for everything that is harmful to be in the smallest physical space, then put it somewhere where you don't have to worry about it.  That is how nuclear can be as opposed to, say, fossil fuels that release a zillion tons of stuff into the air, water, and soil that people don't generally fret that much about (other than CO2, which shouldn't be a major concern in my opinion, but that's another discussion), including releasing more radioactivity into the environment than from nuclear power except for egregious accidents that are easy to eliminate if the world weren't so stupid about how it does nuclear power.

Wind is almost useless as a main power source -- just not enough of it to matter in a big way.  Solar eventually will be the world's power source, but it has to be cheaper still to be that.  Also, if you are thinking of solar as semiconductor-based photovoltaics, think about what waste is created in making those wafers.  It is not insignificant in hazard or volume.

"Those in the future will bear the brunt" [of nuclear power.]  I don't think that there will be a brunt to pay (and that is despite some nations having handled nuclear power in about the stupidest way possible).  If the world did nuclear power in a more rational way (ways that are technically and economically feasible since the 1970-80's if not earlier), there would be few or no problems at all.

Offline pembquist

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Re: Global.....Cooling?
« Reply #41 on: November 06, 2013, 07:52:16 PM »
except for egregious accidents that are easy to eliminate if the world weren't so stupid about how it does nuclear power.


There's your problem in a nutshell, but that's the way of things isn't it? My daydreaming was really thinking of comparative screw ups, 150 years of nuclear oops vs 150 years of things like slurry pond oops, permanent fire oops, oil spill oops and carbon oops.
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Offline blkblade

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Re: Global.....Cooling?
« Reply #42 on: November 06, 2013, 08:26:23 PM »
Nuclear fusion is the future. And it always will be.
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Offline Bodhi

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Re: Global.....Cooling?
« Reply #43 on: November 06, 2013, 08:32:44 PM »
Sweet crude is done in 60 years

lol, it was supposed to be done in the '90's.  They weren't write then.

It was supposed to be done in the 2000's.... not right again.

These ultra melons making these predictions are fools.
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Offline mtnman

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Re: Global.....Cooling?
« Reply #44 on: November 06, 2013, 08:44:14 PM »
These ultra melons making these predictions are fools.

Wouldn't it be something if the guys making those predictions had anything to do with the guys wrecking our ecosystems with their blasted wind farms?
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