P38J P38L engines?

[Randy1]

Is the L modeled in AH an early version of the L having the lower rated HP engines like the J? 

I would have thought the L modeled would have been a later production model with the higher rated engines.

I am a bit confused still on the same performance numbers we see in the J and L.

[FLS]

The identical performance figures suggest that it's the same engine in the J and L.

[Widewing]

The identical performance figures suggest that it's the same engine in the J and L.

The P-38J was fitted with V-1710 F-17 engines, and the P-38L was fitted with the V-1710 F-30.

The F-17 engine was rated by Allison at 1,600 hp in WEP. The F-30 engine was rated by Allison at 1,725 hp in WEP. The USAAF, in the interest of reliability, de-rated the F-30 to 1,600 hp. Aces High models the de-rated F-30 in the P-38L.

[FLS]

Thanks Widewing I couldn't remember the details.

[Randy1]

The P-38J was fitted with V-1710 F-17 engines, and the P-38L was fitted with the V-1710 F-30.

The F-17 engine was rated by Allison at 1,600 hp in WEP. The F-30 engine was rated by Allison at 1,725 hp in WEP. The USAAF, in the interest of reliability, de-rated the F-30 to 1,600 hp. Aces High models the de-rated F-30 in the P-38L.

I thought I had read the USAAF ended up splitting the difference between the factory rating on the F-17 and the F-30.

[Randy1]

I found this thread back in 2006.  The debate was a good one.  Although the conscientious  is the P38L was widely not derated or full derated in field there is no known offical documentation to pin this down.  What a shame.

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,173657.0.html

[FLS]

There are many accounts of mechanics trusting pilots to handle more than the rated power. In AH we are limited to the official ratings.

[Randy1]

There are many accounts of mechanics trusting pilots to handle more than the rated power. In AH we are limited to the official ratings.

What we are missing is a USAF letter authorizing the mods.  I have read that the official setting was halfway between the Allison setting of the J setting but there is no document.  Its out there somewhere hopefully.

The L is castrated and it shouldn't be.

[FLS]

 I wouldn't worry about documentation. We match the pilot manual. A letter about a field mod won't change that.

[Randy1]

The best I can tell is the derating got tied up with the fuel grade change with no testing done to certify the L's new engines  to 150 octane therefore falling back to the J's Manifold pressure. 

Could be too, the P51's cost both intial and operating so undercut the cost of the 38s, the money and time for testing just wasn't there for the 38.

Now the next question is why is the eny so low for the L?

[save]

Because it carry same bomb load as medium bomber, and after drop turn into an very effective fighter. All other 38 you can easily outdive, but not the L.

You can try to figure out why the Mossie fighter that can carry 4 bombs and have 4 Hispanos and a couple of garden-party-shooters (.303), can turn and dogfight many contemporary planes, have a ENY of 30 though.

[Karnak]

You can try to figure out why the Mossie fighter that can carry 4 bombs and have 4 Hispanos and a couple of garden-party-shooters (.303), can turn and dogfight many contemporary planes, have a ENY of 30 though.

Low usage so far as I  an tell.  The ENY 30 of the Mossie VI was one of the ENY values I said were questionable just prior to the most recent ENY changes.  Every other aircraft I mentioned had its ENY changed to pretty much what I thought it should be, just not the Mossie VI, it stayed at 30.

[Randy1]

Because it carry same bomb load as medium bomber, and after drop turn into an very effective fighter. All other 38 you can easily outdive, but not the L.

You make a good point Save.

But I can counter with the P-47D40(ENY20) can carry the same load-out and is in its element, just as good of a fighter as the P38L.

There is a fair amount of agreement among the top P-38 drivers that in an all things equal fight the J would win over the L.  That would suggest to me the P38L is too low.

Just raising the ENY from 12 to 15 seem to be a touch better since it would avoid just about all ENY restrictions that I have encountered.

If HTC would give the full Allison rating to the L then the 12 would be fine.

HTC isn't wrong on the L from as FLS says per the manual but the P38L was like the pictures of the youngest child in a family.  The older child has lots of pictures but the youngest child will have few.  The L just doesn't have the documentation of the earlier p-38s.

The leg I am standing on is not too strong.  I will admit that.

[Ack-Ack]

There is a fair amount of agreement among the top P-38 drivers that in an all things equal fight the J would win over the L.  That would suggest to me the P38L is too low.

Which 'top P-38 drivers' have claimed that?  In an equal fight, it's a wash and whoever makes the first mistake is going to lose.

ack-ack

[Karnak]

I think the P-38L is a markedly better fighter in AH than is the P-47D-40.  It also gets its ordnance to the target faster by a significant margin.