Author Topic: Six months that changed aviation forever  (Read 724 times)

Offline SysError

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Six months that changed aviation forever
« on: November 16, 2014, 05:26:27 PM »
Interesting stuff, all within six months, 100 years ago.

two French airmen made history by becoming the first to shoot down an enemy aircraft

10 December 1914: The dawn of the aircraft carrier

21 December 1914: The first night bombing raid

1 April 1915: The first fighter plane scores its first victory

Plus lots more stuff.  Here:

http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20141010-six-months-that-changed-aviation


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Offline Someguy63

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Re: Six months that changed aviation forever
« Reply #1 on: November 16, 2014, 11:23:37 PM »
Interesting stuff, thanks for posting!  :aok
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Offline MrRiplEy[H]

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Re: Six months that changed aviation forever
« Reply #2 on: November 17, 2014, 08:51:43 AM »
It's missing all the important stuff like first passenger who writes 'Ebola danger' on a cup etc.  :D
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Offline cpxxx

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Re: Six months that changed aviation forever
« Reply #3 on: November 17, 2014, 10:37:49 AM »
Yes and all this 11 years after the Wright Brothers first powered flight! In our terms 2003. That's how recent it was.

I sometimes think flight could have come along a lot earlier than it did because the rapidity of it's development shows we humans were more than ready for it.

Offline MrRiplEy[H]

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Re: Six months that changed aviation forever
« Reply #4 on: November 17, 2014, 11:46:15 AM »
Yes and all this 11 years after the Wright Brothers first powered flight! In our terms 2003. That's how recent it was.

I sometimes think flight could have come along a lot earlier than it did because the rapidity of it's development shows we humans were more than ready for it.

I've always wondered: didn't paper gliders exist before the invention of flight? If they did, you'd think someone inevitably would have made a bigger scale attempt. Or was the concept of glider simply unheard of (as simple as it is to make). Makes you wonder what other simple discoveries still wait ahead.
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Offline SysError

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Re: Six months that changed aviation forever
« Reply #5 on: November 17, 2014, 01:00:39 PM »
Yes and all this 11 years after the Wright Brothers first powered flight! In our terms 2003. That's how recent it was.

I sometimes think flight could have come along a lot earlier than it did because the rapidity of it's development shows we humans were more than ready for it.

I'm no fan of the Wright Brothers.  I think that there is more than enough evidence to show that others were probably "first in flight".

Of all the claims that they were not the first, I think this one stands out:
http://www.history.com/news/in-connecticut-wright-brothers-no-longer-first-in-flight

I think that it stands not because Gustave Whitehead makes the claim (others have done so), it stands out because you have an American state changeling two other American states (NC and Ohio).  Claims of first in flight from outside the US are not going to go anywhere, (think of how the Romans dealt with their provinces when they stepped out of line), but within the US, it could get interesting.

I will admit that trying to explain to Americans that they probably were not the first in flight is a bit like trying to convince the English that Shakespeare
probably was not a glove maker from Stratford-upon-Avon.  You'll get the sympathetic ear of about 10% of the people.  The rest will either think you a fool and/or a harmless idiot. 

I think that the Wright Brothers contributed to the science of flight immensely.  Wing shapes for lift and flight controls.   Very important contributions.  But remember that they relied heavily on British and French work. 

Two are here:

George Cayley
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Cayley

Clément Ader
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cl%C3%A9ment_Ader

who

"Ader undertook the construction of a second aircraft he called the Avion II, also referred to as the Zephyr or Éole II. Most sources agree that work on this aircraft was never completed, and it was abandoned in favour of the Avion III. Ader's later claim that he flew the Avion II in August 1892 for a distance of 100 m (330 ft) in Satory near Paris,[8] was never widely accepted.[5]"


I think that the Wright Brothers should also be know for their very litigious actions against early aviators.  We know that a many prominent early aviators got out of aviation after the Wright Brother's lawyers went to town on them.

You tend not to read too many pieces on the real damage those brothers did.



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Offline DaveBB

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Re: Six months that changed aviation forever
« Reply #6 on: November 17, 2014, 04:41:18 PM »
Wright Brothers designed their aircraft, engine, and even the propeller.  They were also the first in powered flight. 
Currently ignoring Vraciu as he is a whoopeeed retard.

Offline SysError

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Re: Six months that changed aviation forever
« Reply #7 on: November 17, 2014, 05:59:34 PM »
Wright Brothers designed their aircraft, engine, and even the propeller.  They were also the first in powered flight. 

The Wright brothers were the first in controlled, powered, heavier than air flight.

First powered flight is probably:
"The Ader Éole, also called Avion, was an early steam-powered aircraft developed by Clément Ader...On 8 October 1890, the machine achieved a short flight of around 50 m (164 ft) at the Chateau d'Armainvilliers in Brie. It reached a height of around 20 cm (8 in)."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ader_%C3%89ole

Not much more than a "Hop" I suppose.


The Wright brothers' patent was for flight controls:
"The patent's importance lies in its claim of a new and useful method of controlling a flying machine, powered or not. The technique of wing-warping is described, but the patent explicitly states that other methods instead of wing-warping could be used for adjusting the outer portions of a machine's wings to different angles on the right and left sides to achieve lateral roll control."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wright_brothers_patent_war

I do not know much about the engine, or frame.  I do not think that they were seen as important as the controls.  BTW: The Wright brothers should be complemented on their use of wind tunnels to figure out wing shapes.  The French had messed up the tables and everyone was relying on them.  The brothers double checked them and figured out that they were wrong.  Big break through.
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Offline BaDkaRmA158Th

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Re: Six months that changed aviation forever
« Reply #8 on: November 17, 2014, 06:06:33 PM »
woah, looking at that thing..yea a hop is at best.


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Offline SysError

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Re: Six months that changed aviation forever
« Reply #9 on: November 17, 2014, 06:16:17 PM »
Orville's first flight was 120 feet, the second was 175 feet and the third about 200 feet.

I would call these "Hops" as well.

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Offline cpxxx

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Re: Six months that changed aviation forever
« Reply #10 on: November 18, 2014, 10:25:37 AM »
I'm well aware of the so called controversy over first flights ahead of the Wright brothers. Connecticut can believe what it likes but if Whitehead managed to attain powered flight in 1901 why was he never able to repeat the feat with his later designs?

Say what you like about the Wright brothers but even if the first flight was a mere hop. They repeated that hop, extended it and continued to develop and improve their aircraft. They were far ahead of anyone else for several years. Not one of the other so called contenders managed to do the same.

Now as is happens the Wright's designs were effectively an aeronautical blind alley plus their protectionist and litigious nature held back development in the United States allowing Europe, France in particular to progress past the US in developing aeronautics.

But it's hard to dispute their initial influence and place in history.

You must also credit Lilienthal for developing his gliders and the advancing knowledge of aerodynamics. I suspect only the absence of a practical engine prevented him from becoming the first man to take to the air in powered flight.

Offline SysError

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Re: Six months that changed aviation forever
« Reply #11 on: November 19, 2014, 03:14:15 PM »
Now as is happens the Wright's designs ... held back development in the United States allowing Europe, France in particular to progress past the US in developing aeronautics.

I follow and agree with most everything you say (thanks for Lilienthal reference - I forgot all about him), but I'm not sure I follow you on the above.  I think that everyone, including Europeans, were held back.

One example.

Claude Grahame-White  (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Claude_Grahame-White) was sued by the Wright Brothers for trying to sent up a flying school at the Hendon Aerodrome using Louis Bleriot's Blériot V (I may have model that he tried to buy wrong...).  I picked up a book on him when we visited the museum a few years ago.  (http://www.rafmuseum.org.uk/london/things-to-see-and-do/hangars/grahame-white-factory.aspx).  It was clear to me that the legal battle really had its toll on him.  Almost killed a major part of early English aviation.  In fact, I think that after all his legal and investments costs, it was his cabinet business that ever made any money for him.  (BTW, the guy had a string of bad legal luck throughout his life.  His first wife successfully sued him for divorce and won on the basis of him engaging in a gross pattern of (and I think I correctly remember the exact term used) A Denial of Conjugal Rights.  (I wonder how they measure that?).  Also the RAF sued him (or he sued them - do not remember right now) over a war contract.  At the end of the day, he had to sell his Aerodrome hangers to the RAF under strained circumstances).

I think that the Wright brothers only backed down from their lawsuits when the US Army sent up a trust (or fund) to pay for patent rights for military use during WWI.  (I do not know much about the trust/fund.  I'm going to look into it later.  Maybe someone else knows more about it and can post a reference). 





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