Author Topic: A thought  (Read 1260 times)

Offline wpeters

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A thought
« on: November 21, 2014, 11:38:29 AM »
 The other day I was talking with one of you guys and a thought was brought up that I thought maybe was worth sharing with you. I know much of this has been discussed in the past.

  We were talking about how unique this game is compared to many sims.  I also know how many times we knock the way HTC has set his business model. OK, we have a flight simulator game that has extremely stable flight characteristics. We also offer a mass system of ground warfare as far as vehicles go. This also includes the aspect that we have a game that is a MMO with server capacity of 600 players. With equalizing of the game through a 3rd Country...  We have new graphic's update on the way which looks amazing in many aspects...   

I guess the point I am going to bring up is HTC has set themselves up in very unique way with a option to become extremely unique.  It is this. I believe that we could become one of the only games that could accurately simulate WWll in more ways. Right now WWll online is the only simulator that is built around WWll in all aspects. Land (gv and FPS), naval and air.  Except that this game came out in 2006 with worse graphics than our game. 

I would like to see HTC start modeling some parts to this game that could be similar WWll online.   Antitank, Snipers, Infantry and Engineers(attach explosives to objects) right now.With the option for rifle men, grenadiers, machine gunners and sub-machine gunners. I can only think of the battles that would happen around TT with them involved.  Spawn points for the infantry would have to be moved closer to a objective but. Maybe something like a FOB some foxholes and bunkers or tents.

It is why I bring this up is their is no one in the market right now that can really cater to that niche in the market. 

Last of all is when you would choose to spawn a person you could choose what nationality you wanted and therefore the corresponding weapon.  Also when Barrack are down at a base there is know way of spawning at that base as a person.   

To add this into the game would also require 10 Ai troops to capture a base or 3 players or a combination of both.


Just thought it would make this a one of kind WWll sim and bring many more players. :salute
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Offline RufusLeaking

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Re: A thought
« Reply #1 on: November 21, 2014, 11:49:07 AM »
You describe the holy grail of simulators.

I don't mean to be negative, but there is a reason such a comprehensive simulator doesn't exist. In one word: Scale.

First, the scale in numbers of people in each branch of the service. The air forces were small in comparison to the land forces. There would need to be thousands of first person shooter people for the several hundred pilots.

Second, the scale of time and distance. A battle on the ground might cover a few miles. A aircraft can cross that distance in one minute.

I see the appeal of such a monster of a simulator. It will be a while, if ever, that such a thing is marketable.
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Offline xPoisonx

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Re: A thought
« Reply #2 on: November 21, 2014, 12:05:37 PM »
Won't happen with the current # of players
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Offline Someguy63

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Re: A thought
« Reply #3 on: November 21, 2014, 12:09:49 PM »
Well if we get more players that come for infantry action, then a lot of the air combat probably won't change since these new players will be on the ground. :mad:
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Offline Wiley

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Re: A thought
« Reply #4 on: November 21, 2014, 12:09:59 PM »
A lot of people come here seeming to think it's just as simple as 'flipping the FPS switch'.  Take a good look at any FPS that's been made in the last 4-5 years.  There is a metric ton of artwork and animation that goes into making the characters and guns move correctly, none of which currently exists in this game.

Also consider the graphics and terrain update screenshots we've seen.  Ok for a vehicle game?  Yes.  Good enough to create a decent FPS experience?  I don't think so.  Put the new town from the tank video HTC showed a while back beside COD.  There is a subtle difference.

It would be a far more extensive and time consuming change than the graphic update.

Also the scale stuff Rufus mentioned.  Doing such a thing would require hundreds of people in a small area all logged in and working at the same time.  Not afk in a foxhole burping their baby, not outside having a smoke, not popping in and out of game every ten minutes but all active and somewhat coordinated.  Otherwise it would be simple chaos.

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Offline wpeters

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Re: A thought
« Reply #5 on: November 21, 2014, 12:32:09 PM »
A lot of people come here seeming to think it's just as simple as 'flipping the FPS switch'.  Take a good look at any FPS that's been made in the last 4-5 years.  There is a metric ton of artwork and animation that goes into making the characters and guns move correctly, none of which currently exists in this game.

Also consider the graphics and terrain update screenshots we've seen.  Ok for a vehicle game?  Yes.  Good enough to create a decent FPS experience?  I don't think so.  Put the new town from the tank video HTC showed a while back beside COD.  There is a subtle difference.

It would be a far more extensive and time consuming change than the graphic update.

Also the scale stuff Rufus mentioned.  Doing such a thing would require hundreds of people in a small area all logged in and working at the same time.  Not afk in a foxhole burping their baby, not outside having a smoke, not popping in and out of game every ten minutes but all active and somewhat coordinated.  Otherwise it would be simple chaos.

Wiley.

That is true but also have you looked at the graphics of WWll online. Look at what they have.  I'd just like I am saying people will come for the experience not the graphics so much.  Think of the battles TT on the crater map.  To add those first 4 I said.  Would make the game hit a whole new simulation level. Also I know it would be nice to have houses to in.. But I would love to spawn in with 4-5 satchel charges and run like hell to get behind Cover before she blows. Or be a sniper picking off other anti tank players

I am talking about adding to the experience. Graphics don't mean a lot in the sense that they have to be CoD style.  If the experience is addictive the players will come back no matter.  Look at us if we wanted graphics we would be with War Thunder. 

My suggestion is try those 4 types.  If everyone likes it expand.  You could even offer free infantry.  In the end if it fills the arena it is a plus.  U sooner  play with 500 people than the 250 that we see today. 

Remember it is how the game makes u fill that keeps you,not the graphics.
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Offline Ratsy

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Re: A thought
« Reply #6 on: November 21, 2014, 01:21:56 PM »
If you wouldn't mind humoring me...

I had no idea that WWII Online was even still around.  At the time of the first Aces High Convention, Cornered Rat Software had the game in pre-Alpha, and HT and Pyro introduced two of the principal coders during the Con.  Nice guys - also from North Dallas - if I remember correctly.

The humoring part. Do you have a sense of how many players are left in WWII online?  I skimmed their forums and didn't see many clues about population.

You have an interesting idea, WP.  There is the notion of scale (as mentioned).  CRS says on their website that everything is on one server.  Based on what I know about WWII Online (from their beta a million years ago) was that the battle maps were basically small which meant that the airwar component was 'cramped'.  That's why I didn't make it past the beta.  Take off, climb safely for not long enough, furball at medium alt down to the deck, run out of ammo, and then run home (if you were lucky).  I wonder how big the server farm would have to be to have our airwar scale with FPS added in?

No harm in talking about it.

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Offline Gman

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Re: A thought
« Reply #7 on: November 21, 2014, 01:27:58 PM »
All good points for and against.

I brought this very idea up in a tread in GD about 6 months ago, the "if you were in charge what would you do" one.

IMO blending some free to play with our current game COULD work in terms of getting more subs and players.  This is how:

By creating a simple yet fun infantry and artillery experience, one where you could steer little groups of simple soldiers about like we drive tanks, and use the jeeps and GV transports to move them as well as letting them move more slowly on foot.  Incorporate some arty and mortars and such, and MGs etc for squads to employ.  It would also give the MGs on tanks something to do other than shoot at the very rare troop landings.  Anyhow, allow say 200 or so players in the arena to play these things for FREE.  They would mostly be targets for aircraft and other GVs, but it WOULD get people involved in the game that otherwise wouldn't be, and attract a certain percentage to getting the full subscription, so they too could fly planes and use the GVs other than say the Jeep and M16 and a towed arty piece.

It would do a few things IMO - give guys who like attacking ground stuff a lot of fun targets (infantry strafing, what more could you want, haha), it would create new kinds of fights regarding taking bases, it would give GVs more to do (attacking infantry formations), and it would most importantly bring new blood into the game.  Yes, the 200 slots for infantry/jeep/arty would be FREE in my idea, without access to any of the other stuff in the game, but many of these guys would sub up I believe.  Even when they wouldn't, it would give subscribers more targets and stuff to do like I said, which creates a circular fun environment which increases overall subscribers all round IMO.

The graphics wouldn't have to be any better than the troops we have now IMO, it wouldn't be a "fps" per say, just controlling small groups of troops at squad and platoon level say, and moving them about in GVs or with the wsad tank controls while on foot.  There could be rifles, MGs, mortars, Bazookas/Panzerfaust, Solothurns (20mm rifle pew pew pew), as well as being able to use crew served weapons like stationary guns and perhaps a mobile arty piece like I said.


Anyhow, I like the OP idea, as mine above was one I thought could help at little cost to HTC (I'm sure HT could make something like this work in days).  I fully believe that.  Remember the "Claw" and Mothership HT whipped up for that Con one year?  I swear, if they gave the Claw a Battlestar Galactica skin, they could have marketed that game and made a lot of $, having battlestars and fighters in space combat.  Making something like that - I have full confidence HT could make little infantry group units with say a 1/2 dozen weapon systems, and some towed arty pieces.  I think it would be a lot of fun.
« Last Edit: November 21, 2014, 01:31:48 PM by Gman »

Offline jolly22

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Re: A thought
« Reply #8 on: November 21, 2014, 01:31:02 PM »
F2P plane set? Very basic planes. D3A. B25. P47. 109. Spit. And that's it. they can play as long as they with those planes. All the other planes come with the (more reasonable) $9.99/Month.

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Offline Gman

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Re: A thought
« Reply #9 on: November 21, 2014, 01:35:41 PM »
I've thought about that too Jolly, I'm sure HTC has as well. 

I remember going through the big price drop, this game was 29.95 the first while it was out, which in Canadian $ was 55$ at the time.  Dropping the price had many effects, I"m sure Skuzzy/HT could list a lot of pros and cons, hopefully mostly pros.

I don't know if a price drop of 5$ would benefit them.  In order for it to be financially sound, they would need an increase of 33% in subs, n'est pas?  I don't think a price drop of that kind would increase the interest that much.  If you can afford 10, you can surely afford 15, so I don't see price as being a huge factor right now.  Just my opinion.

Your FPT idea is similar to mine, just with a few certain a/c.  I could get on board with adding a few planes like you said to my idea, really neutered planes though, in order for the model of generating interest in the more complex and effective planes to have a chance to work

Offline jolly22

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Re: A thought
« Reply #10 on: November 21, 2014, 01:46:56 PM »
I've thought about that too Jolly, I'm sure HTC has as well. 

I remember going through the big price drop, this game was 29.95 the first while it was out, which in Canadian $ was 55$ at the time.  Dropping the price had many effects, I"m sure Skuzzy/HT could list a lot of pros and cons, hopefully mostly pros.

I don't know if a price drop of 5$ would benefit them.  In order for it to be financially sound, they would need an increase of 33% in subs, n'est pas?  I don't think a price drop of that kind would increase the interest that much.  If you can afford 10, you can surely afford 15, so I don't see price as being a huge factor right now.  Just my opinion.

Your FPT idea is similar to mine, just with a few certain a/c.  I could get on board with adding a few planes like you said to my idea, really neutered planes though, in order for the model of generating interest in the more complex and effective planes to have a chance to work

Well I look at it like this. Most people playing computer games these days are kids >20. Most games per month, are sub $10. To kids, $15 is a lot more than $10. I honestly think it would make a huge difference once the graphics come out.

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Offline wpeters

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Re: A thought
« Reply #11 on: November 21, 2014, 01:56:14 PM »
If you wouldn't mind humoring me...

I had no idea that WWII Online was even still around.  At the time of the first Aces High Convention, Cornered Rat Software had the game in pre-Alpha, and HT and Pyro introduced two of the principal coders during the Con.  Nice guys - also from North Dallas - if I remember correctly.

The humoring part. Do you have a sense of how many players are left in WWII online?  I skimmed their forums and didn't see many clues about population.

You have an interesting idea, WP.  There is the notion of scale (as mentioned).  CRS says on their website that everything is on one server.  Based on what I know about WWII Online (from their beta a million years ago) was that the battle maps were basically small which meant that the airwar component was 'cramped'.  That's why I didn't make it past the beta.  Take off, climb safely for not long enough, furball at medium alt down to the deck, run out of ammo, and then run home (if you were lucky).  I wonder how big the server farm would have to be to have our airwar scale with FPS added in?

No harm in talking about it.

 :salute




Yes that makes sense.  But remember I said that if HTC took it they would be the one up on everyone else. They would have the monopoly.    How much fun would it be to sneak up behind Dr7 and drop a grenade in the open top of m18.


Those of you out there that have experience in graphic design speak up.  But tell me how hard would it be to make or model 4 set of Infantry from 2 nations.  It shouldn't be that hard.  Programing the GPS controls might take a little time.

But my inexperience tells me you could have 3-4 types of troops in a month.   Just tossing that out their. 

To me it just would make more fun to do that type of stuff.   Tight now I take a little time every week to play some sort of Fps and I love that type of game play
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Offline Wiley

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Re: A thought
« Reply #12 on: November 21, 2014, 02:12:43 PM »
Remember it is how the game makes u fill that keeps you,not the graphics.

Up to a point, but when you're considering Quake 1 levels of detail versus what else is available, I'm sorry but the number of people that would be willing to put up with it is infinitesimal.

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Offline kvuo75

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Re: A thought
« Reply #13 on: November 21, 2014, 04:13:10 PM »
Most people playing computer games these days are kids >20.

pretty sure you mean under 20, and I'm pretty sure it's wrong..


http://www.theesa.com/facts/gameplayer.asp

average age 31, 71% over the age of 18, 39% 36 or older, etc. etc.


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Offline jolly22

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Re: A thought
« Reply #14 on: November 21, 2014, 07:25:24 PM »
pretty sure you mean under 20, and I'm pretty sure it's wrong..


http://www.theesa.com/facts/gameplayer.asp

average age 31, 71% over the age of 18, 39% 36 or older, etc. etc.





Really? lol wow. Any other game I play I'm bombarded with squeekers... Maybe I'm playing kiddie games? :cry

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