Author Topic: Engine damage from running 100% too long...  (Read 1946 times)

Offline Mister Fork

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Re: Engine damage from running 100% too long...
« Reply #15 on: June 03, 2015, 01:42:47 PM »
Three things:

1. The Wishlist forum is now a great place to see who the trolls in our forum really are.  If you have nothing to add to the idea that say 'IT SUCKS' - or add a possible alternative or positive suggestion, just move along.  This was just an idea.  :mad:

2. This idea was to introduce a new dynamic. No different than auto-takeoff. Or the fact I don't have to control any mixture settings at different altitudes. Or how sitting on a rearm pad and your aircraft can automatically be refueled and rearmed in 30 seconds... cause all of those are SOOO realistic.  :rolleyes:

3. If all of you ACTUALLY read my first post, you might realise this idea was more for SEA/AVA arenas...hence the admin commands. Might not work for the MA. So you could turn that sheit off.   :angry:

Jebus guys, get over yourselves with your "NOT REAL - NO NO NO." What I want to say and what I will say is this...being a Canadian, I would say "I'm sorry." 
 
Oldman - thanks for your positive support, its appreciated...  :aok

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"Games are meant to be fun and fair but fighting a war is neither." - HiTech

Offline pembquist

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Re: Engine damage from running 100% too long...
« Reply #16 on: June 03, 2015, 03:32:35 PM »
Hey Mr. Fork. Sorry if I was negative, myself I have asked for night time arena, barrage balloons, and other stuff that gets the treatment. You didn't say anything about it being opt in and this being an argumentative place with very few neutral opinions don't worry about the flak, its deeply impersonal.

My thing about AH2 is I feel like the basic balance between realism/playability is really the best I have experienced. Most flight sims seem to confuse realism with familiarity with check lists. That never feels real to me because the physical interface is a keyboard and mouse. On the other hand joystick, throttle and rudder pedals physically approximate to some degree what flying a plane is like. The best part of AH is the aircraft handling and the view system. For more realistic engine management I would want support for simpit builders, but those are rare as hen's teeth and I suspect that having data to drive instruments and multiple displays opens the game up to hacking.

I would not be surprised if you would agree that AH is at its best during special events, the dar, icon range, and death aspects of it make it much more involving, I can see how another layer of complexification might enhance that. To that end I'll see your engine management and raise you paper maps, clouds, a decent compass and hold the GPS. On the other hand that might be too much for most players and the terrain would have to get a little less homogenous for pilotage. (Probably cooler for the bombers than the fighters.)
« Last Edit: June 03, 2015, 03:34:54 PM by pembquist »
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Offline bustr

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Re: Engine damage from running 100% too long...
« Reply #17 on: June 03, 2015, 03:59:21 PM »
Opt in, Opt out is the crux.

If Hitech created a higher layer of realism with a "DCS had hot steamy relations with IL2" engine management as the center peice. Then crammed it down on us in the MA. You would be playing in here with 12 friends wondering what happened to everyone else. If he created it such that you can toggle it on or off, so that when on, it was in it's full horrible glory. Off, it was AH business as usual. You and 12 friends would be the only players with it on. The rest would be kicking you to the curb in combat.

The uniqueness of AH is that the engine management is so Spartan, while the flight physics kills the competition. Until the economic crash in 2008, this attracted a great number of customers because you didn't have to spend all of your spare time remembering to manage your engine.

Consider like the AvA is a labor of love, if you persuaded Hitech to add a higher level of engine management in a toggle on\off mode. You would not be able to fill the AvA after the first week the CM's agreed to impose it. In the past for the sake of novelty, the AvA has attracted large numbers for a few days, then tapered off quickly.

The operative concept, you would have to convince someone to impose this for you on the rest of the community. Or given a choice, they would opt out to enhance their short period of fun seeking.
bustr - POTW 1st Wing


This is like the old joke that voters are harsher to their beer brewer if he has an outage, than their politicians after raising their taxes. Death and taxes are certain but, fun and sex is only now.

Offline Oldman731

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Re: Engine damage from running 100% too long...
« Reply #18 on: June 03, 2015, 08:53:07 PM »
If Hitech created a higher layer of realism with a "DCS had hot steamy relations with IL2" engine management as the center peice. Then crammed it down on us in the MA. You would be playing in here with 12 friends wondering what happened to everyone else. If he created it such that you can toggle it on or off, so that when on, it was in it's full horrible glory. Off, it was AH business as usual. You and 12 friends would be the only players with it on. The rest would be kicking you to the curb in combat.


They do this in the WWI arena with the prop governor.  Works fine.  No different from auto trim in the MA.

- oldman

Offline bustr

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Re: Engine damage from running 100% too long...
« Reply #19 on: June 03, 2015, 09:17:32 PM »
Lest we forget, by default that governor is enabled to protect the fun of paying customers. You have to opt to turn it off, meaning you have care to discover there is a choice. Or do you want to create imagery that is slightly blurred? And like the AvA, not many play in the WW1 arena.
bustr - POTW 1st Wing


This is like the old joke that voters are harsher to their beer brewer if he has an outage, than their politicians after raising their taxes. Death and taxes are certain but, fun and sex is only now.

Offline Volron

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Re: Engine damage from running 100% too long...
« Reply #20 on: June 03, 2015, 09:52:35 PM »

They do this in the WWI arena with the prop governor.  Works fine.  No different from auto trim in the MA.

- oldman

But the prop governor is an option that can be turned on/off, just like auto-trim.  The wish would call for a core change in which it can't be turn on/off by the player.

For the original wish, I can't agree with it completely (though I can see where you are coming from. :aok).  I've made a different suggestion on a different engine system that would add more difficulty, but still keep you in the fight.
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Offline Krusty

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Re: Engine damage from running 100% too long...
« Reply #21 on: June 08, 2015, 10:40:14 AM »
The horrific bane that IL2 introduced into flight sim lore is this utter balderdash nonsense that running at proper full throttle settings would kill your engine. This is only compounded by the vast success of the brand and the copy/paste of the game engine into dozens of follow-on games both for console and PC. It has truly imprinted so much false information and completely made-up bullcrap into the minds of the playerbase.

Do you know what 100% is? It's not an absolute. It's not a magical number. For every plane it's a specific manifold pressure and an RPM to go along with it. Look up how long a plane could run at that setting. Then be quiet about "100% kills engines" because you'll know how wrong you are.

Just to even say "100%" as a blanket statement is willful ignorance.


Don't be like IL2. IL2 is crap. AH is far better than IL2 in every regard. The engine modelling in IL2 is 100% fiction and arbitrary based on one deluded designer's vision for a game -- who, by the way, has been wrong on many MANY other parts of his "vision" in regards to how planes handle and how they perform many times over the years. Why do you take "100% kills engines" as gospel? Aces High models historic MAP/RPM settings From WW2. Not from Oleg's fantasy non-reality. Not from restored Warbirds whose insurrance underwriters cannot replace engine parts.


Fork, you know better. You're not some naive troll. You're way smarter than to even think the thoughts you typed out in the original post.


Sheesh. Pop onto the forum one time and see this nonsense. Aaaannnd... away I go again.

Online The Fugitive

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Re: Engine damage from running 100% too long...
« Reply #22 on: June 08, 2015, 11:35:27 AM »
LOL and I was going to welcome you back Krusty!

Offline Drane

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Re: Engine damage from running 100% too long...
« Reply #23 on: June 08, 2015, 11:40:21 AM »
-1

I am an aircraft mechanic. An aircraft engine should be able to run at 100% continuous rated power without damage.
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Offline Mister Fork

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Re: Engine damage from running 100% too long...
« Reply #24 on: June 10, 2015, 04:28:16 PM »
Dang it Krusty...you know me waaay too well... Darn you IL2-3456789 or Oleg for giving me the idea that it might work in Aces High...(sigh)

Off to my wishing for player controlled destroyers and LST's that act like vehicle spawn points when landed.. :x

« Last Edit: June 10, 2015, 04:33:00 PM by Mister Fork »
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Offline bustr

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Re: Engine damage from running 100% too long...
« Reply #25 on: June 10, 2015, 05:19:06 PM »
I still want unlimited merlin and gryphon WEP time in the game. The short pittance of time we can fly on full fuel loadout can never reach the max time testing for full load continuous testing. We don't have to worry about our spakplug life and swap out life for engines.

Now Hitech could model in engine management that allows sparkplug fouling which was a common problem. When 150 octane was introduced, the original blend caused fouling if the engine sat idling on a runway during long wait periods or set to fuel economy for long periods. One of the cures was to bring the engine up to max rpm for a short blow out period.

I'm not sure about our other inline engines and what they relied on for WEP. And then there are our radial engines with some relying on water and the FW radials using fuel for cooling. And the Yaks run at max load when you firewall them. And the La and Tu2, not sure what they use for WEP.

In most cases we fly much shorter missions than ww2 pilots for our gamey pleasures. With that in mind, only two things come to mind in the OP's request. Simply wanting the added complexity to cut his boredom after all of these years. And a system imposed leash to the younger super players who have no respect for the finer aspects of this simulation. It would be one crooked monkey wrench thrown into their insolent dominance of the gamey aspects of piu, piu, piu........ :joystick:
bustr - POTW 1st Wing


This is like the old joke that voters are harsher to their beer brewer if he has an outage, than their politicians after raising their taxes. Death and taxes are certain but, fun and sex is only now.

Offline EDO43

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Re: Engine damage from running 100% too long...
« Reply #26 on: June 11, 2015, 04:16:41 PM »


Gents, the above page from the Grumman F6F-3 Pilot's Operating Handbook clearly outlines the maximum time the R-2800-10 is allowed to be operated at military power (i.e. 100%).  That time is not to exceed 5 minutes. Note that there is no water injection or WEP on this aircraft. 
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Offline Ack-Ack

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Re: Engine damage from running 100% too long...
« Reply #27 on: June 11, 2015, 04:18:50 PM »
I'd rather see engine over heat and seizure due to oil starvation after flying inverted for a few seconds.
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Offline bustr

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Re: Engine damage from running 100% too long...
« Reply #28 on: June 12, 2015, 05:50:42 PM »
The biggest problem with the R-2800 is shortening it's usable life span due to running the cylinder heads too often at too high of temp. So to the 5 minutes for the F6f. The engine is rated to run 10 hours if needed. NAVY testing regiments included 30 flights of 10 hours at military. For planes with WEP, 5 hours on WEP.

In this game we will never exceed this time frame with the R-2800's modeled.
bustr - POTW 1st Wing


This is like the old joke that voters are harsher to their beer brewer if he has an outage, than their politicians after raising their taxes. Death and taxes are certain but, fun and sex is only now.

Offline PanosGR

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Re: Engine damage from running 100% too long...
« Reply #29 on: June 13, 2015, 02:04:38 PM »
(Image removed from quote.)

Gents, the above page from the Grumman F6F-3 Pilot's Operating Handbook clearly outlines the maximum time the R-2800-10 is allowed to be operated at military power (i.e. 100%).  That time is not to exceed 5 minutes. Note that there is no water injection or WEP on this aircraft.
« Last Edit: June 13, 2015, 02:08:37 PM by PanosGR »