The man who fought for Finland, the Nazis, and US Army SF

[Bizman]

Still you were under severe military and political restrictions as far as foreign relations were concerned. You weren't completely independent.

Yes, if you mean that we weren't allowed to have submarines or bombers or nuclear weapons, or getting any German or Japanese aircraft, war material or their components according to the Paris Peace Treaties.

No, The Allied Control Commission (all Soviet) left in 1947. Notice that they represented all of the countries that had declared war to us, including Great Britain, Canada, Australia and New Zealand! Of course the Soviet ambassadors gave their (sometimes strong) advice, but they weren't always followed. If you call that "severe political restrictions" you could say the same about Mexico or any other country bordering any of the Great Powers. Today, with  Intercontinental Ballistic Missiles and other long distance weapons, we could expand that to concern any countries that has been at war with any of the Great. That would make most of the world independent'ish.

If you're picking berries from the same bush with a bear, you'd better tip-toe. That doesn't mean you'd have to eat its excrement.

[zack1234]

The SS were beaten by the Allies because they were not good enough

This guy had no loyalty to anyone.

The British who joined the SS could not be trusted by the Narzzies and were never put into active service

Glorifying the SS is hilarious, its like saying the Titanic was awesome

The way they tucked thier trousers into their boots is very alluring though

The whole gibberish about the prowess of the Third Reich is gibberish as well......they lost

They also had the whole of Europe as allies and they still lost

Bizman is awesome

[Zimme83]

Finland did not by any mean fell or surrendered to Sovjet during WW2. It was very hard peace terms yes. With restrictions in the military capability (that were in many cases rounded sercetly) . But still, Finland were still an independent country.

[guncrasher]

we rarely disagree Old but, to me at least, he was a soldier. While I share your sentiments to a degree he did die in service and, really, doesn't any soldier who is following the flag of the nation he or she represents deserve our respect and to a degree our admiration? He died following the orders of our government.  Agree or disagree with those orders they're called and they go.

to be honest,  he joined only after the soviets tried to get him extradited and it was the only way for him to leave.


semp

[mthrockmor]

Can't share the enthusiasm.  I tremble to think that the kind of guy who would join the Waffen SS is the kind of guy who made America great.

- oldman

There is an element of revised history that has taken place since the end of WW2. I don't mean that in the typical negative sense but instead, we know much more now than we did then. Adolph Hitler was Time Magazine's Man of the Year in 1938. This does not mean that Time was made up of Fascists or Nazi sympathizers, instead he was at the helm of a nation that had made a great turnaround.

When it came to the horrors of Nazi Germany most of them were not truly known at the time. Allied troops discovered concentration camps as they liberated them. Prior to this it was almost completely unknown, accept at the very highest level. In fact, even now scholars discuss how much and when Churchill and Roosevelt knew what they did.

Add to this, there are several different branches of the SS. It is easy to loop them all into one unit, and to a degree they should. The SS was a political military unit, made up of political ideologues. Among the 5 branches they had the combat branch, which this soldier join, and then intelligence units, etc. He did not join the one who engaged in mass murders.

Even in Germany it is up for grabs about how many knew what exact details. German citizens seem to have settled on the fact that everyone should have known everything, though the fact is even German citizens didn't know the full scope and horror of what their own government was doing. This is not to excuse any of it. It is to put it into context.

This guy fought in elite units similar to Marine Recon or Army Rangers. He hated the Communists who detailed horror on his land and he killed as many as he could. When that show ended he fought for the Germans, who had provided supplies and troops in fighting the Commie horde. Going from Finland to German isn't much of a stretch. And considering his background it makes sense they took his elite fighting skills and knowledge and put him in an elite unit, not some random infantry unit with fat, old men.

As for him coming to America, not much to make of that. America is the land of opportunity for hundreds of millions. He was one of the more aggressive in coming here. Several years ago Pew Research estimated that if America had "open borders" and anyone could become a citizen within 12 months over 750 million people would attempt to relocate here. Again, he was more aggressive in doing so. With his background and training I'm not surprised he joined the US Army and quickly bubbled up within SF.

I'm not being argumentative, just offering my view on this. Killing commies is killing commies, circa 1940s-1960s. The only good commie,....

boo
 

[MrRiplEy[H]]

There is an element of revised history that has taken place since the end of WW2. I don't mean that in the typical negative sense but instead, we know much more now than we did then. Adolph Hitler was Time Magazine's Man of the Year in 1938. This does not mean that Time was made up of Fascists or Nazi sympathizers, instead he was at the helm of a nation that had made a great turnaround.

When it came to the horrors of Nazi Germany most of them were not truly known at the time. Allied troops discovered concentration camps as they liberated them. Prior to this it was almost completely unknown, accept at the very highest level. In fact, even now scholars discuss how much and when Churchill and Roosevelt knew what they did.

Add to this, there are several different branches of the SS. It is easy to loop them all into one unit, and to a degree they should. The SS was a political military unit, made up of political ideologues. Among the 5 branches they had the combat branch, which this soldier join, and then intelligence units, etc. He did not join the one who engaged in mass murders.

Even in Germany it is up for grabs about how many knew what exact details. German citizens seem to have settled on the fact that everyone should have known everything, though the fact is even German citizens didn't know the full scope and horror of what their own government was doing. This is not to excuse any of it. It is to put it into context.

This guy fought in elite units similar to Marine Recon or Army Rangers. He hated the Communists who detailed horror on his land and he killed as many as he could. When that show ended he fought for the Germans, who had provided supplies and troops in fighting the Commie horde. Going from Finland to German isn't much of a stretch. And considering his background it makes sense they took his elite fighting skills and knowledge and put him in an elite unit, not some random infantry unit with fat, old men.

As for him coming to America, not much to make of that. America is the land of opportunity for hundreds of millions. He was one of the more aggressive in coming here. Several years ago Pew Research estimated that if America had "open borders" and anyone could become a citizen within 12 months over 750 million people would attempt to relocate here. Again, he was more aggressive in doing so. With his background and training I'm not surprised he joined the US Army and quickly bubbled up within SF.

I'm not being argumentative, just offering my view on this. Killing commies is killing commies, circa 1940s-1960s. The only good commie,....

boo
 

Actually Törni was kicked out of SS because he couldn't stand the strict rules the germans had. He found the unorthodox methods of the US special forces more to his liking. It's said that he never acted like a superior to his troops. He always went first and if someone had a beef with him, it was handled with some booze and fists instead of bureaucracy.

[Delirium]

Can't share the enthusiasm.  I tremble to think that the kind of guy who would join the Waffen SS is the kind of guy who made America great.

- oldman

My initial reaction was to post something like this. However, I cannot judge the man's intent only by the company he keeps. Maybe he was just a young kid that made a mistake but there isn't enough information either way.

The SS was a political military unit, made up of political ideologues.

This is the group that kept Hitler in power (at least until the end) and was associated with many atrocities. For that reason alone, wearing the uniform makes him suspect regardless of what he did afterwards.

[Bizman]

Can't share the enthusiasm.  I tremble to think that the kind of guy who would join the Waffen SS is the kind of guy who made America great.

- oldman

For more trembles read how the three motor companies who made America great, helped Germany build their war material prior and during the war: http://www.rationalrevolution.net/war/american_supporters_of_the_europ.htm

GM's plants in Germany built thousands of bomber and jet fighter propulsion systems for the Luftwaffe at the same time that its American plants produced aircraft engines for the U.S. Army Air Corps....

GM and Ford subsidiaries built nearly 90 percent of the armored "mule" 3-ton half-trucks and more than 70 percent of the Reich's medium and heavy-duty trucks. These vehicles, according to American intelligence reports, served as "the backbone of the German Army transportation system."

[zack1234]

So Henry Ford was happy about what the SS did to babies?

[Bizman]

So Henry Ford was happy about what the SS did to babies?

You mean the Lebensborn program? Supposedly as long as they looked like him...

[zack1234]

No putting them in ovens

[zack1234]

I have seen a picture of henry ford he looks like a nasty vindictive man, pinched face and all.

Is there are statement after WWII from him and his nasty ideas?

or has the Ford powers paid off people?

[MrRiplEy[H]]

I have seen a picture of henry ford he looks like a nasty vindictive man, pinched face and all.

Is there are statement after WWII from him and his nasty ideas?

or has the Ford powers paid off people?

Zack once more, why do you post? Are you on drugs?

[zack1234]

 

[NatCigg]

story reads he was one hell of a solider.   

zack could do his taxes 

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