New Griffin USN missile in action

[Gman]

http://foxtrotalpha.jalopnik.com/the-navys-little-missiles-could-be-popping-up-in-many-m-1716167519

Some good info/vids on other small missile systems as well.  Raytheon is building smaller missiles with data links and fire and forget tech for the USN - soon the Cyclones, LCS, Destroyers/Cruisers, and most importantly aircraft like the P3, P8, and Helos will have a much lighter, smaller, faster, and more lethal weapons system.  ALong with the Hellfires, the LCS would be well served by mounting a couple systems of these to supplement the Hellfire future systems.  Having both a mid and short range missile system capable of firing on multiple fast targets = huge + for the LCS, and other ships as well.

Other services and countries will benefit as well, the V22 and AC130 hopefully will be able to mount these future fire and forget missiles in large numbers as well.  While not exactly cheap, they look pretty effective, especially at that 2000+ meter range where gunfire starts to fall off in that 30mm and smaller caliber of guns. 

Make sure to check out both vids, the 2nd one shows a ripple fire of 3 Hellfires, and they smoke 3 fast moving boats pretty efficiently.  Nice to see that LCS getting more offensive firepower to deal with the threats it was designed to counter - smaller stuff in the litorals.  Reading more about them, both the Griffin and naval Hellfire are pretty small mounts not taking up much space, and they are saying they plan to put them on all manner of ships, even supply and transport docks and such stuff.  They'll sure give all the USN ships a great option to deal with surface threats.  I realize that the Burkes and Ticos have the ESSM and even earlier SM models that can target surface ships in that mid/close range zone, but none of the other US ships have really anything other than guns until these missiles came around.

Good stuff.  Firepower, largely an American invention, is something the USN needs more of, and looks to be getting some more.

That said about missiles being more effective than guns in the 2000+m range, this looks interesting, a mortar/gun hybrid that claims very high accuracy and rof.   http://foxtrotalpha.jalopnik.com/the-patria-nemo-mortar-boat-is-small-and-fast-with-a-hu-1666492358

[Rich46yo]

The ESSM is a very expensive missile and as far as I know never had an offensive capability. Even if it did why use a 2 m$ missile when a $100,000 one will do? I think the most exciting thing about this missile, along with systems like the SDB, is eventually they will be networked to use Intel from all other systems, land, sea, air, space, in the combat area. Now this is the real edge we have. The ability to use data from ALL platform/systems in the battle space, to process that data very quickly and to respond not only quickly but with great lethality and  precision.

While this missile may only have the range of 9 miles the manned or unmanned Arial platform its on has a range and loiter much longer and that LCS ship has access to all the data from all the other systems connected.

This is why I dont get involved in F35 or LCS discussions anymore. To many people are thinking "40 years ago" when talking about the next war. Or modern war. Your alarm clock today probably has more processing power then systems 40 years ago had. Its a new day and we dont design and build systems to operate in a vacuum of 40yo Doctrine. "Data Link" "In-Flight Target Update" "fire and forget" this evolving missile system will make an impact in many ways.

Honestly the only worry I have for the USN is the lack of platforms. We need to be at least a 400 ship Navy and better yet a 450 ship one.

[bustr]

I read some of the articles about this system. Is a projected use to loiter one of these over a target to identify multiple targets. At which point a remote signal assigns those targets to batteries of these already in place on small vehicles, local small ships, and even UAV loitering by a remote fire and control center.

The article projects these small missiles as a way to up arm just about all of the NAVY and Marines existing ships and vehicles in the face of projected budget and manpower cuts.

Then there was that article about the next gen low radar visibility cruise missile with autonomous AI rout determination to get around jamming and detection.

Wonder if a B52 could dump out 100 of those tiny missiles at 50,000ft near an area. Let them free fall while targets are assigned through an on station UAV, then on signal, fire up their tiny motors, and go seek and destroy? The B52 could drop and additional group from wing pylons to become ECM, jamming and even chaff distributors to confuse the local radar centers. Suddenly saturate the area with too many tiny targets to track.   

[Gman]

The Sea Sparrow and the newer ESSM have a really good offensive anti ship capability that isn't that widely known for some reason.  In fact, the Turkish navy ate two Sparrows in a not-so-friendly fire accident in an exercise about 20 years ago - the 2 missiles killed sailors and very nearly sank a destroyer class ship.  The ESSM now, which as I'm sure you know are loaded in quad packs in the VLS mounts on USN ships, are a far better missile than the earlier Sea Sparrows they've for the most part replaced.  Like Rich has said though, they aren't cheap, and are primarily used in an anti shipping role for targets out of gun range, yet still close enough that a Harpoon shot wouldn't be the best either.  Now these smaller cheaper missiles can be used on future smaller threats instead of wasting ESSM rounds that are better off being saved for potential airborne and incoming missile threats.

I thought the same as you Bustr, seeing the launch rack on the newer AC130 models, what a B1B, B52, or the new future LRB could do with a triple digit launch of these little autonomous suckers over a crowded battlespace filled with targets on the ground.  Targets that are overkill for JDAMs, even the 250 or 500lb class weapons, stuff like that.  Maybe poaching on the sensor fuzed weapons patch a little, but more options in terms of weapons is never a bad thing. 

I know micro sized sensors and drones are coming to large bombers, heck, the article right below the Griffin missile on Defense Tech today is about that in fact.  Also, drones that will be used to stimulate future anti access/area denial systems, to get them to waste their rounds on cheap drones that also gather intel, and will be launched with a mix of attack drones/missiles will be the future of bombers as well.

[bustr]

Can you imagine small missiles that over fly a crowded combat zone, air burst cutting loose mini versions of itself that track individual personnel flying at speeds that can pass through cinder blocks to reach the target? The next stage in that would be surface dropped packages that wait on standby until sensors trigger a launch to take out anything up to an armored vehicle or low flying helo. Make that the final stage in the useful life cycle of a loitering missile so it can go on waiting for targets sitting on the ground after parachuting down.

Consider we have to paint a target with a lazer designator. What if an operative or a remote mini UAV actually paints human targets with dust or liquid saturated with nano tech beacons that acts as a homing guide for an airburst to release mini missiles that track to the nano tech beacons. Then you simply need a human asset on the ground to identify your hard to find person and tag him passing by in the camel market one night. Or mail him a package that when he opens it dusts him and calls home that it is ready for a visit.

I read a paper from Berkeley I think it was the location about RFID dust. Basically someone was working on nano RFID particles that could be dusted onto you as you walked through a door way giving a tracker your location and other vitals as you wandered around during your day. Why not a terrorist in some hard to reach place by a local asset? Then a mini missile storm.

Or as you release chaff to fool a missile or another aircraft, it fly's through nano dust tagging itself for a rear firing mini missile........ some hornets and wasps do that using pheromones to bring in additional scouts to attack a target.

[PR3D4TOR]

The Navy's Standard Missile also has an anti-ship mode. In air-burst mode its warhead is deadly against enemy radar and other sensors and can cripple the fighting capabilities of a ship. SAM missiles are also very fast. Faster than cannon shells.

[PR3D4TOR]

MBDA's new Brimstone multi-purpose missile is also very impressive.

[PR3D4TOR]

[Nath[BDP]]

$100k to take out a dingy, nice

[PR3D4TOR]

Yeah. Hopefully it is only the initial low production run cost. For that kind of money you can get Hellfires.

[zack1234]

So the US is broke?

Dont think so

[PR3D4TOR]

Getting the best bang for your buck is not about being broke, but being sensible.

[BoilerDown]

If the next step in aerial combat is massive numbers of cheap drones, you need a cheap lock-on missile system to take them out, or else the missile will be more expensive than the thing it destroys.  We (the US) have one?

[zack1234]

Getting the best bang for your buck is not about being broke, but being sensible.

Sensible?

 

[Meatwad]

If the next step in aerial combat is massive numbers of cheap drones, you need a cheap lock-on missile system to take them out, or else the missile will be more expensive than the thing it destroys.  We (the US) have one?

This has worked since ww2