The what-if:s

[WaffenVW]

  Seems it's a what if.... so about anything goes.... like what if those tomcats showed up on the coast of Japan in 45!!


     

I remember that movie! 

[morfiend]

LOL  see that wasnt hard was it!

  Silly movie but it seemed to be the answer you were seeking!



     

[Zimme83]

Tomcats showed up in -41, not -45 if i remember it correctly, it was just prior the attack at Pearl Harbor.

The point of the thread is to show the more unconventional designs. Most of them never made it to the squads but its fun to think about U.S Navy having the F-5U instead of the Corsair or Luftwaffe having the Do-335 as their front line fighter.
Most of these concepts wasn't bad at all but it wasn't the time to spend industrial resources on them (in case of the Allies) or there wasn't enough resources (Germany) to get them ready for war  in time.

[save]

1/3rd of Swedens fighter force flew with the Finns ( with finnish markings) in the winter war 1939.

Wouldn't have seen action no matter when they became operational. Sweden wasn't directly involved in the war.

[Zimme83]

Yep, thats OT but with 12.000 men and 1/3 of the air force fighters (plus some bombers) in Finland during the winter war Sweden was in reality at war. Even dough it was "disguised" as volunteers and the aircrafts were repainted with Finnish markings it was a Swedish unit manned entirely by SwAF pilots and ground crews. 

[WaffenVW]

Usually not considered a part of WWII. Did they take part in the Continuation War?

[Zimme83]

Usually not considered a part of WWII. Did they take part in the Continuation War?

Lol....
I have never seen anyone saying that the winter war was not a part of WW2.

[WaffenVW]

Really? I have yet to read an historian who considers it part of WWII. It was a three month war between Finland and Russia. Neither party were at that time involved in the war with Germany. Similarly the Second Sino-Japanese war also fought at this time is not considered part of WWII.

[Zimme83]

OK, im not going to argue about it. Im right you are not.
You can think of the Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact and how its relevant for the winter war.

[WaffenVW]

Notwithstanding Your Hans Rosling impersonation, WWII started when Germany attacked the Anglo-Polish and Franco-Polish alliances resulting in France and Britain declaring war on Germany. That's a World War because France and Britain were world-spanning empires at the time. If France and Britain hadn't declared war (and betrayed the Polish like they did the Czech) it would have been nothing more than a local European war between Poland and Germany. Just like the German invasion of Czechoslovakia, and the Winter War.

[Ack-Ack]

Really? I have yet to read an historian who considers it part of WWII. It was a three month war between Finland and Russia. Neither party were at that time involved in the war with Germany. Similarly the Second Sino-Japanese war also fought at this time is not considered part of WWII.

The 2nd Sino-Japanese War is considered to be part of WW2 after the US became involved when it declared war on Japan after Pearl Harbor.

[Zimme83]

WW2 started officially with the invasion of Poland, a direct consequence of the Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact. The pact was an agreement between Germany and Soviet Union to split Eastern Europe between them. the pact included that Soviet Union would get Finland. the Winter war was no isolated event, it was a part of a "bigger picture" that eventually lead to Operation Barbarossa.

WW2 lasted from 1st Sept 1939 to 2nd September 1945 and all wars in Europe during that time is considered part of WW2. Period.

[WaffenVW]

The 2nd Sino-Japanese War is considered to be part of WW2 after the US became involved when it declared war on Japan after Pearl Harbor.

Exactly. After Japan attacked America, and British and Dutch colonies, America, Britain, Canada and the Netherlands declared war on Japan making it a world war, and making China their allies. Prior to 8 December 1941 the Sino-Japanese war was just a regional conflict. Likewise the Continuation War between Finland and Russia 1941-1945 is considered part of WWII after Russia was attacked by the Germans and the Finns as allies on the same day, 22 June 1941. The Winter War of 1939 did not involve any of the parties to WWII at that time, just like the Sino-Japanese war in the period 1937-1941.

[Zimme83]

Exactly. After Japan attacked America, and British and Dutch colonies, America, Britain, Canada and the Netherlands declared war on Japan making it a world war, and making China their allies. Prior to 8 December 1941 the Sino-Japanese war was just a regional conflict. Likewise the Continuation War between Finland and Russia 1941-1945 is considered part of WWII after Russia was attacked by the Germans and the Finns as allies on the same day, 22 June 1941. The Winter War of 1939 did not involve any of the parties to WWII at that time, just like the Sino-Japanese war in the period 1937-1941.

Yes it did. Sovjet union was "a part of WW2"  since they at the time were an allied to Germany and also had invaded Poland prior to the winter war. Finland also became a part of WW2 when they were invaded, just like the Baltic states.

[WaffenVW]

No, that's just factually wrong. The Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact was a non-aggression pact, not an alliance. Prior to the 1941 German invasion and violation of that pact the Russians were in no way part of WWII. At this time Sweden was more of a German ally than what the Russians were.