For the upcoming Bf110G revisions...

[morfiend]

Morfiend, 110G production ended in April 1945. Though most 110 at that time (perhaps all?) were night fighters.

 Yes I know,I reread what I wrote and I guess I could have worded it better..... I meant the 2/410's were withdrawn from frontline service.



   

[Krusty]

As Dennis stated earlier there were 32 R1's made, and an unknown number of R4 and R5 models + unknown number of conversions. Plenty for squadron strength deployment.

That's an unsupported assumption. Just because something is on an order doesn't mean that order was actually produced. Or that units actually got those planes. Luftwaffe history is rife with examples where hundreds of Me262s were assembled and moved to a staging area and then bombed before they could ever get out to a unit. It was quite common, in fact.

The burden of proof is on you to refute 75 years of historians. Okay, have at it. Good luck. Don't spout fallacies and falsehoods as if they're real. Just because there's a picture of it doesn't count. Facts matter.

[PR3D4TOR]

Dennis is an historian if I'm not mistaken.

[Squire]

Actually 32 is barely enough for a single squadron. Combat losses, damaged planes, repairs ect. You don't get 12 shiny fighters and that lasts you the war. 32 is a tiny, tiny # for a WW2 combat plane. It is a # that renders it insignificant in historical terms imho.

[PR3D4TOR]

Probably more like 50+ aircraft in total. Still, it is a tiny number. Puts it in the same category as the Ta 152 and Ostwind. The Allies also had small production runs of specialized aircraft. For example the Hurricane IID with its hand-made and fitted Vickers S guns was operated exclusively by No. 6 Squadron RAF in Africa. After they converted to other types later in the war the surviving IID's were sent to the far east and Russia. All of these are already in the game.

[Serenity]

Probably more like 50+ aircraft in total. Still, it is a tiny number. Puts it in the same category as the Ta 152 and Ostwind. The Allies also had small production runs of specialized aircraft. For example the Hurricane IID with its hand-made and fitted Vickers S guns was operated exclusively by No. 6 Squadron RAF in Africa. After they converted to other types later in the war the surviving IID's were sent to the far east and Russia. All of these are already in the game.

But again, we have service records of these units being fielded and seeing action in squadron strength, vice production orders and a few pictures for the 3.7.

[PR3D4TOR]

Pictures of them flying in operational squadrons with ZG 1 and ZG 76. Squadron 4 in ZG 76 and "tank hunter squadron" PzJgSt in ZG 1.

Mind you these were not specially built airplanes or even factory conversions. The 3.7 BK gun packs were Rüstsätze identified by their "R" designation. Field modification kits. Any 110G could be modified in the field within hours to carry the gun. Like putting the gondola guns on a 109. So one day a squadron in ZG 76 (or just elements of a squadron) could be carrying the gun pack for a mission and the next day they might carry bombs instead for a different mission. We know the gun was in their inventory. We know the guns were used operationally. Asking for records showing which pilot used what specific loadout in a mission is going too far. Very rarely will you find a whole German squadron flying with the exact same mods and loadouts. The Luftwaffe cherished individualism and these decisions were more often than not left to the pilots themselves. Even down to things like what propeller they preferred and ammunition belting order. Some famous successful pilots even had one-off custom mods made to their rides.

[bustr]

I suspect everyone has a copy of Fw190 Ersatzteileliste Band 4 1944 big book of FW armament options and parts. And you have all posted references and pictures to FW using them. Does anyone have a copy of the same big book for 110? Are the BK3.7 or MK101 in the book? The manual for installation and maintenance of the BK3,7 shows it fired AP rounds and only 6 in the magazine.

[PR3D4TOR]

I found this:

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/26232318/AH/Bf%20110%20G-2-R%20Teil%208%20A.pdf

[Devil 505]

I suspect everyone has a copy of Fw190 Ersatzteileliste Band 4 1944 big book of FW armament options and parts. And you have all posted references and pictures to FW using them. Does anyone have a copy of the same big book for 110? Are the BK3.7 or MK101 in the book? The manual for installation and maintenance of the BK3,7 shows it fired AP rounds and only 6 in the magazine.

Looks like a total loudout is 66 rounds. The magazine holds 6 and the tray above fits another 60 to be loaded by the crew into the magazine.

Page 8 here.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/26232318/AH/Bf%20110%20G-2-R%20Teil%208%20A.pdf

[Serenity]

Pictures of them flying in operational squadrons with ZG 1 and ZG 76. Squadron 4 in ZG 76 and "tank hunter squadron" PzJgSt in ZG 1.

Mind you these were not specially built airplanes or even factory conversions. The 3.7 BK gun packs were Rüstsätze identified by their "R" designation. Field modification kits. Any 110G could be modified in the field within hours to carry the gun. Like putting the gondola guns on a 109. So one day a squadron in ZG 76 (or just elements of a squadron) could be carrying the gun pack for a mission and the next day they might carry bombs instead for a different mission. We know the gun was in their inventory. We know the guns were used operationally. Asking for records showing which pilot used what specific loadout in a mission is going too far. Very rarely will you find a whole German squadron flying with the exact same mods and loadouts. The Luftwaffe cherished individualism and these decisions were more often than not left to the pilots themselves. Even down to things like what propeller they preferred and ammunition belting order. Some famous successful pilots even had one-off custom mods made to their rides.

We have various systems that plug into our jet that are used for testing. These devices are flown. They are NOT deployed in squadron strength.

[PR3D4TOR]

Irrelevant. They were not still "testing" them in 1944 after first deploying them in 1942.

[Krusty]

Nor were they seen to be in strength. At that point in 1944 they were flying night fighters in broad daylight. They used anything that could fly and it was full-on emergency status for all heavy fighter crews.

One plane in a formation doesn't prove much, other than they managed to get those engines running and maybe that pilot's primary ride was down (or shot down) and unavailable.

Excepts from pilot journals show that much was common.


P.S. you really are pushing hard for this agenda, predator. Get over it. It was used in a test squadron and then a single-digit number of stragglers were kept around because they could actually fly but weren't effective in any real way.

You stand a better chance at proving the Boomerang racked up hundreds of kills....

[Krusty]

Sorry for the double post, but this warrants special focus:

We know the guns were used operationally. Asking for records showing which pilot used what specific loadout in a mission is going too far. Very rarely will you find a whole German squadron flying with the exact same mods and loadouts. The Luftwaffe cherished individualism and these decisions were more often than not left to the pilots themselves. Even down to things like what propeller they preferred and ammunition belting order. Some famous successful pilots even had one-off custom mods made to their rides.

You have no clue. "Some famous"? More like one, the narcissistic head of the Luftwaffe himself, had a couple of 1-off modifications in 1942 back when he still could fly. You know nothing of Luftwaffe units to claim that they could choose their own weapons, props, etc. Utter drivel.

[Lusche]

More like one, the narcissistic head of the Luftwaffe himself, had a couple of 1-off modifications in 1942 back when he still could fly.

Göring still flew sorties in WW2? I never knew that he still could fit into a fighter at that time