9GIAP immediate suspension from FSO

[Dobs]

See Rule #4

[waystin2]

See Rule #4

[Dobs]

See Rule #4

[waystin2]

Kudo's to the Allies for doing as well as you did if this is what you had to work with! 

[BFOOT1]

Guys, try to keep this civil. Take the finger pointing else where.

[nooby52]

Guys, try to keep this Civil. Take the finger pointing else where.

 edit: Nevermind. 

[nrshida]

The email chain as printed here seems complete but it isn't.  Printing it wrong way up may just be an error but it biases. 

I read it bottom-up. Are there or are there not missing messages which change the sequence of exchanges?

That this behaviour is defended is worrying. I'm happy to point out that I am well aware that when kicked I am prone to kick back and I will take the licks for that.

Would be more worrying if both sides of an interaction were not weighed.

I'm totally detached from FSO because of my timezone. Perhaps you ought to value an impartial opinion: I do see the word want but only as a contextual explanation. The word preference is used when labelling that link. Frankly, looks like you either didn't read their preference or resentfully took it as an insistance that they get their ride (and over-reacted to that perhaps).

Would it not have been easier to do what Nefarious suggested (since the other squadron stated no preference), rather than telling them 'life’s tough' and to HTFU? Rather condescending.



Perhaps everyone directly involved should reduce their DEFCON setting just a notch and talk the issue out. Obviously preferences are a reasonable consideration. Perhaps refine the procedure for accomodating those fairly in future.

[puller]

We are a dedicated P-38 squadron!  I demand to be put in P-38s or so help me I'll hold my breath till I pass out!

Can you people not read...it says p-38 right there underneath our squad name...

~Air Raiders~
  P-38 Lightning  jamusta  4 - 6  Axis  Yes, FRAME 3 on 2017-06-23  Fighter
                                                                                                   Fighter
                                                                                                   Fighter

What we have here is failure to communicate...







 

[Nefarious]

Would it not have been easier to do what Nefarious suggested (since the other squadron stated no preference), rather than telling them 'life’s tough' and to HTFU? Rather condescending.

This should be done as a request by the 475th, and in a respectful manner. No attempt was made in the initial email to ask for a change just a reminder to be mindful of their preferred aircraft.

Dawger even examined the orders to see the P38s had went to a squad the same size. Bringing that information forward with some civil discussion might have seen them in P38s on Friday and a lot less upset people afterwards.

[SlipKnt]

We're lucky to get our ride once a year.

Every squad has been through this.  Its no big deal to ask the question of why or why not.  Its all in the delivery.  This is a relatively respectable and mature community.

It doesn't matter what your historic ride is.  It doesn't matter what you requested.    In the end, ultimately, it doesn't matter.  What matters is that you participate for the months you sign your squad up for and that you do your best to follow the orders sent to you.  And ultimately, have fun.  Period.

I can assure everyone, that every CiC makes every attempt to give you what you ask for.  Because it comes full circle.  One day you will be CiC and you know how hard it is but you try to do your best so everyone can be happy. 

Can't please everyone.

Without naming any names, my advice to the community is quite simple.  Please fulfill your commitment.  Don't allow other's to dictate your fun.  Ask the questions in the all email so you communicate.  However, do it respectfully.  And whatever the answer ends up being, accept it for what it is and dust yourself off and do the best you can with what you have been assigned.  Every squad in this community has been through it.  The sacrifice you make by not getting a ride you want is always for the good of the mission.

And if you don't see things that way then perhaps FSO isn't for you. 

I am hoping this is resolved and no squads or personnel leave this community.  Chalk it up as a learning experience and move on, all.


 
SlipKnoT

[nrshida]

in a respectful manner.

Standard.

No attempt was made in the initial email to ask for a change just a reminder to be mindful of their preferred aircraft.

Well it's a bit tomatoes / tomatoes. Depends on the culturally accepted version of politeness. In general a good quality to have in a position of responsibility is to absorb and not amplify these little frictions.

Wondering how long before I'm told to butt out 

[Snork]

Standard.


Well it's a bit tomatoes / tomatoes. Depends on the culturally accepted version of politeness. In general a good quality to have in a position of responsibility is to absorb and not amplify these little frictions.

Wondering how long before I'm told to butt out 

Welcome to the new order. To resolve differences we now use bombast, demands, innuendo, litigation and if that doesn't work we take our toys and go home.

[Stampf]

...I have no words...

[Dawger]

Dawger, perhaps you don't understand how FSO works? For the record, my crew feels the same about 47s as you do 38s. I'm telling you from experience that you need to lower your expectations. You should consider yourself lucky if you get your ride once per month. Hell, half the time I think I'm doing well to get the SIDE I want. Your email came across as petty and childish and I think you owe Dantoo an apology.

Apology to Dantoo for what exactly?

My original email to the Allied list was addressed to the Frame 2 CIC, not Dantoo. He is the one who decided to trip a circuit breaker.

I never asked to get switched for frame 1. Once the orders are posted, it really is too late to try to rearrange things.

I have gone that route in the past and the result is just confusion. Email is a horrible venue for that sort of discussion.

And I won't apologize for making it painfully clear that I want my group in P-38's as much as possible.

This is a game and games are for fun. Our version of fun is flying the P-38 in historical match ups. If that "fun" is not something that can be relied upon then FSO is not fun for our group.

The email list is the side communication method chosen by the CM's and that is what I used.

We are asked to update preferences before every FSO. I am diligent about doing that.

When it is my turn for CIC I go out of my way to accommodate the listed preferences as the first priority.

I expect the same from every other CIC.

Dantoo chose to view my email as an attack on him and create this tempest in a teapot.

If preferences are to be ignored, as seems to be the general consensus here and from the CM's then the 475FG shall have to evaluate continued participation under those parameters.

[Skuzzy]

There does not seem to be a point to this thread.  It is more confusing that helpful.

1)  If a squad is leaving FSO, it is up to them.  No one is forcing them to depart, from what I can read.

2)  If there is a squad causing friction in the event, then they should be removed from the event until what time a determination can be made as to whether or not the event is right for that squad.

These kind of threads result in nothing but a bunch of finger pointing with no positive results.  Too many defensive people just yelling at each other.