AH, new blood - a whacky idea

[jimbo71]

[nrshida]

I for one always try to get into contact with the new players if I kill them.

I've got two modes now: power and economy (named after my old Mitsubishi lolz). If someone's really good then I fly my best. If I find them not so tough then I merge loose, do stupid things, turn up ACM experimentation to the max. Let them shoot me down a bit. Got to be some encouragement. This was Pervert's wisdom which really stuck with me.

I think what we will find is lots of hard core veterans feeding and a very few offering help.  That sir, is your issue.

I am and have never been terribly impressed by most MA gameplay when it comes to ACM. I did years at the furbal lake and my biggest shock starting in the MA was the refusal to merge or the desperate HO and run approach. This made the derision poured on the furbal crowd doubly perplexing. At least they'd fight tooth and nail in there. I did actually fly a bit like you suggest for a long time just to get some action. Used to fly low and at half throttle at the start of the fights. Also spent a long time fighting outnumbered.

The OP assumes the majority of new Aces High players are new to air combat

Quite to the contrary. I expect a mixture. Here or somewhere abouts I mention I already encountered a pilot from another sim.

Interesting comments about other sims. Here's hoping I won't have to explore those. 


As an addendum I'm considering what Fugative suggested and making a promotional vid to attract Steam players. Test if this concept has any milage in it. I fear it's a lot of work though. No idea how to get those tracking camera shots like Dolby used to make.

[Invictus84]

Quite to the contrary. I expect a mixture. Here or somewhere abouts I mention I already encountered a pilot from another sim.

I must have missed that....sorry.

As an addendum I'm considering what Fugative suggested and making a promotional vid to attract Steam players. Test if this concept has any milage in it. I fear it's a lot of work though. No idea how to get those tracking camera shots like Dolby used to make.

Sounds like a pretty good idea.  Can't hurt!

[nrshida]

I must have missed that....sorry.

Not a problem. 

How are the stall and post-stall characteristics in other flight sims? Had the idea AH's flight model was tip top, but I'm out of my province there.

[Invictus84]

Rather than answer that directly, which tends to bring out unconstructive and/or emotionally driven comments, I would just say that every sim has it's pluses and minuses.  I personally think the stall characteristics for AH are just fine...certainly better than some and maybe not as good as others.   

Overall, I like AH and enjoy flying it, though I admit I don't do it as much as I used too because I like flying other sims as well. If I thought AH wasn't good and/or fun, I wouldn't fly it.  I had a veteran IL2 player watching me on Twitch the other night ask lot of questions about AH.  I was very honest with him on the pros and cons, told him I feel it's worth playing and that I honestly enjoy doing so.  I believe he will give AH a try, so there's something. 

[1stpar3]

Truth is, despite what many seem to think, too many of the experienced players now just want to take rather than give and they essentially bully the new guys out without giving them a chance.

In the MA they will vulch and vulch and vulch, regardless of the name they are killing.  They do not care about the game, rather their scores.  Push that to the DA, we will see players that will beat down new guys just because they can.

nrshida - you offered a challenge so I feel I should too.  Create an account and fly around like a noob in the MA.  I mean a real noob, who will take the wrong plane up and try to turn fight the right plane.  You know what I mean.  With Hitech's permission I am willing to fund that account on the understanding you film all encounters.  I think what we will find is lots of hard core veterans feeding and a very few offering help.  That sir, is your issue.

You are onto something there Fess! I have seen it with my own eyes and heard with my own ears. Even had a interested(too the point of being GIDDY about it) new player,trashed to the point he didnt see it as any amount of fun. His words "Its a game! I killed you and have no score, so I am the noob? I suck because you died? I can get this from my mom, for free!" I gave him my old/but NEW computer when I upgraded for Vr. He had nothing to play with, so I just gave him my system, Joysticks to TIR. He really enjoyed it for a time. It was a great way to get him away from his home situation,if just for a few hours of escape online.  STILL pay his subscription. No dice, on his return. He would rather do homework instead Thats a good thing I guess? Still odd to me At least he asks me how the game is going, when we talk, so there IS still hope.

[sonic23]

I'm just going to throw this out there but when i first started playing in 2004 i only played in the DA for several months straight. Of course back then the DA was simple Killshooter was off and you had to check 6 someone and then they check 6 you back to start a fight. I lost almost every fight for a month straight but the instant action kept me coming back or i never would've went past my 2 weeks free.

[DmonSlyr]

Not even going to put this on the Wishlist, the idea's too immature and taking time to ideate only to have super-conservative stiffs say -1 just cos they don't need it themselves / or don't get it gets a bit old    But anyway, an idea, perhaps worthy of discussion. Perhaps someone in a position to consider it from a business model perspective might think about it anyway!

In this thread about a week ago:

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,389299.0.html

I proposed current MA players give the Match Play Arena (MPA) a try. Later in this thread TC reported he was unsuccessful encouraging some MA players to go to MPA with him. As far as my observations take me it seems most of the 'duellers' of old are presently not playing - even the Army of Muppets squad seems presently inactive (wasn't even on the squad roster a week back).

I’ve noticed a few possible MA people show up, but very disappointingly the arena is largely unoccupied. I did this week run into one player who claimed to be from another flight simulator who came to AH to improve his 1-on-1 flying.

Then I read Lusche’s post. I think we can all agree an objective, rational and levelheaded member of out community (unlike me  ):-


This comment especially: “I have the feeling the game is getting old” I found a bit disturbing.

I was considering how the game might be viewed from a new player. If, as Lusche suggests, and I think myself, the MA is a sort of comfort zone of random activities, simultaneously ticking by at a low pace and still requiring the high-angle learning curve of flying and the general complexity of the game then it’s hardly going to appeal. It’s hard and unrewarding, there’s just a gulf in the graphs into which new players fall.

I’ve very openly narrated my fondness for MPA and why I think any fan of air combat should at least be a part-time member. But my activity - pure toe-to-toe ACM fights are an esoteric hobby, nested inside an esoteric hobby. In other words, AH players are a minority and within that minority…  I think this is why trying to recruit MPA players from the MA will not work. If that's their comfort zone they won't leave it.

Perhaps the underlying assumption is false though. What if new players could be attracted to the MPA first? So think about newer games. They are more inclined towards instant action. I would have conjectured also more quickly returned rewards but I'm now not sure. I can imagine many modern gamers are looking for a challenge. A really engaging challenge, bringing a not-so-immediate reward.

Couldn't we push the sporting aspects of Aces High as a way to appeal to the younger generation and enjoy the natural trickling down from there into the MA? I did think of a Reno Air race / Redbull racing league arena, but thought that might get stale quickly (so many racing games already). So I'm proposing that only in the MPA custom skins might be allowed, a public scoreboard right on the front page of AH’s website and further, to allow the slight modification of the aircraft in a combat-competition style. So sort of Reno air races but geared for fighting. So you could remove armour and guns and customise your fuel load out to 10% increments and choose your ammo load out before takeoff. HTC is already able to ‘turn-off’ guns when damaged, the hangar already allows selections and aircraft weight is calculated according to hangar selections. Skins are player-generated. Might not be so much work that it's worth a try. The customization aspect is to engage the individual to a higher level.

I think this might appeal more to the Counter Strike generation than a dimly glowing MA that seems like a war where nearly everyone is on vacation.

And then, promote this! Put videos out, write about it on Steam, try to attract those from other simulators which don't have an MPA.


Before the typical poo-pooers show up to explain how 'we've never needed this in the past', consider. What if Lusche is right? What is the end game to this path? At the end of the day AH is not a single player game. We all play this game together with other people. No people...

FFA Fighter BOWL with airspawns

There is your answer. Quick fighter action. The new guys just want to fight and shoot. The match play still currently takes too much coordination.

Ohh and, no other game has a "fighter bowl" where you can just mix it up with anyone quickly. I'm telling you, it would be great for action and learning.

[DmonSlyr]

I for one always try to get into contact with the new players if I kill them. (I don't kill them on purpose) they usually feel insulted when I do, not my intention at all.

Back to MPA.
yesterday I was screwing around with my squad in there and we had great fun. however I don't always wanna go there with them because you can't select who your fighting or who your flying with. in the old DA this was not a problem. I actually used the DA as a training arena for my squad alot. Cause there are actually consequences for your mistakes.

One time I wanted to duel a friend and that got totally screwed up by a third player joining. we would be placed against him again and again. after 5-6 tries to fight each other we gave up and left.

Don't get me wrong I love the random aspect as well and i also would love to see a squad dueling league ladder in there. maybe you can create a team and gain some sort of elo/rating.

if I would be able to do some those things in there again you would see me there more often and pulling in my squaddies with me.

Those where my 2 cents on the matter.

DutchVII

This is also a major problem with the Match Play that NEEDs prompt attention.

[TWCAxew]

I like to clarify my approaches to new players which also in 11 cases so far seemed to be successful. not all players veel insulted. however a fair amount do. before I even contact them I check there score and see how they are doing 1 kill 60 death for example. the follow up is usually like this:

a. I either ask a friend I have on the side he's flying to contact him and help him out

b. I contact himself and ask him if he wants to wing up with me and my squad. and in the process help him out white what he is struggling with.

thanks for the suggestions. I will do something with those.

but the point was more MP where improve to could be made.

DutchVII