Author Topic: Air France A380 makes emergency landing in Labrador after engine blowout  (Read 2851 times)

Offline oakranger

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Re: Air France A380 makes emergency landing in Labrador after engine blowout
« Reply #15 on: October 02, 2017, 12:29:25 AM »
Wow, great job for being consistent on the job and not doing it.  Wonder what that person doing theses days?
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Offline MiloMorai

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Re: Air France A380 makes emergency landing in Labrador after engine blowout
« Reply #16 on: October 02, 2017, 08:29:07 AM »
There is a Canadian TV program called 'Mayday'. Watch it and you will never fly again.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mayday_(Canadian_TV_series)

Offline saggs

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Re: Air France A380 makes emergency landing in Labrador after engine blowout
« Reply #17 on: October 02, 2017, 10:23:38 PM »
There is a Canadian TV program called 'Mayday'. Watch it and you will never fly again.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mayday_(Canadian_TV_series)

The American version of the same show is called Air Crash Investigation, it's also on Netflix under the title "Air Disasters"

As a A&P mechanic, I like to watch them just for the education, Kind of asking myself "How did they screw this up?" and "How can I not do the same?"

I've seen a lot of those shows, a common theme in air accidents (especially part 121 operators) is that there are always several links in the accident chain, anyone of which could be broken to prevent the disaster.  It's the rare incident when they all happen together leading to a disaster. 

Commercial air travel today is statistically very, very safe.  A quick google search says that the odds of dying in a commercial plane crash is 1 in 11 million, vs odds of 1 in 32,000 of dying in a car crash.  That's more then 300 times safer.

Online Vraciu

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Re: Air France A380 makes emergency landing in Labrador after engine blowout
« Reply #18 on: October 03, 2017, 07:15:20 AM »
SURVIVAL IN THE SKY is the gold standard for this type of show.   Truly outstanding.
« Last Edit: October 03, 2017, 10:02:11 AM by Vraciu »
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Offline TequilaChaser

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Re: Air France A380 makes emergency landing in Labrador after engine blowout
« Reply #19 on: October 03, 2017, 07:49:28 AM »
I'm surprised that no-one has mentioned that the outboard 4th engine had a compressor stall, most times due to a Stator Vane coming loose and blowing the engine apart...

Back in '87 we had one of our pilots (he was LT. Howell) on the #2 catapult on the USS Nimitz fixing to launch ....about 3/4 of the way down the cat launch the right engine on his S-3 Viking had a violent compressor stall and the front main intake turbojet fan on the TF-34  ripped off and sliced through the fuselage passing between the legs of the 2 backwaters (ASW's)... Also ripping the right wing off from the engine mount outward...

LT. Howell never broke a sweat, he calmly flew that S-3 in a long sweeping right turn on 1 left engine and no right engine and 3/4s of the right wing blown/torn off... He landed on the flightdeck even catching the 3 wire....those backseaters were very fortunate to have not been killed or legs ripped off...

After that awesome job of taking off and landing, the CO stopped busting LT. Howell's chops for hotdogging and pulling excessive G's over stressing the airframes....

I've witnessed what props on E-2s and intake fan blades can do when people are either overly too cautious or not keeping their heads on a swivel while doing flight ops on the flightdeck....

TC
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Offline Ripsnort

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Re: Air France A380 makes emergency landing in Labrador after engine blowout
« Reply #20 on: October 03, 2017, 02:55:58 PM »
Blow outs happen. Just ask any toddler.

Offline oakranger

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Re: Air France A380 makes emergency landing in Labrador after engine blowout
« Reply #21 on: October 04, 2017, 07:37:12 PM »
I'm surprised that no-one has mentioned that the outboard 4th engine had a compressor stall, most times due to a Stator Vane coming loose and blowing the engine apart...

Back in '87 we had one of our pilots (he was LT. Howell) on the #2 catapult on the USS Nimitz fixing to launch ....about 3/4 of the way down the cat launch the right engine on his S-3 Viking had a violent compressor stall and the front main intake turbojet fan on the TF-34  ripped off and sliced through the fuselage passing between the legs of the 2 backwaters (ASW's)... Also ripping the right wing off from the engine mount outward...

LT. Howell never broke a sweat, he calmly flew that S-3 in a long sweeping right turn on 1 left engine and no right engine and 3/4s of the right wing blown/torn off... He landed on the flightdeck even catching the 3 wire....those backseaters were very fortunate to have not been killed or legs ripped off...

After that awesome job of taking off and landing, the CO stopped busting LT. Howell's chops for hotdogging and pulling excessive G's over stressing the airframes....

I've witnessed what props on E-2s and intake fan blades can do when people are either overly too cautious or not keeping their heads on a swivel while doing flight ops on the flightdeck....

TC

Any photos of that?
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Offline Busher

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Re: Air France A380 makes emergency landing in Labrador after engine blowout
« Reply #22 on: October 04, 2017, 08:56:50 PM »
I'm surprised that no-one has mentioned that the outboard 4th engine had a compressor stall, most times due to a Stator Vane coming loose and blowing the engine apart...

Back in '87 we had one of our pilots (he was LT. Howell) on the #2 catapult on the USS Nimitz fixing to launch ....about 3/4 of the way down the cat launch the right engine on his S-3 Viking had a violent compressor stall and the front main intake turbojet fan on the TF-34  ripped off and sliced through the fuselage passing between the legs of the 2 backwaters (ASW's)... Also ripping the right wing off from the engine mount outward...

LT. Howell never broke a sweat, he calmly flew that S-3 in a long sweeping right turn on 1 left engine and no right engine and 3/4s of the right wing blown/torn off... He landed on the flightdeck even catching the 3 wire....those backseaters were very fortunate to have not been killed or legs ripped off...

After that awesome job of taking off and landing, the CO stopped busting LT. Howell's chops for hotdogging and pulling excessive G's over stressing the airframes....

I've witnessed what props on E-2s and intake fan blades can do when people are either overly too cautious or not keeping their heads on a swivel while doing flight ops on the flightdeck....

TC

I agree that this is a possible explanation but compressor stalls are also very uncommon at cruise power settings on an airliner.

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Offline ghi

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Re: Air France A380 makes emergency landing in Labrador after engine blowout
« Reply #23 on: October 05, 2017, 12:35:07 AM »
I just read about Amsterdam commemorating 25th anniversary of Bijlmer disaster, october 4th 1992 ;i didn't know depleted uranium is used for balancing passenger airplanes ?!  :headscratch:;  i used to add lead in my models, still toxic.

from Wikipedia about this crash bellow;
"Health issues[edit]
Mental health care was available after the crash to all affected residents and service personnel. After about a year, however, many residents and service personnel began approaching doctors with physical health complaints, which the affected patients blamed on the El Al crash. Insomnia, chronic respiratory infections, general pain and discomfort, impotence, flatulence, and bowel complaints were all reported. 67% of the affected patients were found to be infected with Mycoplasma, and suffered from symptoms similar to the Gulf War Syndrome or Chronic Fatigue Syndrome-like symptoms.
Dutch officials from government departments of transport and of public health asserted that at the time of the crash it was understood that there were no health risks from any cargo on the aircraft; Els Borst, minister of public health, stated that "geen extreem giftige, zeer gevaarlijke of radioactieve stoffen" ("no extremely toxic, very dangerous, or radioactive materials") had been on board. However, in October 1993, the nuclear energy research foundation Laka reported that the tail contained 282 kilograms (622 lb) of depleted uranium as trim weight, as did all Boeing 747s at the time; this was not known during the rescue and recovery process.[16][17]
It was suggested that studies be undertaken on the symptoms of the affected survivors and service personnel, but for several years these suggestions were ignored on the basis that there was no practical reason to believe in any link between the health complaints of the survivors and the Bijlmer crash site. In 1997, however, an expert testified in the Israeli parliament that dangerous products would have been released during combustion of the depleted uranium in the tail of the Boeing 747.
The first studies on the symptoms reported by survivors, performed by the Academisch Medisch Centrum, began in May 1998. The AMC eventually concluded that up to a dozen cases of auto-immune disorders among the survivors could be directly attributed to the crash, and health notices were distributed to doctors throughout the Netherlands requesting that extra attention be paid to symptoms of auto-immune disorder, particularly if the patient had a link with the Bijlmer crash site. Another study, performed by the Rijks Instituut voor Volksgezondheid en Milieuhygiene, concluded that, although toxic products had been released at the time of the crash, the added risks of cancer were small, approximately one or two additional cases per ten thousand exposed persons. The RIVM also concluded that the chances of uranium poisoning were minimal.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/El_Al_Flight_1862



https://nltimes.nl/2017/10/04/amsterdam-commemorates-25th-anniversary-bijlmer-disaster
« Last Edit: October 05, 2017, 12:39:13 AM by ghi »

Offline TequilaChaser

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Re: Air France A380 makes emergency landing in Labrador after engine blowout
« Reply #24 on: October 05, 2017, 12:53:54 PM »
Any photos of that?

Actually their were several dozen photo's and rolls of film confiscated back when this happened... anytime something like this happening  similar to the accident photos of the Douglas A-3 Skywarrior (  converted to EA-3B, then converted to VA-3B for "Chief of Naval Operations VIP Transports" ) we lost one night after it had tried 4 times to catch the wire , landing, in rough seas, the Air boss called for "Emergency Landing, Raise/put the Catch Net up" and right about touch down the LSO waved of the A-3 but it was too late and the A-3 Nose Gear caught the top of the net and the Jet flipped over into the ocean off the side of the Nimitz, killing the Pilot and the other 6 onboard occupants.... all that was ever found was the Pilot's helmet... all 7 people on board drowned, the ejection seats had been removed years earlier during the 3 seater bomber/attack era of this Bird...

They used to hold  / go through and read/confiscate all mail, letters, rolls of film, pictures,etc back then when something happened,as to not let it leak out to the press

I agree that this is a possible explanation but compressor stalls are also very uncommon at cruise power settings on an airliner.


Yes they are not as common, but any FOD ( as in a compressor fin / blade or a stator vane coming loose or breaking ,as well as any other kind of FOD can quickly cause a compressor stall /Jet engine blowing..... looking at the picture of that engine on the A380 and listening  of how some of the passengers described it, is why I posted/suggested that it was a compressor stall...... going off of my experience with witnessing them occur...

It seems that here in the past couple of years that wih all of the Commercial and Military aircraft problems,is that people are not doing heir jobs properly and/or thoroughly
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Offline MiloMorai

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Re: Air France A380 makes emergency landing in Labrador after engine blowout
« Reply #25 on: October 05, 2017, 01:29:10 PM »
Lost a high school friend in a bird strike while taking off in 1975. He and the trainee could have ejected safely but stayed with the CT-144 to clear a residential area.


Offline Busher

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Re: Air France A380 makes emergency landing in Labrador after engine blowout
« Reply #26 on: October 05, 2017, 06:43:16 PM »
It seems that here in the past couple of years that wih all of the Commercial and Military aircraft problems,is that people are not doing heir jobs properly and/or thoroughly

I retired as a senior captain at a major airline 9 years ago.

Sadly, I have no doubt you are exactly right.
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Offline DaveBB

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Re: Air France A380 makes emergency landing in Labrador after engine blowout
« Reply #27 on: October 05, 2017, 09:09:22 PM »
Actually their were several dozen photo's and rolls of film confiscated back when this happened... anytime something like this happening  similar to the accident photos of the Douglas A-3 Skywarrior (  converted to EA-3B, then converted to VA-3B for "Chief of Naval Operations VIP Transports" ) we lost one night after it had tried 4 times to catch the wire , landing, in rough seas, the Air boss called for "Emergency Landing, Raise/put the Catch Net up" and right about touch down the LSO waved of the A-3 but it was too late and the A-3 Nose Gear caught the top of the net and the Jet flipped over into the ocean off the side of the Nimitz, killing the Pilot and the other 6 onboard occupants.... all that was ever found was the Pilot's helmet... all 7 people on board drowned, the ejection seats had been removed years earlier during the 3 seater bomber/attack era of this Bird...



Sixty Minutes actually did a special on this crash.  There was some conspiracy theory going around because the rescue helo was ordered not to attempt rescue.  The plane was alleged to have been carrying classified materials. 

I don't know all the details, but I imagine in reality that rough seas, a quickly sinking plane, and it being pitch black, the Captain probably didn't want to lose a helo in addition to the plane that was just lost.
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Offline ghi

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Re: Air France A380 makes emergency landing in Labrador after engine blowout
« Reply #28 on: October 06, 2017, 09:55:03 AM »
Another A380  in news today, struggling to land in Dusseldorf ;  large cross section, like a Zeppelin  , vulnerable to cross winds. 
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4954988/Heart-stopping-moment-pilot-lands-high-winds-Germany.html

« Last Edit: October 06, 2017, 10:03:07 AM by ghi »

Offline Zimme83

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Re: Air France A380 makes emergency landing in Labrador after engine blowout
« Reply #29 on: October 06, 2017, 10:26:59 AM »
Its certified for 35knot crosswind so its not that vulnerable..
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