P-51 Mustang "Dallas Doll" NMF Wing - Preview

[Vraciu]

I'm zeroing in on it...

Always seems to look better from INSIDE the cockpit than outside but I guess that's the better compromise.  Painted surfaces have not received specular map final settings yet.  I'm still working on the metal.




Higher resolution version of the above photo for those who are interested:

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=391983.0;attach=29284




Darkened areas inside the wing theater bands are scuff marks.   Not sure if they work as intended though...






I think I nailed the color I was going for when it is not in direct light.  The transition isn't flawless (this might be the graphics engine's fault) but the end result works well.   

[Devil 505]

Looks real good.

I'd tone down the rivets on the flaps and around the fuel filler though.

[Vraciu]

Looks real good.

I'd tone down the rivets on the flaps and around the fuel filler though.

Crap.  And I had just darkened them because I thought they were too light!       

[Vraciu]

Would it be better to do a 180 with the flap rivets and make them white instead of gray/black????

[Devil 505]

no, a white dot would look like a raised rivet. 

[Vraciu]

no, a white dot would look like a raised rivet.

Ah, okay.  Thanks. 

[oboe]

Looks good.    Are you simulating bare metal on the upper wing surface?   I think its a settled discussion that the wings on the P-51 were sanded, sealed and painted, so the wing panel lines look a little bold/dark to me.  Only the flap and aileron surfaces would be bare metal.  Fencer sent me the diagram of it once, I think I can find it if you're interested in seeing it.

Also for me anyway, I've seen enough of both light and dark rivets on P-51s to believe its related to age/weathering.  White rivets on bare metal look "newer" to me somehow, and dark rivets have an older look which can be even more emphasized with additional surrounding grime.

To me a white dot would only look raised if you also included a shadow, dark dot, opposite the white dot from the imagined light source.

Interesting, I always felt it was harder to get it to look 'right' from my cockpit.

[Vraciu]

Looks good.    Are you simulating bare metal on the upper wing surface?   I think its a settled discussion that the wings on the P-51 were sanded, sealed and painted, so the wing panel lines look a little bold/dark to me.  Only the flap and aileron surfaces would be bare metal.  Fencer sent me the diagram of it once, I think I can find it if you're interested in seeing it.

Also for me anyway, I've seen enough of both light and dark rivets on P-51s to believe its related to age/weathering.  White rivets on bare metal look "newer" to me somehow, and dark rivets have an older look which can be even more emphasized with additional surrounding grime.

To me a white dot would only look raised if you also included a shadow, dark dot, opposite the white dot from the imagined light source.

Interesting, I always felt it was harder to get it to look 'right' from my cockpit.

Thank you, kindly.

My thoughts on this are all over the place.

I’ve been kinda’ the odd ball from the get-go trying to recreate the painted upper wing with minimal panel lines.   I caught a lot of grief for that so I’m going for a different look this time.     

I think I have the schematic you are referring to if it is the one that has colors (y’ello w, green, etc.) representing metal vs paint.  My understanding on that paint is that it was a metallic paint, so the question is probably a matter of reflectivity.   You can see that in shadow it looks like it should.   In sunlight it is shinier than perhaps it should be.   I just chalk it off as a concession to the game.  People expect it to lose ok like that so I did it.   

I haven’t finalized the Spec Map yet so I will consider toning it down. 

I guess I’m not quite to that point yet since I’m still trying to get the panel variations to look right. 

Like I said my mind is all over the place on this.

Sounds right on the rivets.  You did well with the light rivets on yours. 

[Vraciu]

I forgot to mention that I suppose upper wing paint could wear down to metal.  I don’t have a good wing shot of “Dallas Doll” to reference though...

[oboe]

It's this one:


But Tika here looks like some of the paint has been removed down to the metal maybe when they removed the invasion stripes?

[Greebo]

The metal effect specularity looks good Vraciu, not too overpowering.

The P-51's laminar flow wing section only really worked if the airflow above the wing did not break up into little eddies. So the factory workers had to carefully fill the dips and panel overlaps on the wing surface to closely match a template applied to the wing surface before the wing was painted. So I doubt an unpainted and unfilled upper wing would have been allowed in the field as it would have increased drag too much.

[Vraciu]

The metal effect specularity looks good Vraciu, not too overpowering.

The P-51's laminar flow wing section only really worked if the airflow above the wing did not break up into little eddies. So the factory workers had to carefully fill the dips and panel overlaps on the wing surface to closely match a template applied to the wing surface before the wing was painted. So I doubt an unpainted and unfilled upper wing would have been allowed in the field as it would have increased drag too much.

Thank you.  I will offer the final product to the group for review before I submit it. 

The laminar flow experiment didn't really work like they hoped.  The airplanes were never built to close enough tolerances.   I read that the putty and filler treatment didn't hold up well and was often removed with virtually no performance loss.  If that's true then a metal wing would be accurate.   I honestly don't know. 


Thanks for the diagram Oboe. 

[Vraciu]

It's this one:
(Image removed from quote.)

But Tika here looks like some of the paint has been removed down to the metal maybe when they removed the invasion stripes?
(Image removed from quote.)

Yeah for sure.   I think a special paint stripper was needed to keep from harming the filler.  Didn't always work.   Sometimes they just used diesel. 

I found a couple more without paint.  One is the Red Tail being armed (right wing) most have seen. 

[Vraciu]

Food for thought maybe...

https://i.pinimg.com/736x/d0/41/f8/d041f8f6afef9ea85c195dc191befb91---april-p-mustang.jpg

[bustr]

You are doing a great job of randomizing the surface like real aluminum would respond. I don't know how you get the metallic look to come up out of the current oxidized aluminum look but, when you do, your patterns are Da Bomb....