Another cheap computer gets me 60 fps on AH

[Brooke]

Just got another low-cost computer and am getting 60 fps with settings maxed out, except that I turn off reflections and shadows and set environment slider to none.

$297 for the computer, $98 for Windows:

1    Microsoft Windows 10 Home Operating System 64-bit English (1-Pack), OEM    MSKW900140              
1    Apevia X-Qtis No Power Supply MicroATX Case (Black)    CA-XQTISB              
1    Antec Basiq VP-450 450W ATX12V v2.3 Power Supply    PS-VP450              
1    Seagate Barracuda ST1000DM010 1TB 7200RPM SATA 6.0 GB/s 64MB Hard Drive (3.5 inch)    HD-ST1DM10              
1    Kingston ValueRAM KVR24N17S8/8 DDR4-2400 8GB/1Gx64 CL17 Memory    F24UA8GK              
1    GIGABYTE GA-H110M-A LGA1151/ Intel H110/ DDR4/ SATA3&USB3.0/ A&GbE/ MicroATX Motherboard    MB-H110M-A              
1    Intel Pentium G4400 Dual-Core Skylake Processor 3.3GHz 8.0GT/s 3MB LGA 1151 CPU, Retail    G4400BOX

Bought through superbiiz.com, who will assemble it for you (see "system builder" tool on their web site), install the OS, and give you a 1-year warranty.

To which I added a $150 nVidia GTX 1050 graphics card (used to be $110 before cryptocurrency mining mania).

So, there you have a $550 computer system with everything except monitor that runs AH just fine.

I also just ordered a $110 24" Acer monitor (that will very likely be totally fine).

[hgtonyvi]

Very smart buy, I like that. 

[pembquist]

Your posts reminds me I never bought windows. I bought a mobo cpu mem combo from an ex ah player bought a case and paired wit with an existing power supply and HD sometime at least a year ago. The thing is being unreasonable stingy and not really knowing any better I got windows from the microsoft site on a thumb drive and installed it. It has been running ever since, I don't really know if it still has a watermark asking me to register it still. Does anyone know why I still works and updates?

[asterix]

Just got another low-cost computer and am getting 60 fps with settings maxed out, except that I turn off reflections and shadows and set environment slider to none.
...

Do you get that performance in situations where there are a lot of players in close area like MA hoard fights or Fortress Europe type large bomber formation? My system is struggling in those situations a bit so looking for some low cost (future upgradeable) Windows 7 compatible upgrade myself. LGA1151 socket seems like the way to go.

[Bizman]

Your posts reminds me I never bought windows. I bought a mobo cpu mem combo from an ex ah player bought a case and paired wit with an existing power supply and HD sometime at least a year ago. The thing is being unreasonable stingy and not really knowing any better I got windows from the microsoft site on a thumb drive and installed it. It has been running ever since, I don't really know if it still has a watermark asking me to register it still. Does anyone know why I still works and updates?

W10? Look if it's activated. If it is, it only tells that Microsoft desperately wants everyone to get 10. It still can be installed for free using an existing 7 or 8 license.

[Brooke]

Yep, you can save $100 from that if you already have a Windows install that will work.

[Brooke]

Do you get that performance in situations where there are a lot of players in close area like MA hoard fights or Fortress Europe type large bomber formation? My system is struggling in those situations a bit so looking for some low cost (future upgradeable) Windows 7 compatible upgrade myself. LGA1151 socket seems like the way to go.

I haven't tested large formations that on the system.  However, the system is about as powerful as my main system, on which I've played years of AH, including large formations of bombers, large furballs of fighters, large concentrations of puffy ack, and clouds, and it works just fine.

It might have trouble with a 4k monitor, but with a normal 1080p monitor, it's plenty fast as long as you turn off reflections, shadows, and environment slider set to "none".

Also, as pointed out above, if you are replacing a current system for which you have a copy of Windows, you might be able to skip the purchase of Windows.

For example, I had a problem with a motherboard not working, and installed a new motherboard, which resulted in Windows not being "activated" anymore (because Windows keeps track of hardware identification when it was installed).  I called Microsoft, and they gave me a new key to type in, and it was all fine.  Just make sure to write down the "install ID" or whatever it is called for Windows 10 -- that' what they use, not the product ID on the sticker, but the "install ID" you can see in Windows 10 when you look at the activation information.

[pembquist]

I can't explain my windows 10 install. It was a used motherboard and a reformatted drive and I downloaded the Win 10 installer from MS with another computer onto a thumb drive and I installed it following the prompts. For the first months or so It would occasionally mention that I should register my copy, and I remember there being some kind of watermark but now I don't see anything. I never typed in a key or anything. I just figured they would rather have a real, updating copy of there OS than some weird counterfeit so they just let you install it but I really have no idea. I am ambivalent about they whole thing as I'm not a fan of IP theft but on the other hand it seems like you can practically get an entire computer for the price of one copy of OS.

[Bizman]

pembquist, if the mobo originates from a win8 system, the key is coded in the bios and by default Windows will automatically try to activate it. If you unchecked the automatic activation, the next version update may have re-enabled it, thus ending the nagging. So if your system says in the settings/update and security/activation that it's activated, you have a fully legal OS with a digital license, no visible key stickers needed.

[Denniss]

No one seriously interested in gaming should buy a 2C/2T CPU in 2018. This will easily run out of steam if something starts to work in background like windoze updates.
Even 2C/4T is not much better.
PSU seems overdosed, quality is OK but technology is outdated (released 2012, lacks efficiency and active PFC, also just 360W on both 12V rails)

[Brooke]

No one seriously interested in gaming should buy a 2C/2T CPU in 2018. This will easily run out of steam if something starts to work in background like windoze updates.
Even 2C/4T is not much better.
PSU seems overdosed, quality is OK but technology is outdated (released 2012, lacks efficiency and active PFC, also just 360W on both 12V rails)

Not really.

I'm as seriously into AH as anyone, and I've run a similar-capability PC for AH for years to my complete satisfaction.

No one, regardless of computer setup, is going to be gaming well while the computer is doing a Windows update (or anything similarly intensive), so you don't have to worry about that.

The way physics works, the above PSU is more than enough for the hardware it is running, and there would be zero difference in having a more-powerful PSU for that system.

If you want to run VR or a 4k monitor for AH, or if you want the environment-map slider set to higher numbers, yep, you would want a more-powerful computer setup.

But . . .

If:
-- You are content with a 1080p, 60 Hz monitor, and
-- You are content with the environment-map slider set to "none".

Then:
-- The above system is completely sufficient for your AH needs.

[Pudgie]

Not really.

I'm as seriously into AH as anyone, and I've run a similar-capability PC for AH for years to my complete satisfaction.

No one, regardless of computer setup, is going to be gaming well while the computer is doing a Windows update (or anything similarly intensive), so you don't have to worry about that.

The way physics works, the above PSU is more than enough for the hardware it is running, and there would be zero difference in having a more-powerful PSU for that system.

If you want to run VR or a 4k monitor for AH, or if you want the environment-map slider set to higher numbers, yep, you would want a more-powerful computer setup.

But . . .

If:
-- You are content with a 1080p, 60 Hz monitor, and
-- You are content with the environment-map slider set to "none".

Then:
-- The above system is completely sufficient for your AH needs.

Hi Brooke,

Not to take away from the flow of this thread but the statement that I put in bold and underlined in your post is not quite true nowadays w\ the newer crop of multicore mainstream CPU platforms.......especially w\ the 1 that I have listed in my sig below that I have witnessed it doing exactly what you state can't happen repeatedly.

The real issue as to why this doesn't happen, outside of hardware capability, lies within the Windows OS's inability to effectively spread out the extra workload across ALL the available physical CPU cores on it's own w\ these newer mainstream multicore CPU platforms to alleviate CPU core contention from occurring w\o user intervention to instruct the OS to do so, even Win 10 cannot do this well enough at this time w\o some help. It simply will not use all of these CPU cores on it's own (unless it is instructed to spread out the loads by implementing CPU core priority and affinity to force Windows OS to run a larger running process--like AHIII if it is running at the time or Windows Update even--to run on specifically assigned physical CPU cores that Windows OS will simply not utilize--affinity--then instruct the OS to maximize the CPU processing time for said process to run on these specifically assigned CPU cores--priority High = >75% processing time) causing CPU core contention to occur across the few CPU cores it does try to use when Windows Update starts to run....usually around 4-5 physical CPU cores max regardless. Once the total workload is actually spread out enough across all the available physical CPU cores to alleviate CPU core contention from occurring across a small subset of CPU cores all runs w\o issue at the same time.

I have tried many a night to get Win 10 to do this consistently w\o my intervention but haven't been very successful unless I instruct the OS to do it for AHIII (which CAN use up to 4 physical CPU cores depending on in game graphics settings setup but usually up to 3....I've witnessed it do it so I assign AHIII to run on the 2nd CPU core CCX of 4 CPU cores on my CPU) which then allows Windows Update to use the other 4 physical CPU cores within the 1st CPU core CCX which are more than enough to handle both at the same time as the rest of the CPU on die substructure is designed to handle these type of total CPU loads easily.

If desired, you can set up the Windows Update.exe within Windows OS to use CPU priority\affinity when it starts up to be run in similar fashion to achieve the same result. I use AHIII as I find it is easier to do by setting up a Windows CMD-created shortcut to instruct the OS to apply all this upon AHIII game startup so all this happens automatically every time I start the game then let Windows OS handle the rest.

But all this is wasted if used w\ a CPU that has 4 physical CPU cores or less, regardless if HT\SMT is enabled or not as the physical CPU cores are already well used up so there isn't enough available spare CPU core capability left to take advantage of thus they WILL stumble.

It's not an AMD vs Intel issue per se nowadays............it's a Windows OS issue plain and simple.

 

[Brooke]

For me, Windows updates happen maybe once every couple of months.

I don't ever remember a Windows update kicking in while I'm gaming, and I've been gaming on Windows since Windows 95.  If it has happened to me, it's so infrequent I don't remember it ever.

Also, for my systems, when Windows update is running, it thrashes the crap out of my HD (I don't have an SSD), making the computer unusable for anything else no matter how many CPU cores I have.

The system above is not designed to:
-- Run VR.
-- Run a 4k monitor.
-- Run with environment-map slider set to much other than "none".
-- Allow you to game while Windows update is running.

[Brooke]

Just did another one of these cheap computers -- working great for AH.  60 fps with slider set to "none".

$218 for the computer, $150 for GTX 1050 graphics card, $103 for Windows 10, $100 for 24" 1080p monitor.

Here's what I got this time:

From Superbiiz.com:
1    Crucial DDR4-2400 4GB/512Mx64 CL17 Memory    CTD424UA4G    $44.99   
   1    Intel Pentium G4400 Dual-Core Skylake Processor 3.3GHz 8.0GT/s 3MB LGA 1151 CPU, Retail    G4400BOX    $51.79
   1    Microsoft Windows 10 Home Operating System 64-bit English (1-Pack), OEM    MSKW900140    $103.49

From Amazon:
APEVIA X-QTIS-BK Micro ATX Gaming/HTPC Case, 1 x 120mm Blue LED fan, $34.99
 EVGA 500 W1, 80+ WHITE 500W, 3 Year Warranty, Power Supply 100-W1-0500-KR, Black, $39.99
 WD Blue 1TB Desktop Hard Disk Drive - SATA 6 Gb/s 64MB Cache 3.5 Inch - WD10EZRZ, $45.90
Gigabyte Geforce GTX 1050 2GB GDDR5 128 Bit PCI-E Graphic Card (GV-N1050OC-2GD) $149.99 
Sceptre E248W-1920R 24 Inch Ultra Thin 1080p 75Hz LED Monitor HDMI VGA, Metal Black 2018, $99.53

Miscellaneous stuff that folks often already have:
1    Logitech K120 Wired USB Keyboard for Business (Black)    KB-K120    $11.29
   1    Kensington K72356US Wired USB Optical Mouse (Black)    KS-K72356U    $6.29
 Koss CS100 Speech Recognition Computer Headset, $14.40
 CH Products Pro Pedals USB Flight Simulator Pedals ( 300-111 ), $120.99
CH Products Flightstick Pro USB 4-Button Joystick 8-Way Hatswitch, $82.86
 Belkin 7-Port Plug-and-Play Powered Desktop Hub with USB-A Ports, $22.32