End of Full Dar

[Dundee]

#Fakenews  Double -  Warbirds died because it was not developing its  core engine.  Aces high is right on track for failure because of the same exact thing....

Wilbill was jerky, but  hitech being equally jerky with playing with it's core player base (or did you conveniently forget that).   

Lastly,  all seeing dot dar  WITH the lack of graphic development chased away squads  (who almost exclusively flew in the WWII arena  which is not to be confused with the shoot em up arena).    The shoot em up arena in Warbirds  was  what Aces high main arena was ABOUT to become with all seeing radar.   Aces high at the time was much better than warbids that it  incorporated some element of  strategy....   Warbirds was pure fighter 3 country war  shoot em up.   Aces High was about to go just that.  3  country  fighter cons  war.   No  sense  of  grouping up, no sense of  squads,  no  sense of  missions.  no  sense at all.     See the similarity it was about to become???   No brainer.

Hmmmm..   food  for thought sir.

There is a lot of truth in your post...."No  sense  of  grouping up, no sense of  squads,  no  sense of  missions.  no  sense at all.     See the similarity it was about to become???   No brainer." It will be interesting to see how this all pans out, but I think you hit the nail squarely on the head.

When I have been polled about other games I am currently playing, Ace High doesn't make the list to choose from....but I always added the games name in the "Other" section.

 

[Ron]

He has to test to make changes. So are you saying do not test or make changes?

I agree with testing and making changes. I just didn't like the two options.

[Dawger]

My group (475FG) left Aces High 15 months ago because it was hard to find a fight in the Melee. There were one or two squads that would come out the Ack to fight but it was very sparse. Mostly a lot of flying around, listening to the GV's on range voice chatter incessantly. We got tired of hide and seek. FSO was the last thing to hold us in AH but its weekly re-run of fly around for 52 minutes, get in a massive furball over the target and fly home was pretty stale. One of our members found an exciting option and the leadership decided to pursue it.

It boils down to the same thing in both Warbirds and AH. The game was set up to provide options to accomplish major game objectives without actively pursuing combat with other human players. That attracts a certain personality type and that eventually changes the character of the player base as a whole.

Personally, I am regularly flying DCS, IL2 and WT SB in VR. They each hold their strong points and one of those holds our attention enough to fly a couple hours every day (after nearly 25 years flying online AND real world flying careers).

The one thing missing is massively multiplayer persistent arena airplanes only. I (we) miss the camaraderie of the original concept. A persistent world of air combat.

We have found a place where people fly and fight with little hide and seek (there are folks who NOE Jabo but the maps are small) and ZERO human GV's.

What we don't have and apparently doesn't exist is what Warbirds and Aces High originally were. MMO air combat in a persistent arena. Every persistent arena title has tried to do "combined" operations on the theory that more people is better.

It doesn't work. That should be obvious to everyone by now but somehow it isn't. The personality type that chooses to play air clashes with the type that chooses ground in a game and it is impossible to create a game that pleases both groups. The ground type is undoubtedly  a larger group, much larger for a host of reasons so I certainly understand the business reason for pursuing them. However; they do not want to be bombed and strafed into oblivion so they want to be able to avoid/hide from airplanes. Once that idea of game play is established, the end is very predictable.

If AH were to suddenly decide to remove the human GV option and incentivize human versus human aerial combat, I would be among the first to re-subscribe. That is very likely impossible from a business perspective as it would kill a very large portion of the current subscriber rolls and require at least a year commitment to attract the air combat players into the game.

Anyway, my opinion, FWIW

 

[Shuffler]

I agree with testing and making changes. I just didn't like the two options.

Fair enough.  During testing we can only guess what it is he is attempting to discern.

[HGANCHOR]

Well, it's going on 2 weeks now that we've had Full Dar and I've come up with a theme of things I'd rather do than fly AH now.

1. Weed my lawn.

2. Water my lawn.

3. Mow the lawn.

4. Cut the hedges

5. Steam clean my carpets.

6. Paint the trim (inside and out).

7. Take my teenage daughter clothes shopping for school (that felt weird).

8. Take my wife on US 127 Longest Yard Sale (we actually started in Crossville, Tn and drove south). I hate you guys for that one.

9. Meet and befriend my new next door neighbors (I have no idea what happened to the old ones, or when they moved).

10. Watch Kermie Cam on youtube. I don't know which is worse, but I'd rather torture myself watching Kermit Weeks self glorify himself than fly in AH arcade right now.

Honorable mentions - watch tv, catch up on the news (I'd herd rumors that D. Trump had become President.), bought and started using a NuWave oven, changed my socks, walked the dogs, washed my truck, washed the wife's car, do the laundry, shop for groceries, need I go on.

The only thing I can see is that AH has made my wife happy and put a few Illegals Aliens out of work (note items 1 thru 4).

So if somebody would please txt me (Dam, HGBUCK, knob, eod907, weiser, hlywood...) when this thing is over so I can go back to being normal again.

ANCHOR sends

[popeye]

Shhhhhh....   Don't tell him it's over until he does a few more yard sales.   

[JimmyD3]

Shhhhhh....   Don't tell him it's over until he does a few more yard sales.   

 

[hitech]

gldnbb: Some how you missed the complete graphic engine update we did 2 years ago. You also seem to have missed the VR update we have done.

HiTech

[Shuffler]

gldnbb: Some how you missed the complete graphic engine update we did 2 years ago. You also seem to have missed the VR update we have done.

HiTech

I believe he missed the boat which explains why he fell off the pier.   

[Vraciu]

I believe he missed the boat which explains why he fell off the pier.   

Did he hit his head on the dock?   

[molybdenum]

Well, it's going on 2 weeks now that we've had Full Dar and I've come up with a theme of things I'd rather do than fly AH now.

1. Weed my lawn.

2. Water my lawn.

3. Mow the lawn.

4. Cut the hedges

5. Steam clean my carpets.

6. Paint the trim (inside and out).

7. Take my teenage daughter clothes shopping for school (that felt weird).

8. Take my wife on US 127 Longest Yard Sale (we actually started in Crossville, Tn and drove south). I hate you guys for that one.

9. Meet and befriend my new next door neighbors (I have no idea what happened to the old ones, or when they moved).

10. Watch Kermie Cam on youtube. I don't know which is worse, but I'd rather torture myself watching Kermit Weeks self glorify himself than fly in AH arcade right now.

Honorable mentions - watch tv, catch up on the news (I'd herd rumors that D. Trump had become President.), bought and started using a NuWave oven, changed my socks, walked the dogs, washed my truck, washed the wife's car, do the laundry, shop for groceries, need I go on.

The only thing I can see is that AH has made my wife happy and put a few Illegals Aliens out of work (note items 1 thru 4).

So if somebody would please txt me (Dam, HGBUCK, knob, eod907, weiser, hlywood...) when this thing is over so I can go back to being normal again.

ANCHOR sends

Lol!! That was awesome!

The current phase of the test has things back to nearly normal, you can come back now, at least until phase 4 kicks in.

[Ciaphas]

I was glad to see the poll pop-up in game, hopefully there will be more polls as this test progresses and in the future when new features are added or removed.

 

[Vraciu]

I was glad to see the poll pop-up in game, hopefully there will be more polls as this test progresses and in the future when new features are added or removed.

 

Unfortunately, those options will split the vote to the point that status quo will win by default.

I didn't like the bomber icons going away, at least within the radar rings.   A three-ship should show as bombers.   A solo buff....?   Maybe he can show as a fighter.

I am wondering if a "Theater Radar" wouldn't be a good compromise.   Slower update.   Shows stuff at long range but not necessarily type.   Can be bombed.   I know Hitech said he was working on some other iterations of the theme to come up with something that to me sounded both realistic and helpful to finding engagements.

[Lazerr]

Unfortunately, those options will split the vote to the point that status quo will win by default.

I didn't like the bomber icons going away, at least within the radar rings.   A three-ship should show as bombers.   A solo buff....?   Maybe he can show as a fighter.

I am wondering if a "Theater Radar" wouldn't be a good compromise.   Slower update.   Shows stuff at long range but not necessarily type.   Can be bombed.   I know Hitech said he was working on some other iterations of the theme to come up with something that to me sounded both realistic and helpful to finding engagements.

When I played on Monday, bomber icons showed up inside of an undestroyed dar circle.

[TDeacon]

My group (475FG) left Aces High 15 months ago because it was hard to find a fight in the Melee. There were one or two squads that would come out the Ack to fight but it was very sparse. Mostly a lot of flying around, listening to the GV's on range voice chatter incessantly. We got tired of hide and seek. FSO was the last thing to hold us in AH but its weekly re-run of fly around for 52 minutes, get in a massive furball over the target and fly home was pretty stale. One of our members found an exciting option and the leadership decided to pursue it.

It boils down to the same thing in both Warbirds and AH. The game was set up to provide options to accomplish major game objectives without actively pursuing combat with other human players. That attracts a certain personality type and that eventually changes the character of the player base as a whole.

Personally, I am regularly flying DCS, IL2 and WT SB in VR. They each hold their strong points and one of those holds our attention enough to fly a couple hours every day (after nearly 25 years flying online AND real world flying careers).

The one thing missing is massively multiplayer persistent arena airplanes only. I (we) miss the camaraderie of the original concept. A persistent world of air combat.

We have found a place where people fly and fight with little hide and seek (there are folks who NOE Jabo but the maps are small) and ZERO human GV's.

What we don't have and apparently doesn't exist is what Warbirds and Aces High originally were. MMO air combat in a persistent arena. Every persistent arena title has tried to do "combined" operations on the theory that more people is better.

It doesn't work. That should be obvious to everyone by now but somehow it isn't. The personality type that chooses to play air clashes with the type that chooses ground in a game and it is impossible to create a game that pleases both groups. The ground type is undoubtedly  a larger group, much larger for a host of reasons so I certainly understand the business reason for pursuing them. However; they do not want to be bombed and strafed into oblivion so they want to be able to avoid/hide from airplanes. Once that idea of game play is established, the end is very predictable.

If AH were to suddenly decide to remove the human GV option and incentivize human versus human aerial combat, I would be among the first to re-subscribe. That is very likely impossible from a business perspective as it would kill a very large portion of the current subscriber rolls and require at least a year commitment to attract the air combat players into the game.

Anyway, my opinion, FWIW

 

Your assumption that eliminating GV players will then somehow attract air players willing to play victim to your horde (aka 475FG) is questionable. 

MH