F-22 vs Su35

[MiloMorai]

Putting here as is not WW2 related.

US F-22s came face-to-face with Russia's top fighter near Alaska and were at a major disadvantage

Now don't laugh too hard.

https://amp-businessinsider-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/amp.businessinsider.com/us-f-22s-faced-russias-su-35-over-alaska-at-a-major-disadvantage-2018-9?amp_js_v=0.1#amp_tf=From%20%251%24s

[DaveBB]

It's 90% pilot, 10% plane.  As long as the planes are even roughly equal (same generation +/- .5), the better trained pilots would have won.

[Ciaphas]

my brain hurts... .


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[Puma44]

Putting here as is not WW2 related.

US F-22s came face-to-face with Russia's top fighter near Alaska and were at a major disadvantage

Now don't laugh too hard.

https://amp-businessinsider-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/amp.businessinsider.com/us-f-22s-faced-russias-su-35-over-alaska-at-a-major-disadvantage-2018-9?amp_js_v=0.1#amp_tf=From%20%251%24s

Wow!  Just wow. A fairly routine interception event and no combat, as it should be, and this writer comes up with some fantasy.  Entertaining to say the least. By the way, theses interceptions have been happening regularly since the 50s.  They will occasionally make local news stations but, are mostly a yawn event.  Except for the fighter jock who gets to run the intercept with his hair on fire and fangs out.

“Hamburger is Hamburger, no matter what you wrap it in” - Annonymous Fighter Pilot from year’s past.

[Delirium]

F22 are designed for BVR combat, but in the situation that is not authorized for live fire the F22 will always be at a distinct disadvantage.

The real concern is with Command; will the brass issue a ROE that limits their engagement distance? If so, a repeat of the F-4 Phantom vs MiG 19/21 dogfights of Vietnam will take place where the real long arm of the U.S. aircraft will be castrated.

[Oldman731]

Now don't laugh too hard.

"A pilot intruding into US or US-protected airspace who meets an F-22 really has no idea whether the jet is armed."

Laugh?  I think it's tragic that the Bolshevik pilots are sent across the waters so ill-informed.  Imagine their surprise if worst came to worst.

- oldman

[Mister Fork]

Interesting indeed.  While technology wise the F-22 is still superior in weapons and avionics, the Su-35 is still a big threat with their similar tech (abet if it's working) I don't think even a momentary skirmish the USAF or the Pentagon would be worried cause of three primary reasons

Firstly, what if the Russian's did shoot first, and shot down the F-22's or any other interceptor? So what?

Secondly, engagement doctrine is not built on moment-in-time scenarios, but long term strategy. So, sure, round 1 tactics may be a bit lame, but does it really matter for round 2 with gloves off?

And if they did shoot down or attempt to shoot down an intercepting force, would it matter what kind of aircraft are used? Could AI drones do the same job? (wouldn't that scare the sheit out of the ruskies? )

[Delirium]

To be blunt, if the Russian shot down or engaged any aircraft within U.S. airspace the least of our worries is that individual dogfight. I imagine the scenario would quickly escalate with absolute catastrophic results in the air, on land, and on/under the sea.

Luckily, this is Russia flexing muscles attempting to determine the response time of mainland interceptions, and granting the Russian citizens some badly needed PR at home.

[Meatwad]

my brain hurts... .


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Ditto

[fd ski]

What a dumb article. F-22 is at disadvantage because missiles are not visible ? Russian flying a 35 will know where they are....

As for turning fight, it would be unlikely to start from "side by side" state. 22 approaching with stealth will have first shot advantage and 35 will be lucky to survive first amraam salvo. Even if it does, with K-73s and Aim-9x onboard, dogfights will be slightly different those days..

[MiloMorai]

Are these intercepts flown by one a/c? 

[JOACH1M]

The person who wrote the article should be fired.

[Toad]

Justin Bronk, an expert on combat airpower at the Royal United Services Institute, previously told Business Insider that fifth-generation fighters like the F-22, with its internal weapons stores and reliance on stealth, and the F-35 were "not really necessary" for interceptions and that "other, cheaper interceptors can do the job."

All the rest of the blather aside, this is actually pretty much spot on.

Back in the second half of the '70s when I flew recon, the interceptors were not the front line stuff. The front line stuff had better things to do than trail a slow-moving, multi-motor airframe around. We saw Yak 28s, SU-15s and the like. The MiG-25s and SU-23s did not have us in their playbooks.

F-15s/16s would be more than adequate for intercepts of Tu-95s and would save wear and tear on the F-22's stealth coating.

[Zimme83]

Interceptions where quite common for the SwAF during the cold war as the Skies over the baltic sea always saw a lot of both NATO and WP flights. It seems like WP fighters most of the times ran for home when intercepted. NATO fighters on the other hand liked to dance. There where a lot of "dog fights" (non hostile of course) between the Phantom (mostly Germans) and the J-35. I guess it was good training for both pilots ..

[Gman]

The entire premise of the article - that the F22 can't show off weapons and is somehow a "less than" interceptor because of this - is busted right out of the gate.  Anyone who has seen an F22 demo has probably seen it open its weapons bays in flight - doing that and a 1/4 roll would show off the white warshot missiles pretty easily to any threat being intercepted.  The 2 Aim9 bays would also be plainly visible when opened, they even stage the missile out on its mount when opened, giving probably the best look at an A2A missile on any fighter anywhere.  And, no Russian/whatever pilot is going to be so stupid as to assume that the F22s intercepting him and his wingman aren't armed, doors open or otherwise.

As Delirium said, even if the F22 put itself at a disadvantage vs SuXX fighters by getting close during an intercept, they would be the only 2 F22s lost in this manner should they be shot down, as there wouldn't be any more friendly-ish intercepts after that the next time threats came calling.  It's also a far cry from certain that in WVR that the F22 is even AT a disadvantage vs any other gen 4.5 fighter.

Worst F22 article ever.