Yak3 Drag modelling

[FLS]

So how do you explain  the video Bozon did in another thread, flying at 100ish nose up at 4kfeet climb per minute ?

I didn't see it. What's wrong with it?

Well it must have been in some other arena or another id, since it was introduced you haven't flown it once in the MA in fact you have only 2 interactions with it since 2013.

I'll bet it is a lot more complicated than a couple of parametres, definitely way over our heads, and more than likely flight modelling god FLS would be out of his depth as well.

We mere mortals can only list our experiences in game against a plane 

Yes it was in the training arena and you have better things to do than obsess over forum posts.

There is no energy retention variable, it's basically drag and thrust. The question is if the big engine should overcome as much drag as it does. So post your data.

BTW did any of you try turning with the engine off to isolate induced drag?   

[Squire]

Nonsense. And the rest is BS.

Yep.

[save]

FLS, for reference on the film(s)

https://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,364359.0.html

[FLS]

I thought the reference was to a new film. I answered that post as you can see. No reason to change my opinion.

Small light aircraft with powerful engines are very aerobatic.

[DmonSlyr]

I thought the reference was to a new film. I answered that post as you can see. No reason to change my opinion.

Small light aircraft with powerful engines are very aerobatic.

Must be why it gets 4000 more kills a tour compared to the P51B with a 2 point eny difference.

The La7 and the Spit16 are both 5 eny planes with no ord, yet still don't get as good a K/D.

If you don't kill a yak3 on the first pass, it squiggles away until it's 800 out and you'll never catch it again, but then turns back around on ya and pretty much outurnes most planes, including a P51B. It's like a 109K on even more crack. At least the K4 can't dive and is harder to shoot.

The yak3 has become another easy mode nuisance similar to the spit16 and 190D.

[bustr]

Modified one of my test terrains with an air spawn at 500ft so I don't have to waste time getting up to MAX speed. Compared the Yak3 v spit16 from 50ft at S\L max speed in a vertical popup to stall out. Both planes fell off gently and were easy to recover.

100% fuel
Yak3 at 50ft max speed 350IA
Spit16 at 50ft max speed 340IA with WEP.

Yak3 stall alt at 90IA - 4900ft
Spit16 stall alt at 90IA - 4300ft

Yak3 time to stall at 4900ft - 25sec
Spit16 time to stall at 4300ft - 21sec with WEP.

Any one of you can do this yourselves from an offline terrain using a stop watch. Hitech ignores "feelings" when it comes to his data. The only manuals for the Yak-3M on the internet cost a few dollars if one of you wants to go beyond the feelings stage and see if a flight envelope chart is included. Just search for Yak-3M and it's the operation manual. Lazy comes to mind but hey, feelings trump everything on the Internet in online games where data is concerned becasue, Oh yeah, "it just doesn't feel right to me" goes the famous over used line.

From a dealer in modern Yak here are some specs for a Yak-3M with an Allison engine: Allison V1710 1200 to 1650 hp (897 - 1233 kW). WW2 Russian engine specs:  Klimov VK-105PF-2  970 kW (1,300 hp). Numbers below are rather tame for level speed but, we see the slow speed with flaps maneuverability in the game all the time and in my test the 90mph fall off stall was gentile and easy to recover.

Max speed at 1000m - 270mph
Vne @ Sea Level - 324mph
Landing speed - 97mph
Stall speed with flaps - 81mph
Maximum load factor - +7\-3,5

http://aero-concept.com/index.htm

[bustr]

Subjected 3 more planes to this process that in the past were problems in the MA.

100% fuel, WEP where available and full speed at 50ft before pull up for vertical climb to stall.

K4
speed - 365IA wep
Time to stall - 15sec
Stall Speed - 90IA
Alt - 5000

Brewster
speed - 279IA
Time to stall - 17sec
Stall speed - 50IA
Alt - 2600

Dora
speed - 373IA wep
Time to stall - 26sec
Stall speed - 90IA
Alt - 5000

K4 is the real beast.....

[The Fugitive]

Modified one of my test terrains with an air spawn at 500ft so I don't have to waste time getting up to MAX speed. Compared the Yak3 v spit16 from 50ft at S\L max speed in a vertical popup to stall out. Both planes fell off gently and were easy to recover.

100% fuel
Yak3 at 50ft max speed 350IA
Spit16 at 50ft max speed 340IA with WEP.

Yak3 stall alt at 90IA - 4900ft
Spit16 stall alt at 90IA - 4300ft

Yak3 time to stall at 4900ft - 25sec
Spit16 time to stall at 4300ft - 21sec with WEP.

Any one of you can do this yourselves from an offline terrain using a stop watch. Hitech ignores "feelings" when it comes to his data. The only manuals for the Yak-3M on the internet cost a few dollars if one of you wants to go beyond the feelings stage and see if a flight envelope chart is included. Just search for Yak-3M and it's the operation manual. Lazy comes to mind but hey, feelings trump everything on the Internet in online games where data is concerned becasue, Oh yeah, "it just doesn't feel right to me" goes the famous over used line.

From a dealer in modern Yak here are some specs for a Yak-3M with an Allison engine: Allison V1710 1200 to 1650 hp (897 - 1233 kW). WW2 Russian engine specs:  Klimov VK-105PF-2  970 kW (1,300 hp). Numbers below are rather tame for level speed but, we see the slow speed with flaps maneuverability in the game all the time and in my test the 90mph fall off stall was gentile and easy to recover.

Max speed at 1000m - 270mph
Vne @ Sea Level - 324mph
Landing speed - 97mph
Stall speed with flaps - 81mph
Maximum load factor - +7\-3,5

http://aero-concept.com/index.htm

Nice,  but do a 30 degree turn to the left, another to the right, a tight barrel rl and THEN do the nose up climb. It seems like you'll get the same zoom.

[FLS]

Nice,  but do a 30 degree turn to the left, another to the right, a tight barrel rl and THEN do the nose up climb. It seems like you'll get the same zoom.

Post film. 

[DmonSlyr]

The K4 is a beast but statistically it does not even come close to the Yak3 in kills and K/D overall in the MA. Why do you think that is? It's easier to shoot down. It's harder to aim. It's larger. It may have a slower roll rate. It has harder views to see. Its much harder to compete in a K4 than a Yak3. The #s say that. No emotion what so ever in that statement.

When these top 3000 kill fighters are so abundant in the MA, it makes it very challenging for anyone, much less noobs, to enjoy the game. When you fly into a furball and it's 4-6 yak3s buzzing around, it's very hard to be successful and shoot someone down. This means more people fly them just to be successful, which naturally oversaturates them. There's no reason why a small 3-6 perk cost for these top 3000K fighters wouldn't hurt. Barring the P51D for marketing purposes. How hard can it possibly be to get 3 perks...

[atlau]

Agree with violator regarding k4 vs yak3. An expert in a 109k4 is more dangerous 1v1 in my opinion but very few people can reach that skill level. Whereas the yak3 has much more docile handling characteristics and very similar raw low alt performance making it so easy to fly even a caveman can do it. It feels like a cross between a k4 and spit16 and in the low alt furball environment is a beast. The modeling may be spot on. I have no basis to dispute it but its ENY is too low given its capabilities.

[ACE]

I got on the other night and found tons of yaks but they didn’t give any trouble. Even beat one in a rolling scissor with a Dora. What’s the big deal?

[DmonSlyr]

I got on the other night and found tons of yaks but they didn’t give any trouble. Even beat one in a rolling scissor with a Dora. What’s the big deal?

After flying the 190D last your, I found that the 190D was the Yaks worst nightmare. Probably why the 190D gets 1000 more kills a tour than even a yak 3. Both are nuisance, IMO.

[bozon]

Nonsense. And the rest is BS.

Well here is an insightful and well articulated reply from our FLS.
Please educate us some more! 

[FLS]

What do you suppose causes the sudden loss of roll stability that balances the torque?