Initiating AI

[nrshida]

Can anybody explain how to initiate AI aircraft in both an offline and a player-hosted arena? I can find and alter the settings, but cannot get the AI to appear.

Thanks in advance.

[CptTrips]

I think you have two options:

1.  Use a technique like Bustr worked out: https://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,397806.msg5273395.html#msg5273395

2.  Use Staged Missions with a Custom Arena.  You can create your own Staged Missions or use already existing Staged Missions that have been uploaded for the various terrains.
See launch process here: https://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,397942.0.html

[nrshida]

Thanks CptTrips for your help. I got the impression that the AI configuration was a recent addition (within the last year?) and assumed I was simply missing something in the initiation. I didn't realise you needed a customised map with spawn points, nor that it HAD to be hosted on HTC's servers. Little bit defeats the object.

Bit of a strange feature. Unfinished perhaps?

[CptTrips]

Thanks CptTrips for your help. I got the impression that the AI configuration was a recent addition (within the last year?) and assumed I was simply missing something in the initiation. I didn't realise you needed a customised map with spawn points, nor that it HAD to be hosted on HTC's servers. Little bit defeats the object.

Bit of a strange feature. Unfinished perhaps?

Sorry, I was glossing over stuff. (I might get some of this wrong, but my best attempt...)

The Arena Configuration File parameters for Drone capabilities I think were added during War Online: Pacific development.  Hitech migrated those features over the AH and exposed them in the configuration file and the Staged Mission editor when he was supporting me during the WWI: Western Front effort.  I really needed it because the default parameters were more appropriate from WWII aircraft and were completely out of whack in WWI.  That was done around Spring of this year.  So that is reasonably new. 

The Staged Missions has been around for years, but largely abandoned. You can kinda get Staged Missions working offline, but that code has bit-rotted over the years and I'm getting the impressions there is no financial incentive for HTC to divert limited resources over to work on it again.  I always ran into odd problems running missions offline.  There is currently a bug where if you have wingmen, when the enemy shoot your wingmen, you take kill-shooter damage.  That limits what you can to.  Pretty much single-combat-warrior against 1..N AI opponents.   Even then, I can't swear you won't see other weirdness.  I've found running the uploaded Staged Missions on a Custom Arena much more stable.

I think going Bustr's route, you can just load the terrain the MP uses in your Custom Arena and then at least you can tweak the settings.  I've never tried the MP, but I gather there server is just iterating through the aircraft id list and spawning AI using the settings so I guess it sends up B-17 to dogfight you.   

If there are one or two simple setups you'd like, I could knock something together for you and upload it for your use, as long it wasn't too complicated.

Have you tried WWI: Western Front on the Melee tab? It is free to play if you like WWI.

I recently added a furball mission for the Italy terrain if you want to give that a try in a Custom Arena.  See https://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,397941.0.html

If you wanted to start making your own Staged Missions, as long as you have a high pain threshold, I could try and help point you in the right direction there.   

[nrshida]

Have you tried WWI: Western Front on the Melee tab? It is free to play if you like WWI.

I have seen the Western Front arena and it's very good although the old stringbags are not exactly my cup of tea.

If there are one or two simple setups you'd like, I could knock something together for you and upload it for your use, as long it wasn't too complicated.

If you wanted to start making your own Staged Missions, as long as you have a high pain threshold, I could try and help point you in the right direction there.   

It's very kind to offer but not worth expending any energy on. Actually I was just thinking the old furbal lake with AI that would only come one-at-a-time, and / or adhere to the same flight model / flight envelop limitations we had would be worth having even if it was an offline game. Actually especially offline if you get my long-term meaning.

I can't imagine why HTC configured them with absurd turning ability and energy retention. It's of no use to anyone, new or experienced players alike.

Thanks all the same CptTrips for taking the time to explain and offer to help. Too bad I didn't meet you earlier 

[CptTrips]

I have seen the Western Front arena and it's very good although the old stringbags are not exactly my cup of tea.

No worries.  I knew WWI wouldn't appeal to many.  Since I wasn't sure it would even work, and it was a pretty large effort, I determined I'd do something I wanted at least(i.e. WWI) because I could always go get a WWII fix in Melee or Scenario.

I have a folder on my desk with a design for a WWII AI-Augmented arena using the same techniques.  (WWII: 1940-1943) It would be an Early-Mid war arena.  It would be divided into zones with specific plane match-up for AO and era. Early on one half and Mid on the other.  Then split into AO.  It is not intended to be historical terrain, but evocative of that AO.  So you could move around and sample different flavors.


 So like zones:
Early
  BOB Channel Zone (Huri, Spits vs HE111, 109, Stuka, JU88, 110)
  Eastern Front Zone  etc
  Russian v Finn etc
  Flying Tigers in China etc
  Pacific Islands etc
Mid
  American v German etc
  American vs Italian etc
  Brit v German etc
  German v Russian
  Pacific Islands etc

Something like:



Maybe I'll get time and Hitech will let me do that someday.  I know it would be more popular than WWI, but I still don't know if it would be popular enough to justify the effort.  It's hard to get anyone to do anything other than click on Melee.   Still, it would be a good complement to WW1WF.

It's very kind to offer but not worth expending any energy on. Actually I was just thinking the old furbal lake with AI that would only come one-at-a-time, and / or adhere to the same flight model / flight envelop limitations we had would be worth having even if it was an offline game. Actually especially offline if you get my long-term meaning.

Well, no man can know what the future holds.  But for now, there is no reason not to play missions off a Custom Arena.  It doesn't require an account. 

I can't imagine why HTC configured them with absurd turning ability and energy retention. It's of no use to anyone, new or experienced players alike.

The AI definitely benefits from careful tweaking of the capability variables.  Even between aircraft.  That's why I feel the Staged Mission path is superior to the random MP spawn mode. 
In Staged Missions  I can give each flight of aircraft type their own parameters and tell bombers they are not dogfighters!     It's more work, but you have so much more control.
 The results are worth it IMHO.

Did you try the mission on the Italy terrain?  I'd be interested to know if you felt they were more reasonably balanced. 


 

[Ciaphas]

Can you point me to the doorway of staged missions?


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[CptTrips]

Can you point me to the doorway of staged missions?


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Sure.  I'll start a thread over in the Staged Missions area.

https://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,397985.0.html

[Ciaphas]

thanks man, I will have a look at it this weekend





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[bustr]

You can limit the number of drones that spawn in the arena setup parameters for AI drones (DroneCnt= 1-10). I wish Hitech would introduce a parameter that you can designate the drone or drones that will launch based on the specific number assigned to each aircraft you reference with .PLANE PlaneNumber. That might make the process that CptTrips and Hitech helped me to get up and running as a custom arena, more popular for the fighter combatant fans. There was consternation at none fighter aircraft furballing in the Match Play arena. I think myterr is still in the custom host menu and once you create an arena with it, type .sgt 3 and the AI drones will launch momentarily. I think I put in an airspawn so you can launch co-alt with the AI.

From a conversation with Hitech, I do not believe he is interested in exposing the AI functions to players for offline play.

[zack1234]

Freaks

[CptTrips]

Freaks

Funny.  I get that a lot. 

[ONTOS]

A game to hard, an enemy to tough, a bridge to far.

[CptTrips]

A game to hard, an enemy to tough, a bridge to far.

Yes.  That too.

[streakeagle]

A little off topic, but Western Front is pretty cool. The AI are a bit too easy to kill, but if I am having a hard time finding fun in the MA, I can always go here and have some fun. I would love to see a WW2 version.