WWII: 1940-1943 (Request for Comment)

[CAV]

Would there be any real interest in another AI-Augmented WWII arena?

For me... no.   I don't pay $15 a month to kill AI, just like in IRACING wouldn't  pay to racing AI.

CAVALRY

[CptTrips]

For me... no.   I don't pay $15 a month to kill AI, just like in IRACING wouldn't  pay to racing AI.

CAVALRY

No worries.  But just to clarify though, like WW1WF, I assumes Hitech would be placing this in the F2P area, so you aren't paying for either.

[streakeagle]

His point isn't about the cost, just that the majority of players come here to fight people. There are much better venues for flying against AI. Even with free access, how many people are playing in free arenas? In the old days when AH was $30 per month, the main arena was pretty full, and free HTH arenas were available, there were at most 20 or 30 regulars and maybe only at most 10 or 15 flying at any one time.

But I still like the AI arena. With player numbers so low and some nights just being no fun for me despite the number of players, I can go take off in a Camel or Dr.I and do some furballin'.

And as I said before, if you make a WW2 arena, I will surely enjoy buzzing around in a P-40C in a way that isn't possible most nights in the MA.

But 6 months of work for something that is only going to be used by a very small handful of people even with free access isn't a very good tradeoff unless you will enjoy the effort and results even if it is hardly ever used.

[Shuffler]

His point isn't about the cost, just that the majority of players come here to fight people. There are much better venues for flying against AI. Even with free access, how many people are playing in free arenas? In the old days when AH was $30 per month, the main arena was pretty full, and free HTH arenas were available, there were at most 20 or 30 regulars and maybe only at most 10 or 15 flying at any one time.

But I still like the AI arena. With player numbers so low and some nights just being no fun for me despite the number of players, I can go take off in a Camel or Dr.I and do some furballin'.

And as I said before, if you make a WW2 arena, I will surely enjoy buzzing around in a P-40C in a way that isn't possible most nights in the MA.

But 6 months of work for something that is only going to be used by a very small handful of people even with free access isn't a very good tradeoff unless you will enjoy the effort and results even if it is hardly ever used.

Correction..... most people that come here and leave do not want to fight real people. They just want to be unbeatable or be able to use a code or buy themselves better than others.

They leave because they are not scary good in 3 minutes.

[CptTrips]

His point isn't about the cost, just that the majority of players come here to fight people.

It's my fault.  I didn't really frame the question properly.  I'm really not interested in the people who want to stop by and declare they will never give it a try.  OK.  I'm just taking it for granted that will be the majority of players.  Therefore that view is not particularly useful to me.  What I really need to know is, is there a minimal number of people who would.  If there are a sufficient number of those, then it is worth it to me and those who refuse to try it, can go suit themselves.

And I probably wasn't clear about my goal.  When I was ribbing you on the incongruities in you last answer, I should have made it clear, those minor benefits you listed that you felt were insufficient to justify my effort, are actually most of the goals I'm trying to achieve. 

If it provides you a cool place to get some target practice that is available on demand to you 24/7, that is a win in my book.
If it provides a place for you to toy around with some plane matchups you don't often get the chance to enjoy, that is a win in my book.
If it provides new/young players a place to play around in something that sorta feels like a full multiplayer arena and helps them build their skills and confidence, , that is a win in my book.

Basically what I found funny in your post is that you were telling me you thought it would be a success, at least in the terms I would measure it in.

I'm not trying to change AH.  I'm not trying to compete with the Melee. I don't expect this to bring 700 players back to Ah.  I don't expect large numbers of players to fill this arena or spend large amounts of time in there. 

My goals are very limited.  I just wanted to provide an extra fun toy to be available when people are feeling bored or want to get some quick practice, or want to play around with some plane matchup they may only get to fly every couple of years in a scenario.  When all the stars align, nothing beats player vs player action.  But if the Melee is empty or the map sucks or the side are hopelessly unbalanced, or your tired of chasing people to ack, or if you want to fly some early war, I just want to provide one more option for you to have fun in Aces High rather than logging off completely and going to watch TV.

And yeah, AI does get tedious eventually.  I'm not expecting that it won't.  Then you'l go do something else.  Cool.  I expect a majority of players will turn their nose up at it.  Cool.  I don't need everyone to be open to it, just a few.   

Hitech ran a starts report for me for WW1WF.  It was pretty interesting.  Days varied, but on a good day it might get 10 unique users scattered though out the day.  They might fly 3-4 sorties and then leave.  A certain percentage of the come back again and again.  So, with it's imperfections, they must be enjoying it enough to return.  They are not all in there at once.  That is the beauty of AI available 24/7.  They pop in when ever they want at various times and get a few sorties in and then leave.  A lot of them appear to be non-subscribers, I hope youngsters.  Maybe some of them will eventually catch the bug and want to become long term customers. 

Given how under popular WWI is and how limited I could make the experience with the WWI plane-set,  I think the numbers were not too bad.  I think I would do better with a WWII.

[lunaticfringe]

why do people keep trying to add new arena's? barely have 150 in melee on a good night,-I have no idea if WWII-pacific is still going-WWI-western front is empty 99.99%  of the time. like right sunday oct 20 1:14 pm central no one in either WWI arena.

last thing we need is another arena.

[Shuffler]

I logged on last night and was planning of flying awhile. I logged off after 45 minutes because of one person constantly complaining.

People not there to play the game should be booted. Constant naggers are a detriment to the game.

[CptTrips]

last thing we need is another arena.

Oh, that’s it.  It’s on like Donkey Kong!

I’m going to do it for now for no other reason than looney doesn’t want me to.

All I needed was one good excuse. 

[Shuffler]

Oh, that’s it.  It’s on like Donkey Kong!

I’m going to do it for now other reason than looney doesn’t want me to.

All I needed was one good excuse. 

 

[DaddyAce]

Gor for it Trips!  It sounds like a good idea to me.   

[streakeagle]

If it is any consolation, add an early/mid WW2 arena just for me I would use it, as I have already used the WW1 arena you made.

Dogfighting AI gets boring, but continually getting clubbed by late war monsters is worse. I have had some nights where my poor little P-40C was getting trounced by Me262s. Of course, I have had a few nights where I have killed Spitfire MkXIVs with my crappy little P-40C, too. The problem is most nights, I waste my time grabbing alt and transiting to the fight only to get killed within seconds due to being outnumbered by superior aircraft who are also already at higher energy states.

I miss the days when the crowds were large enough to support early and mid war arenas. There were never very many people in the early war arenas, but the fights were usually pretty good, like the many nights I spent in free HTH back in 2001-2002 when I couldn't afford to subscribe. I love flying Axis vs Allied with early war aircraft. Spit I vs Bf109E, P-40C vs Oscar/A6M2, etc. But it is rare that I can have any fun with those aircraft in the MA.

Aces High has two key strikes against it that are killing business compared to other WW2 air combat options:
1) Crappy graphics (on a relative scale, other games look way better, pretty much photo real aircraft and nearly photo real terrain at this point).
2) Extremely lethal to anyone who hasn't played regularly for years. Most of the players that remain are average or far better and will smoke anyone new to this level of realism/lethality.

Beyond that, I am willing to bet that most people who play the other online WW2 air combat games simply don't know that Aces High exists or how it is superior to most other WW2 air combat games once you get over the steep learning curve fighting against veteran players.

[pembquist]

I think the thing that a good use of AI would do for a new player checking out the game is to give him that shot of dopamine or whatever that comes from shooting down another airplane that is fighting back, something hard to get in an MA full of long time player concentrate, vulching, take off and climb out time.  I think maybe a really simple arena called "TARGET PRACTICE" (maybe even add "new player start here") with a simplified clipboard that says "pick plane" instead of hanger and then 4 buttons that say "Difficulty 1 Launch" "Difficulty 2 Launch" .....etc. Have unlimited ammo and a map that when closed has a tab showing that says "Map" Basically throw out or hide all of the other choices and complexity of interface. Air spawn, no fence of death, a place to land and take off if you land there. Persistent AI without aircombat bombers, 4 levels of skill, ideally number of AI modulates to number of players. NO STALL PROTECTOR, SAME FLIGHT MODEL. Add another launch button that says "Intercept Bombers" that airspawns the player in front of a 15 plane bomber stream.


The existing matchplay could be improved if a player could use the 1v1 2v2 etc. to launch themselves against an AI, if they could pick the plane. Maybe the buttons could be "YOU vs SPITFIRE 8" etc.

[Litjan]

Just to clarify: Would the propsed arena be strictly human vs AI (or as they say PVE)? Or would it be a battleground where AI battles AI and humans could join in on either side?

[CptTrips]

Just to clarify: Would the propsed arena be strictly human vs AI (or as they say PVE)? Or would it be a battleground where AI battles AI and humans could join in on either side?

More the later. 

AI v AI.  AI vs human.  Human vs Human.  But even when no one is there, the AI are happily fighting each other all day, all night, forever.  Like Valhalla.

[Litjan]

Well, I think its certainly something worth a shot! As others have said before - the lack of action and things to shoot at (with a fair chance of surviving the encounter) is something that is draining the lifeblood out of Aces High.

Count me in!

Litjan