Author Topic: Just an observation  (Read 4825 times)

Offline Lazerr

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Re: Just an observation
« Reply #30 on: December 02, 2020, 04:19:19 AM »
FORGET THE STATS!!!!  All he is saying is he use to get more kills per hour of play than he does now, only meaning he either has a hard time finding fights or many players have gotten much better and are killing him more often  :noid

New players arent leaving because their stats suck, they are leaving because it takes too long to get a kill! Either they are spending too much time finding a fight (boring), of the are getting their a s s e s handed to them instantly. (frustrating)

If a way was found for new player to get into action quicker, of get lucky enough to get a few quick kills diving through a large furball  it would more than likely help keep those players in the game.

I think the answer to this is larger scale battles, to kind of dilute the population a little bit, if you see what im saying.

Two ways of this are smaller maps concentrating the action, or two teams. 

Offline FESS67

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Re: Just an observation
« Reply #31 on: December 02, 2020, 06:19:25 AM »
I now put my money into World of Warships.

Fast paced action in bite sized chunks.  Sure, there are elements that I like and dislike, same as in here.  But, after 2 minutes I am actively waiting for my guns to reload and I am smashing that button to fire again.  That happens for most of the game.

I left AH because it became a game of chase and people would mouth off but never actually back themselves in combat.  There was little in the way of actual combat, it was simply a case of hit and run.  Bored me out of the game.  I think the wide spread of aircraft is both good and bad but perhaps mostly bad.  If I chose to fly a 109E then I was pretty much always going to be defensive because others were in late war planes.  kinda fun for a while but then it loses its sheen.  would be much better if all other players were in comparable aircraft.

WOWS tries to balance this by matching tiers so no one is completely out matched and you have a chance to compete.  How you use that chance is up to you.   WOWS also puts you in a room and says 'FIGHT'   AH puts you in a large world and let's you do your thing, many (too many) choose to milk run towns and not fight.  We even see it in the GV game where hiding is preferred to fighting.  The mismatch of planes becomes very evident as we see hit and run or sadly many people chose to farm points from hitting undefended towns and when an enemy fighter turns up they run or bail.

Question is, if you are a combat game then promote <even> combat.  The loss in numbers is not due to people leaving the genre, the World Of 'xxxx' franchise proves that.  What AH lacks, as alluded to in the OP post, is an active combat environment which means action as soon as possible, for as long as possible and AH does not currently provide that so players like me go elsewhere to get it.

Perhaps in the old days the abundance of numbers masked the issue however now with fewer people playing it shines a spotlight on the issue.  There is not enough combat to keep combat oriented players interested.

Offline Shuffler

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Re: Just an observation
« Reply #32 on: December 02, 2020, 07:22:37 AM »
I now put my money into World of Warships.

Fast paced action in bite sized chunks.  Sure, there are elements that I like and dislike, same as in here.  But, after 2 minutes I am actively waiting for my guns to reload and I am smashing that button to fire again.  That happens for most of the game.

I left AH because it became a game of chase and people would mouth off but never actually back themselves in combat.  There was little in the way of actual combat, it was simply a case of hit and run.  Bored me out of the game.  I think the wide spread of aircraft is both good and bad but perhaps mostly bad.  If I chose to fly a 109E then I was pretty much always going to be defensive because others were in late war planes.  kinda fun for a while but then it loses its sheen.  would be much better if all other players were in comparable aircraft.

WOWS tries to balance this by matching tiers so no one is completely out matched and you have a chance to compete.  How you use that chance is up to you.   WOWS also puts you in a room and says 'FIGHT'   AH puts you in a large world and let's you do your thing, many (too many) choose to milk run towns and not fight.  We even see it in the GV game where hiding is preferred to fighting.  The mismatch of planes becomes very evident as we see hit and run or sadly many people chose to farm points from hitting undefended towns and when an enemy fighter turns up they run or bail.

Question is, if you are a combat game then promote <even> combat.  The loss in numbers is not due to people leaving the genre, the World Of 'xxxx' franchise proves that.  What AH lacks, as alluded to in the OP post, is an active combat environment which means action as soon as possible, for as long as possible and AH does not currently provide that so players like me go elsewhere to get it.

Perhaps in the old days the abundance of numbers masked the issue however now with fewer people playing it shines a spotlight on the issue.  There is not enough combat to keep combat oriented players interested.

That is what many kids look for these days, instant gratification in bite size bits. That and the ability to buy yourself better.

I have been playing some Red Dead Redemption 2 and GTA V. Both suffer from the same "buy yourself better".
« Last Edit: December 02, 2020, 07:24:09 AM by Shuffler »
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Offline Eagler

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Re: Just an observation
« Reply #33 on: December 02, 2020, 07:32:14 AM »
Tried the boat game but boring to me compared to AH

As Shuffler stated - typical mindset - they can buy their way to the top

My oldest just sold his character in some super hero game for over $9,000 after spending more than that in it for the last couple of years.

The guy is very wealthy and now paying him more to advance the character futher.

Different time, different priorities

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Offline SpinDoc1

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Re: Just an observation
« Reply #34 on: December 02, 2020, 10:05:32 AM »
I now put my money into World of Warships.

Fast paced action in bite sized chunks.  Sure, there are elements that I like and dislike, same as in here.  But, after 2 minutes I am actively waiting for my guns to reload and I am smashing that button to fire again.  That happens for most of the game.

I left AH because it became a game of chase and people would mouth off but never actually back themselves in combat.  There was little in the way of actual combat, it was simply a case of hit and run.  Bored me out of the game.  I think the wide spread of aircraft is both good and bad but perhaps mostly bad.  If I chose to fly a 109E then I was pretty much always going to be defensive because others were in late war planes.  kinda fun for a while but then it loses its sheen.  would be much better if all other players were in comparable aircraft.

WOWS tries to balance this by matching tiers so no one is completely out matched and you have a chance to compete.  How you use that chance is up to you.   WOWS also puts you in a room and says 'FIGHT'   AH puts you in a large world and let's you do your thing, many (too many) choose to milk run towns and not fight.  We even see it in the GV game where hiding is preferred to fighting.  The mismatch of planes becomes very evident as we see hit and run or sadly many people chose to farm points from hitting undefended towns and when an enemy fighter turns up they run or bail.

Question is, if you are a combat game then promote <even> combat.  The loss in numbers is not due to people leaving the genre, the World Of 'xxxx' franchise proves that.  What AH lacks, as alluded to in the OP post, is an active combat environment which means action as soon as possible, for as long as possible and AH does not currently provide that so players like me go elsewhere to get it.

Perhaps in the old days the abundance of numbers masked the issue however now with fewer people playing it shines a spotlight on the issue.  There is not enough combat to keep combat oriented players interested.

This is similar to a bit of what I suggested in an earlier post I made: https://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,400712.0.html

I think you've keyed in on the arguments quite well. People want quicker combat. How about an area of the map where airstarts are the norm? Kind of a blending-in of elements from HiTech's other recent effort (see Steam entry for: War Online: Pacific)

I think there's a very real desire to have quicker, tighter action. The MA is great, and it may make sense to leave that completely alone for all the die-hards of the current format. But I think it's worthwhile to consider bringing in a new crowd to the fold that will be able to jump in and literally get to the action right away.
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Offline Max

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Re: Just an observation
« Reply #35 on: December 02, 2020, 11:12:35 AM »
<<People want quicker combat. How about an area of the map where airstarts are the norm? >>

Furball Lake was generally always populated. There's presently 4 free arenas that see little, if any, action. How hard would it be to dump them and bring back Furball Lake as a free player arena with a limited mid-war planeset? No AI or Match Play duels...just a Fightertown, where folks can jump in for instant action. I don't see how any current subscriber would cancel their account in lieu of the new arena, and it stands to draw in new blood who might be compelled to subscribe to Melee,  A v A, etc.

Offline Puma44

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Re: Just an observation
« Reply #36 on: December 02, 2020, 11:49:38 AM »
<<People want quicker combat. How about an area of the map where airstarts are the norm? >>

Furball Lake was generally always populated. There's presently 4 free arenas that see little, if any, action. How hard would it be to dump them and bring back Furball Lake as a free player arena with a limited mid-war planeset? No AI or Match Play duels...just a Fightertown, where folks can jump in for instant action. I don't see how any current subscriber would cancel their account in lieu of the new arena, and it stands to draw in new blood who might be compelled to subscribe to Melee,  A v A, etc.

Try out Monday Night Madness in the AvA every week at 8:00 pm est.  Continuous  dogfights, small map, and great fun.  Usually 18-24 players with lots of mid war action.



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Offline Wiley

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Re: Just an observation
« Reply #37 on: December 02, 2020, 11:53:49 AM »
<<People want quicker combat. How about an area of the map where airstarts are the norm? >>

Furball Lake was generally always populated. There's presently 4 free arenas that see little, if any, action. How hard would it be to dump them and bring back Furball Lake as a free player arena with a limited mid-war planeset? No AI or Match Play duels...just a Fightertown, where folks can jump in for instant action. I don't see how any current subscriber would cancel their account in lieu of the new arena, and it stands to draw in new blood who might be compelled to subscribe to Melee,  A v A, etc.

I really, really, really do not comprehend why the guys that keep asking for that arena setup don't set it up in a custom arena.

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Offline Lusche

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Re: Just an observation
« Reply #38 on: December 02, 2020, 12:05:18 PM »
I really, really, really do not comprehend why the guys that keep asking for that arena setup don't set it up in a custom arena.

Because it doesn't work.

Lake Furball (the place where I got my first "Lusche has landed 2 kills" message ever) was very popular back in the day - so popular that I think the significant drop in KH in late 2006 was largely caused by it's removal when the arenas split. And I guess it still would be if it could be brought back in some form in the main arena.
But as a side arena it won't work, because the numbers and options (and score+stats keeping) og the MA are the much bigger draw. When looking at a furball arena with 0-5 players or the MA with 50-150 players, most players would choose the latter.
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Offline DmonSlyr

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Re: Just an observation
« Reply #39 on: December 02, 2020, 12:05:23 PM »
Try out Monday Night Madness in the AvA every week at 8:00 pm est.  Continuous  dogfights, small map, and great fun.  Usually 18-24 players with lots of mid war action.

I wish we had this all week and weekend. I can never play on Mondays and its one of my favorite things. These kind of fights helped me so much to learn the basics of fighter combat. I don't know if I would have subscribed when I first stared because the MA was just too big for me and flying so far for a quick fight to death wasn't my favorite thing. Once I learned the planes better and then was forced to go to the MA after H2H closed, I decided to subscribe because we had the DA and I was more aware of how the game worked. It was amazing how much harder the MA was compared to the players in the H2H, but this only encouraged me to get better.

The way the AvA arena is set up for Monday madness is very close to how I always imagined a free fight arena to be.

I do see Tomcats furball FFA up sometimes. I have tried to convince TA to use a smaller map. He uses the furball lake map, IMO, the full map is just too big and scares players away. These kids of FFA type arenas need to be on a small map with a nice scenery.
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Offline Shuffler

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Re: Just an observation
« Reply #40 on: December 02, 2020, 12:07:58 PM »
Setup that arena and see who comes........................ ..

The other game of HT's did not get off the ground. Did you go there regularly????
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Offline Shuffler

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Re: Just an observation
« Reply #41 on: December 02, 2020, 12:09:10 PM »
Because it doesn't work.

Lake Furball (the place where I got my first "Lusche has landed 2 kills" message ever) was very popular back in the day - so popular that I think the significant drop in KH in late 2006 was largely caused by it's removal when the arenas split. And I guess it still would be if it could be brought back in some form in the main arena.


Main arena was very popular back in the day...... :)

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Offline DmonSlyr

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Re: Just an observation
« Reply #42 on: December 02, 2020, 12:14:12 PM »
I want the MA to stay the same. I just hope that more maps are being incorporated that relate to today's #s. I think that would help a lot. Base layout is very important. In terms of coding, I wish there was zones or something that could be created to give players an incentive to fight in certain areas. What I saw on Sunday where rooks had 10 bases, yet Bish and rooks were only fighting each other. While knights were attacking the bish to take their bases, yet bish were not fighting back. So it was very lopsided and I didn't want to join the knights hoard. And I didn't know which team was winning the current battle between rooks and bish, so I didn't switch because the rooks were probably winning. I could have switched to Bish, but I think the knights would have been mad at me considering I was on their team the entire day.
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Offline 100Coogn

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Re: Just an observation
« Reply #43 on: December 02, 2020, 12:43:15 PM »
That is what many kids look for these days, instant gratification in bite size bits. That and the ability to buy yourself better.

I have been playing some Red Dead Redemption 2 and GTA V. Both suffer from the same "buy yourself better".

I play those games too.  I don't buy anything, just keep on grindin'.

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Offline Wiley

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Re: Just an observation
« Reply #44 on: December 02, 2020, 12:59:11 PM »
Because it doesn't work.

Lake Furball (the place where I got my first "Lusche has landed 2 kills" message ever) was very popular back in the day - so popular that I think the significant drop in KH in late 2006 was largely caused by it's removal when the arenas split. And I guess it still would be if it could be brought back in some form in the main arena.
But as a side arena it won't work, because the numbers and options (and score+stats keeping) og the MA are the much bigger draw. When looking at a furball arena with 0-5 players or the MA with 50-150 players, most players would choose the latter.

But if so many people want their bite size action small arena, why wouldn't they go there?  I think there is a sizable portion of the playerbase that either don't know about the stats/records, or are past worrying about them.

The only problem I can see with it is if it got popular, it would hit the arena size cap.

About the only thing I can see that might need to change is for there to be names in lights allowed in the player arenas.

Wiley.
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