Author Topic: 2022 and Forward  (Read 7517 times)

Offline CptTrips

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Re: 2022 and Forward
« Reply #60 on: November 19, 2021, 03:23:56 PM »
Assuming you're talking about the "f2p" tag, I believe HT addressed that saying he didn't have a choice but to put F2P due to the nature of how AH is set up, eg. it is literally free to play the game, but a subscription is needed to access some of the main arenas. It is listed the same as World of Warships is on Steam (free to play, in app purchases).

That might be technically true, but regardless many potential customers didn't see it that way. 

I'm not too familiar with DCS or WoWS, but doesn't DCS have a couple of planes you can have for free and use in any of their arena?  Does WoWS have something similar?

The lawyerly view is that AHIII meets the Free tag.  In common understanding, the potential customers were probably expecting that there were a subset of planes they get for free in "the game" and can get access to others by some form of payment or grind.  Having access to an empty "Steal the Sheep" arena probably wasn't seen by the as being a fair definition.  They probably saw "The Game" as the only arena that had any players.  And that only had a two-week trial. 

Bottom line, many felt deceived in a way I assume most don't when they try DCS or WoWS.  As I said, that might be fair, or unfair.   Regardless, it's extra friction that is not helpful when you have other hurdles like graphics, UI, pacing to have to overcome. 

It seems unnecessary when there are so many hangar queens that sit unused for years at a time.  Would they also get annoyed to only having access to inferior planes? Possibly.  But it would be a lot harder to make the argument against F2P.  Just one less vulnerability to have to explain.

And I just think it would be a smarter move for HTC regardless.  It might extend the amount of contact-time they have with that potential customer to convert them that giving the a one-time two-week trial.  This game, in this decade, needs as much sales time with a potential customer as they can get as AHIII true value might not be immediately obvious and unlike 1999, they have such deep pocket competitors now.  They should avoid every friction point they can.

$0.02.






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Offline Spikes

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Re: 2022 and Forward
« Reply #61 on: November 19, 2021, 03:29:41 PM »
That might be technically true, but regardless many potential customers didn't see it that way. 

Of course not, but the point is there was seemingly no choice in the matter. There is/was no "subscription-based game" tag on Steam. There's either a price or there isn't. Even EVE is a sub-based game with some late game stuff locked behind a sub (after going mostly f2p). I'm not sure why their game does not have to say "in-app purchases".
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Offline Meatwad

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Re: 2022 and Forward
« Reply #62 on: November 19, 2021, 03:37:55 PM »
WW2OL has a basic free play version with:
Bolt Riflemen
Reserve SMGs
Airborne Riflemen and SMGs

Light tanks (Reserve version)
PZ II-C
R35
Vickers

Medium tanks (Reserve version)
PZ IIIF
H39
A-13
Light AA
Flak30
Hotchkiss 25mm

Light AT guns
pak36
25mm FR/US
2 pounder

Unarmed Trucks and haulers
Fairmile riverine ship

And they are doing great with their subscription service also. Noted they start out at $10/month but still offering both free and a sub they are doing pretty dang well. I just dont understand why there cant be a basic free service here also unless HT is scared it will undermine the subs and cause the game to go under

I play it every now and then as free and even though I am limited it still gets me in game to take part of the action
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Offline CptTrips

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Re: 2022 and Forward
« Reply #63 on: November 19, 2021, 03:44:49 PM »
Of course not, but the point is there was seemingly no choice in the matter.

Would it not have been a possible choice to add a few hangar queens to an F2P plane-set before the Steam launch?  Or soon there after to avoid further problems?

Not wanting to do something isn't quite the same as having no choice, IMHO.
« Last Edit: November 19, 2021, 03:53:20 PM by CptTrips »
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Offline AKKuya

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Re: 2022 and Forward
« Reply #64 on: November 19, 2021, 04:18:56 PM »
How does a subscription issue relate to the recruitment and retention of players?  That might have minor influence coupled with the true issue that new players download the game, subscribe and discover complete lack of organized instructional data to initially understand the game as a whole.

The main website does have some breakdown of the various aspects of the game.  Plus, there are some links to some tutorial videos.  A new player can interact with other players in the game both positively or negatively.

 
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Offline CptTrips

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Re: 2022 and Forward
« Reply #65 on: November 19, 2021, 04:40:00 PM »
How does a subscription issue relate to the recruitment and retention of players?  That might have minor influence [...]
 

Did you just answer your own question?

I didn't say it was the only issue.  I pointed out that is was a noticeable issue that was repeated time and time again in the Steam launch reviews.  It's not just my opinion.  I'm not making it up.  Go read the reviews on Steam during the launch period. 

Not only did those potential customers get turned off , but their complaints are now memorialized in a large number of the reviews for other potential customers to see and be influenced by. 

Is that really worth them not getting a free Val, P-39, c-47, or jeep?




« Last Edit: November 19, 2021, 05:01:10 PM by CptTrips »
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Offline Volron

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Re: 2022 and Forward
« Reply #66 on: November 19, 2021, 04:59:59 PM »
A decent default mouse control setup would be ideal.

I would guess under 50% of those steam folks had a joystick.

I definitely miss how the game worked with mouse/keyboard in AH2.  It's....a little rough AH3.  I managed to get it back to an "okay" level, but still have a tough time, especially gunning from a bomber.  I just can't get it like it was in AH2. :(

During AH2, I could actually put up somewhat of a fight in a fighter.  Ell, I used to dogfight with the Ju-88.  I believe it was LedMagnet(?) that I got into a dogfight with in my 88.  He was in an F4U.  Course I lost (crashed into the water while low after he took off a vertical stabilizer), but it was fun!  :rofl  Got into a dogfight in a B-26 while he was flying an La.  I think he was in the 7?  It may have been the 5.  :headscratch:  I forgot. :o  That one ended in a draw, as broke off and told me he was running out of fuel.  I would've lost but still, that was also fun! :)

AH3, I don't even try.  :(
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Offline Lazerr

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Re: 2022 and Forward
« Reply #67 on: November 19, 2021, 06:56:51 PM »
I definitely miss how the game worked with mouse/keyboard in AH2.  It's....a little rough AH3.  I managed to get it back to an "okay" level, but still have a tough time, especially gunning from a bomber.  I just can't get it like it was in AH2. :(

During AH2, I could actually put up somewhat of a fight in a fighter.  Ell, I used to dogfight with the Ju-88.  I believe it was LedMagnet(?) that I got into a dogfight with in my 88.  He was in an F4U.  Course I lost (crashed into the water while low after he took off a vertical stabilizer), but it was fun!  :rofl  Got into a dogfight in a B-26 while he was flying an La.  I think he was in the 7?  It may have been the 5.  :headscratch:  I forgot. :o  That one ended in a draw, as broke off and told me he was running out of fuel.  I would've lost but still, that was also fun! :)

AH3, I don't even try.  :(
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Offline guncrasher

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Re: 2022 and Forward
« Reply #68 on: November 19, 2021, 07:05:22 PM »
I hate to also draw attention to it, but in my mind (personal observation here, no actual data), the $14.95 monthly fee is a huge detractor for today's gaming population. They expect things for free. And if it's not free (like Netflix, etc) then it better come with a catalog of 100,000 options for when one gets bored...

I spent over 600 bucks playing world of tanks that is free in just 1 year.  thought it was cool to have at least a top tank, by the time I made a tier 10 tank, new line came up which made my tank obsolete.  truth is games like that will come up with new tanks that are over-modeled, then have an update to make them less deadly and come up with a new line, only way to get ahead is spend more money.

14.95 a month for playing a level field isnt too bad.  at least you know you wont be flying a ponyd against another ponyd with a superior engine and more lethal ammo.


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Offline CptTrips

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Re: 2022 and Forward
« Reply #69 on: November 19, 2021, 07:11:43 PM »
turn off mouse command view and free fly

I had been working on a set of Mouse-Pilot specific offline missions to give new Mouse-Pilots some flying practice and target practice in an environment where they wouldn't be instantly killed.

I was going to create a series on in-air hoops to fly through and AI targets toned WAY down to dummmy-mode to give something reasonable for a new Mouse-Pilot to shoot at until they get the feel for AHIII physics.

I gave up on the project because even I couldn't work it.  I'm not a great pilot, but apparently I'm an even worse mouse pilot.  My advice at the time to HT was if it detected a mouse only pilot, the default config should be as close to humanly possible to something like WoWP, or WarThunder or what ever they play nowadays.  I don't think it is.  Maybe I'm wrong.

But dollars to donuts, a mouse only pilot has probably already flown in those so the close you can make it, the lower the initial friction to get them in the air. 

$0.02.



« Last Edit: November 19, 2021, 07:27:57 PM by CptTrips »
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Offline SlipKnt

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Re: 2022 and Forward
« Reply #70 on: November 19, 2021, 07:41:53 PM »
I am trying to wrap my head around all of this discussion.

I don't know numbers and I am not going to talk about the computer wiz stuff.  I just don't get it.

I am going to put this out there as an average guy that loves flight simulators and was shy to start in AH.  It is difficult to grasp things in the game if you jump right into the lion's den.  Even if you spend a few days in the TA, what do you really get out of it that will help you when you arrive in the MA?

I have a little confession to make.  I started dabbling in DCS in the last few months.  It is incredibly difficult to start flying there.  Even things like starting a plane.  Setting comms.  Setting NAV.  Managing weapons systems.  Managing the on board computers.  It takes a heck of a lot of time.  Then you have to buy planes that you like.  Buy maps.  Buy "campaigns" for single off line play. The only way I learned to fly the Huey and Harrier was thru Training Videos on YouTube.   

My point in the DCS mention is that there are more players out there that don't care about the "instant action".  Many prefer the FSO style and special events style environments in which planning, training / rehearsing, then conducting the missions.  Week in and week out.  There is a unique realism to DCS that I haven't seen anywhere.  I feel that is our target audience.  The person that is okay with the $15 a month.  Use of ALL plane types.  In DCS you must have a good gaming system.  These people exist.  I literally sunk about $200 into what I have now in DCS.  I still have 2 more maps to purchase so I can operate with the squadron I am flying with there.  People even go to such extremes that the custom make parts of the cockpit on their desktop with functioning buttons.  Its crazy. 

HiTech offers the ability to fly anything you want.  You don't have to purchase specific planes.  You don't have to purchase maps.  And if you stay with it long enough and get to know us, get a squad invite if you're a fit and they tend to train you and even get you involved in the other things we do outside the MA.

So here is the point of my post.  With regard to the players that come in for 30 minutes then walk away.  If you search AH3 in YouTube, there are some cool videos.  Not much in the way of an organized training branch.  I feel that we should start a YouTube channel with instructional stuff.  Things like setting up and mapping buttons.  Add more links to the website that you can click on and print that shows you what the default set up buttons represent.  The <dot> commands.  Essentially, boost the training team.  As done before, set up clinics on a specific day and time of the week in which a trainer works with new players for 3 hours per clinic.

Since I got my new computer I've been stepping up my time online.  Whether here or DCS.  I spend a LOT of time on YouTube for DCS right now. 

I am trying to lock on filming and making video again.  I haven't really dove in too hard just yet but I would like to perhaps work toward making some training videos for new players.  If this means joining the training team, so be it.  I am not that good of a dog fighter.  I am good at level bombing and doing CAS type missions.  I think in the beginning, we need to really get some videos up on the very basics of AcesHigh and consolidate it to a Training Channel for AH3 in YouTube.  We can grow it from there.  I feel that it would poise more players checking it out to stay longer if they have an easy and clear method of learning from YouTube. 

I'll look into it this coming week and see if I can come up with a vid or two on "getting started".  Take it from there. 

Also would be cool to put up missions in their entirety of an operation in special events or FSO.  AvA.  I recently got into watching some full length missions in DCS.  Some over 3 hours long.  Start up, to launching, refueling, attacking, and RTB to landing.  We could be doing that also. 

I'll see what I can do to help.  At least on the training front.  I already volunteer my time and have dedicated my existence in this game to FSO.   

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Offline CptTrips

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Re: 2022 and Forward
« Reply #71 on: November 19, 2021, 08:03:43 PM »

So here is the point of my post.  With regard to the players that come in for 30 minutes then walk away.  If you search AH3 in YouTube, there are some cool videos.  Not much in the way of an organized training branch. 


I dunno.  I guess if you are talking AHIII specifically.


VuduVince had a bunch of excellent one didn't he?

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL54E5CE4C59347B00

Ciaphas has some good ones:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC7-L7e7-UaQE6AtfdBU1zQw/videos

Fugi?  I think had some:
https://www.youtube.com/user/ChainGuN2/videos

Even HTC had a couple ;):
https://www.youtube.com/c/aceshigh/videos

I've seen streams on Fortress Europe.
I've seen other scenario vids (Brookes maybe?)

I have problems with Dolby, but I have to say some of his videos I've seen are very professional.


More videos can't hurt, but I think they are never found based on the relevance and algorithms. 

But give it a try.  Especially if you have fun doing it.  Problem is once a training video is published, any significant game changes could make it obsolete quickly.  But what are those odds. ;)


:aok



« Last Edit: November 19, 2021, 08:09:24 PM by CptTrips »
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Offline The Fugitive

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Re: 2022 and Forward
« Reply #72 on: November 19, 2021, 09:14:56 PM »
Not me, "Latrobe" did that series for a while. He would take submitted films and critic them as a learning exercise. Was fun to watch those back in the day.

I agree the learning material wasnt always a strong point in this game. I worked with the trainers for a while on rebuilding the training web site but there was no clear leadership or design and it soon fell apart. Air Warrior had a good group of players back in the day that generated a lot of interest in the game even tho it was much smaller than Aces High. Training seminars, news letters and such were always being put out. Today there doesnt seem to be as many people willing to spend the time and effort to help promote things in the game. Both Jaeger1 and  Shipper are looking for help.

Id love to see someone take the reigns and run the show with 10-12 guys helping out to put out videos, a news letter/facebook page and so on to generate interest. If 13 guys spend 15 minutes a week on this you get more than 3 hours of work done. The more the merrier. If Hitech puts in a bit of work to make some changes to make it easier on newbs and does a relaunch with Steam (it has been year since the last one) and there is a catalog of help available it might boost the game for another 10 years who knows. 

Offline SlipKnt

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Re: 2022 and Forward
« Reply #73 on: November 20, 2021, 12:06:38 AM »
I dunno.  I guess if you are talking AHIII specifically.


VuduVince had a bunch of excellent one didn't he?

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL54E5CE4C59347B00

Ciaphas has some good ones:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC7-L7e7-UaQE6AtfdBU1zQw/videos

Fugi?  I think had some:
https://www.youtube.com/user/ChainGuN2/videos

Even HTC had a couple ;):
https://www.youtube.com/c/aceshigh/videos

I've seen streams on Fortress Europe.
I've seen other scenario vids (Brookes maybe?)

I have problems with Dolby, but I have to say some of his videos I've seen are very professional.


More videos can't hurt, but I think they are never found based on the relevance and algorithms. 

But give it a try.  Especially if you have fun doing it.  Problem is once a training video is published, any significant game changes could make it obsolete quickly.  But what are those odds. ;)


:aok

Yeah.  They all did great work on videos.  We need that again but have a consolidated channel for people to subscribe to?  Something on YouTube "sanctioned" by HT that the Training Team could perhaps manage.  That way not just anyone can post to it.   
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Offline SlipKnt

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Re: 2022 and Forward
« Reply #74 on: November 20, 2021, 12:10:27 AM »
Not me, "Latrobe" did that series for a while. He would take submitted films and critic them as a learning exercise. Was fun to watch those back in the day.

I agree the learning material wasnt always a strong point in this game. I worked with the trainers for a while on rebuilding the training web site but there was no clear leadership or design and it soon fell apart. Air Warrior had a good group of players back in the day that generated a lot of interest in the game even tho it was much smaller than Aces High. Training seminars, news letters and such were always being put out. Today there doesnt seem to be as many people willing to spend the time and effort to help promote things in the game. Both Jaeger1 and  Shipper are looking for help.

Id love to see someone take the reigns and run the show with 10-12 guys helping out to put out videos, a news letter/facebook page and so on to generate interest. If 13 guys spend 15 minutes a week on this you get more than 3 hours of work done. The more the merrier. If Hitech puts in a bit of work to make some changes to make it easier on newbs and does a relaunch with Steam (it has been year since the last one) and there is a catalog of help available it might boost the game for another 10 years who knows.

I will see if I can do "something" to help.  I am a novice with film and I am not sure how nice I can make the graphics.  That would be key.  Eye Candy!!!!

I'm gonna play around a little and see if I can figure some of this stuff out.  I am retired now so I have time.  I just don't want it to turn into a "job".  LOL
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