Why not go Free to play?

[hazmatt]

Instead of free planes for beginners maybe experienced players should be limited to ew and mw planes in ma to give beginners a fighting chance and maybe they'd stick around longer..

This should be voluntary with enormous guilt and shame awarded when any decent stick is caught buzzing around in a late war plane..

HT has already stated he's against any kind of free to play setup beyond the 2 week trial

Eagler

Aye. I get the feeling HT will pull the plug before he does any sort of free to play

[Animl-AW]

Instead of free planes for beginners maybe experienced players should be limited to ew and mw planes in ma to give beginners a fighting chance and maybe they'd stick around longer..

This should be voluntary with enormous guilt and shame awarded when any decent stick is caught buzzing around in a late war plane..

HT has already stated he's against any kind of free to play setup beyond the 2 week trial

Eagler

Telepathy
I just had this very thought last night. HT seems to be into goals and rewards.

Had we had higher numbers to still get 200-300 in two arenas, I thought of an arena similar to AW’s Relaxed Realism arena. Their goal system was to move up to Full Realism arena. RR was packed FR was half empty. It didn’t really work out for various reasons.

I know HT is against splitting the crowd. Above is good reason.

A new ayer going up against these vets can be discouraging. That fact alone could be a number deterring factor. Why newbies don’t last long. Shot down too fast to learn quick enough.

Its a science.

Its hard for me to pick at any skilled vet willing to share their skills with the underdog.
 That is a form of promotion.

[Vraciu]

The average new player stays in the game less than five minutes.   Hitech tracks all this stuff.   1000s a month come in.   

All this stuff you guys are pontificating about is IRRELEVANT.   People don't stick around long enough for free planes to matter.

[CptTrips]

The average new player stays in the game less than five minutes.   Hitech tracks all this stuff.   1000s a month come in.   

All this stuff you guys are pontificating about is IRRELEVANT.   People don't stick around long enough for free planes to matter.

It's also possible that the decision to uninstall has already been make when the first dialog pops up telling them it is only a two week trial.

That knowledge, the UI and initial graphical impression, they have already decided it isn't worth giving ten minutes much less two weeks.  Much less tediously setting up all their controls. They might spawn once just to see what in game graphics look like, but they have probably already decided to uninstall.

The charms of AH aren't going to be immediately obvious.  However people like free stuff.  If there is a populated arena they can play in long term, it might be worth them taking to time to configure.

I bet 99.999% of the people who pay for WT probably started out thinking they never intended to pay.  But they had a free portion they could F2P, so that kept them from uninstalling long enough to be turned over time.  And no, empty side arena's don't meet that criteria.

But it is academic.  Nothing will change.

[Lusche]

Instead of free planes for beginners maybe experienced players should be limited to ew and mw planes in ma to give beginners a fighting chance and maybe they'd stick around longer..

I can't really imagine a lot of subscribers being happy to pay the same money for having 39 (out of 120) planes and vehicles unavailable after X months of gameplay 

[Animl-AW]

No matter what anyone says, its no more than guess work. Its the wrong approach to put s blanket answer on it. People make individual decisions snd reasons change with time.

Its a science with no single definitive answers. If someone had all the correct answers, they would own a $billion sim.

 And some have agendas in their wording.

Here’s how it works. We do not and will not know the answers unless we talk to over 100 player who left. Anything else is speculation.

A good way to look at it is multiple answers. For cod sakes don’t listen to a known skimmer..

50% of mentioned 2 post above can be said about every game made, including his own, which is ok for what its made for.

[hazmatt]

It's also possible that the decision to uninstall has already been make when the first dialog pops up telling them it is only a two week trial.

I happened to read some comments on steam and it looks like you may be on to something. It appears that they decided they're not interested in it at the point where they realize they have to pay a subscription. Seems there needs to be a better bait and switch. Tell them it's free to play and then after 2 weeks ask them for a credit card?

[Vraciu]

Now you guys are onto something...

[CptTrips]

I happened to read some comments on steam and it looks like you may be on to something. It appears that they decided they're not interested in it at the point where they realize they have to pay a subscription. Seems there needs to be a better bait and switch. Tell them it's free to play and then after 2 weeks ask them for a credit card?

Bait and switch isn't something I'd care to engage in at all.  And I still don't know that two week would be long enough to decide the game is worth it.  You think they would have experienced an FSO or Scenario Event within two weeks?

In a perfect world, I think you'd have a two week trial of everything, and after than they still have a minimal F2P set (in the Melee they they see as THE game not some side arena).

At one time I sat and read through everyone of the 200ish reviews on Steam.  Subscription (in general and feeling baited and switched in particular) model, dated graphics, strange UI seemed to be the core of the complaints.  Pretty much in that order of volume.

But that is academic.  Nothing will change.  Especially F2P portion which HT has specifically rejected as not going to be considered.

[GasTeddy]

It's also possible that the decision to uninstall has already been make when the first dialog pops up telling them it is only a two week trial.

Or they tune to 200 and get overwhelmed by intelligent change of ideas and politeness.

[hazmatt]

Bait and switch isn't something I'd care to engage in at all.

You don't think listing it as free to play on Steam and then asking for a credit card is a sort of "bait and switch"?

Aye. I didn't read 200 comments. I was waiting for IL2 CLOD to download so I didn't have that long, but from what I saw most of the comments were about the "free to  play" subscription model.

That's why I said that they might stick around for 2 weeks instead of 10 minutes if they weren't asked for the credit card at the beginning. I'm pretty sure close to the same amount would quit after 2 weeks but at least it would be better then 10 minutes

[hazmatt]

Or they tune to 200 and get overwhelmed by intelligent change of ideas and politeness.

Hahaha. I doubt they're paying attention to 200 when they're trying to figure out how to get their controllers setup.

Speaking of 200. IL2 servers seem to have their fair amount of talk that I feel would make somebody get butthurt but I've never seen anybody get warned or banned for things they typed. Have you?

I have seen them get bounced and banned right quick for griefing.

[CptTrips]

You don't think listing it as free to play on Steam and then asking for a credit card is a sort of "bait and switch"?

I think they felt that way.  What I was referring to was,

Seems there needs to be a better bait and switch.

I think any perceived bait and switch is going to do more harm than good.  Pushing the realization to the end of the two week trial wouldn't be any better.  Might be worse.

I'd suggest not baiting and switching at all, or even allowing the misunderstanding.  I think the better solution would be to actually have a F2P portion to satisfy the expectation they seemed to be assuming based on experience with other games. 

And then the two week trial dialog would stay at the beginning and simply explain that the first two week trial is for the entire product.  After that the player is invited to still play the F2P planes in the Melee until they are ready to move to a full subscription.

But it won't happen.

[hazmatt]

Surely by now you realize I was being sarcastic with that comment?
Seems there needs to be a better bait and switch.

I agree with the rest of what you said. Especially the part that it's not going to happen

[CptTrips]

Surely by now you realize I was being sarcastic with that comment?
Seems there needs to be a better bait and switch.

I agree with the rest of what you said. Especially the part that it's not going to happen

I don't think there was any deliberate attempt at bait and switch, but if you read the reviews, none the less, that is how many reacted.

One way to avoid that would be to convince Steam not to force HTC to list it that way, another is to consider whether there might actually be an advantage to adopting some portion of that model for other benefits as well as avoiding confusion.