Author Topic: AI Scenario Events  (Read 1703 times)

Online AKKuya

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AI Scenario Events
« on: June 25, 2025, 07:52:54 PM »
My idea is to put all players one side.  This would promote fun where all would share together in same objective.  This would enable competition on which player and or squad would be the best.

This type of event requires volunteer AI designers to create vast targets of opportunity. 


Event #1

Battle of Britain

Luftwaffe is the AI side.  AI coated missions would launch hundreds of LW bombers and escort fighters across the English Channel.  Designers will have multiple missions enabling different AC types (Ju-88, He-111, Ju-87, Bf-110 C and Me-109 E) and varying altitudes, course directions and targets.

RAF is the player side.  Spit 1's and Hurri 1's to save Britain.  Players and or squads will compete against each other for most enemy AC shot down.


Event #2

8th Air Force Over Germany

AI sidw is the Mighty 8th.  AI coated missions would launch hundreds of 8th AF bombers and escort fighters across the English Channel.  Designers will have multiple missions enabling different AC types (B-17, B-24, and P-51 for high altitude missions and B-25, B-26, and P-38 for low altitude missions) and varying altitudes, course directions and targets.

LW is the player side.  Every LW and Italian fighter to save the Fatherland.  Players and or squads will compete against each other for most enemy AC shot down.

These two are the easiest to design and play.  Should this prove fruitful, then other scenarios could be imagined.
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Offline hazmatt

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Re: AI Scenario Events
« Reply #1 on: June 25, 2025, 07:57:54 PM »
This is interesting. Have you seen the offline mission where you play Luftwaffe and attack great big missions of ai bombers? I think that one might be able to be adapted to what you're describing.

Offline Eagler

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Re: AI Scenario Events
« Reply #2 on: June 26, 2025, 06:36:22 AM »
Seems some here don't like the idea of AI opponents...

Sounds like a great time!

I am for similar AI missions setup in the MA for variety and fun!

Eagler
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Offline MDStampf93

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Re: AI Scenario Events
« Reply #3 on: June 26, 2025, 08:28:27 AM »
We could set up some really really cool events utilizing this… just have no idea how to add AI to the special events arena. This is worth looking into though.
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Offline Spikes

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Re: AI Scenario Events
« Reply #4 on: June 26, 2025, 08:30:29 AM »
Nef did a lot with AI in the past. I've never messed with it but the downside is the missions have to be pre-planned outside the game and then the missions added to the game and launched. It would be nice to have a Pick-up mission style editor but it spawns AI. But I don't think that's in the cards, unfortunately.
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Offline Devil 505

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Re: AI Scenario Events
« Reply #5 on: June 26, 2025, 09:45:02 AM »
There are other problems with AI bomber formations because every plane is treated as an individual.

1. Icons overlap and blend into one large red mass, making picking out any actual bomber very difficult.

2. Extreme lag and warping when near the bombers. Expect lots of unintentional rams and rubber bullet syndrome.
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Online AKKuya

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Re: AI Scenario Events
« Reply #6 on: June 26, 2025, 06:51:25 PM »
Is CapTrips still around?  He really had a handle on the AI.
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Offline captain1ma

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Re: AI Scenario Events
« Reply #7 on: June 26, 2025, 08:18:12 PM »
i had a whole setup doing this years ago, but everyone complained about the AI. im all for it! just saying!

Offline fudgums

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Re: AI Scenario Events
« Reply #8 on: June 27, 2025, 06:10:34 AM »
i had a whole setup doing this years ago, but everyone complained about the AI. im all for it! just saying!

Did the Ai ho?
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Offline MDStampf93

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Re: AI Scenario Events
« Reply #9 on: June 27, 2025, 09:08:13 AM »
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Offline Devil 505

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Re: AI Scenario Events
« Reply #10 on: June 27, 2025, 10:04:43 AM »
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Offline CptTrips

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Re: AI Scenario Events
« Reply #11 on: June 29, 2025, 08:06:33 AM »
There are other problems with AI bomber formations because every plane is treated as an individual.

1. Icons overlap and blend into one large red mass, making picking out any actual bomber very difficult.

2. Extreme lag and warping when near the bombers. Expect lots of unintentional rams and rubber bullet syndrome.

I set up the initial template AI formations and missions for Nef.

It be nice if the icon logic had exclude bomber option.  I mean, even I can see a bomber.  I was turning my icons off at the start of a pass because of what you are mentioning.

I'd break up the formations in to multiple inbound streams of no more that 20 or so bombers and space out the stream 4 mi apart.  (I think that is close to the real group spacing in WWII).
That would allow AH's view culling logic to function most effectively and not render bombers too far away to worry about.

Ironically the warping you saw (well probably the more noticeable stuff)  was slave bombers of a human player formation janking back and forth.  In a pure AI formation, we never saw that.  I'd recommend NOT using bomber formation mode for human slots.  I'd test AI only formations with single human bombers slots.

Kuya, ironically I had reached out back in the day and offered to setup a perpetual, AI augmented BoB perma-scenario to just leave running in the AVA when ever no other event was needed to run.  Like an AvA screensaver mission. ;)

It'd have multiple varied AI bomber formations forever coming across the channel to different targets in London, on the coast, and airfields.  At different intervals with both AI escorts and interceptors.  Humans could spawn and join in either as escorts or interceptors at any point and participate.  Even human bombers could jump in and ride along as the bomber mission launch times would be getting announced on the red side and you could get ready to spawn and join.  Any time day or night.  US or Euro prime-time.  In a group or all by yourself.

The reception to the idea was fairly cool.  AI is not the AvA's style I guess.

I had also been in the beginning of making a new AI arena to replace WWI: Western Front (which was always just intended as a tech possibility demo) area with a island hopping Pacific War AI arena but it was apparent the AH community would not accept AI content so given the insane level of effort involved I decided to exercise the better part of valor.

So in short Kuya, I doubt there would be much interest and it is a metric butt ton of work.  Honestly I couldn't help.  That was several years ago and I unloaded all that knowledge from RAM.  I'd have to learn all over again and it be better for one of you guys to run with it.

cheers.
Trips





 
« Last Edit: June 29, 2025, 08:08:58 AM by CptTrips »
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Offline hazmatt

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Re: AI Scenario Events
« Reply #12 on: June 29, 2025, 08:56:21 AM »
That sounds like it would have been a blast! I'm not shocked that it got a cool reception. Seems people want it "their way" or "no way" not considering that the rest of the world may not think exactly like them. Sadly I think that kind of thinking is going to be the end of AH3.

In one of those other games (that I dare not mention) They combine AI attack planes and bombers with real players. I really think that's the way to go. The AI give the new players something to use to work on their gunnery and to learn that dead 6 is not a good angle to attack a bomber.

Offline The Fugitive

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Re: AI Scenario Events
« Reply #13 on: June 29, 2025, 10:30:15 AM »
That sounds like it would have been a blast! I'm not shocked that it got a cool reception. Seems people want it "their way" or "no way" not considering that the rest of the world may not think exactly like them. Sadly I think that kind of thinking is going to be the end of AH3.

In one of those other games (that I dare not mention) They combine AI attack planes and bombers with real players. I really think that's the way to go. The AI give the new players something to use to work on their gunnery and to learn that dead 6 is not a good angle to attack a bomber.

I always thought that the real draw of Aces High was that you were fighting REAL foes and not AI. I think the coolness of AI in the game proves that out.

Offline Devil 505

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Re: AI Scenario Events
« Reply #14 on: June 29, 2025, 11:04:23 AM »
I always thought that the real draw of Aces High was that you were fighting REAL foes and not AI. I think the coolness of AI in the game proves that out.

That's definitely part of it, but if the AI was able to run well enough to fit in with players, I'd be all for it. There's a net positive on using AI for fill slots in events for unpopular attack planes, but the AI we have is not suitable.

Ironically the warping you saw (well probably the more noticeable stuff)  was slave bombers of a human player formation janking back and forth.  In a pure AI formation, we never saw that.  I'd recommend NOT using bomber formation mode for human slots.  I'd test AI only formations with single human bombers slots.

I'm not saying you are wrong, but 30 AI planes definitely seems more laggy than 10 players with formations on my end.
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