It flies...it dies

[CptTrips]

>I think we did that because of public concern of using a nuke to
>destroy a nuke in the atmosphere.


Lol.  So the logic being that it is better to let it impact in the center of New York City.  Heh.  People are so loving stupid.

Wab

[Boroda]

Toad, I will ask my Father next time i'll visit him. He must know something about this radar. BTW, didnt know that you were an RC-135 commander. I hope you didn't participate in that KAL-007 accident (sorry - it's the first assosiation for "RC-135" for almost any Russian who remembers Sept. 1983)  BTW, general Karnukov, the one who ordered to shoot it down was a VVS commander, and retired last month.

My point is (and always was) that US acts regardless to any treaties. They use treaties and international agreements to limit their "stupid" opponents. This Krasnoyarsk story is an exellent example. Now we have this circus with "nuclear disarmament". What's next?

AKWabbit, Russia is a successor of the USSR, and all the agreements, debts, etc apply to Russia as they did to the USSR. I think I should add this to my signature template.

Unfortunately, the "coalition" we hoped to have is now in danger because of some silly tricks and bad decisions Let's see how it will turn this year... I hope - no more cold war.

[Sikboy]

Lol. So the logic being that it is better to let it impact in the center of New York City. Heh. People are so loving stupid

Yeah. that doesn't make much sense to me either, so I wish I had a source other than a foggy memory from a WMD class.

-Sikboy

[Toad]

No, I was out of the USAF when the USSR shot down KAL 007. However, I did know the RC crew that had flown a mission in the area (but were on their way home) prior to the shootdown. I did hear quite a bit about the incident.

Not to mention the KAL 707 shot down up by Murmansk.

This Krasnoyarsk story is an exellent example.

Yes, we do have an excellent example here.

The USSR, knowing that the radar was in violation of the ABM treaty, knowing it would take years to build, went ahead an built it anyway. All the while they were building it,  they denied that it violated the treaty but they KNEW it did. Then they finally adimitted that it DID violate the treaty.

Yes, an excellent example indeed.

[Boroda]

That's how one episode can look from different sides

I'll try to inquire what that radar was built for. I once saw a LPAR radar site at Olenegorsk (you should remember it if you played F-19), it is simply enormous... My Father must know something about it.  He was a head of a military instiute that worked on most of "strategic construction" until he retired in 1987. Buran/Energiya launch site was one of his last jobs...

An ancdote now: "Krym" military sanatorium near Gurzuf has a strange metal building, construction was stopped in early-80s. It's round in plan and about 15m tall. It was supposed to be a restaurant shaped like a vine-glass. The construction was stopped when Americans sent sattelite photos to Moscow and claimed it is a missile silo - it looked similiar from above and was built in a Defence Ministry territory.  

[Toad]

Boroda, it doesn't matter what it was built for.

By design/function (type: large phased array),

by location (well inside USSR, 800 kilometers from border)

and by orientation (not looking "outward")

... the Krasnoyarsk radar was a VIOLATION OF THE ABM TREATY.

AND THE SOVIET UNION ADMITTED IT!

The USSR Foreign Minister ADMITTED IT!

On 23 October 1989, Foreign Minister of the Soviet Union Eduard Shevardnadze conceded that the Krasnoyarsk radar was a violation of the 1972 Anti-Ballistic Missile Treaty....

Director of the Soviet National Air Defense Forces from 1967 to 1985 ADMITTED IT!

"Retired Soviet General Y.V. Votintsev, Director of the Soviet National Air Defense Forces from 1967 to 1985, subsequently publicly stated that he was directed by the Chief of the Soviet General staff to locate the large phased-array radar at Krasnoyarsk despite the recognition by Soviet authorities that the location of such a radar at that location would be a clear violation of the 1972 Anti-Ballistic Missile Treaty"

Now, you don't have to ADMIT it... YOU just have to ACCEPT it.