Author Topic: Who's the bigger "liberal commie" ?  (Read 726 times)

Offline streakeagle

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Who's the bigger "liberal commie" ?
« on: January 30, 2002, 03:52:20 PM »
1. Someone like Jane Fonda, who broadcasts from the capital of a direct enemy of the United States in the middle of a war and stops by to insult the American POWs being tortured.

2. Someone like Bill Clinton, who is flown to Moscow at the height of the Cold War to receive a peace prize for his anti-war activities.

3. Artists like Neil Young, who is just echoing the feelings of a war torn country.

I rank Neil Young pretty low compared to a celebrity like Jane Fonda who possibly should have been tried as a traitor. Though I find Bill Clintons actions nearly as reprehensible... especially considering the fact that he eventually served as the President!!!
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Offline Thrawn

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Re: Who's the bigger "liberal commie" ?
« Reply #1 on: January 30, 2002, 05:10:48 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by streakeagle
2. Someone like Bill Clinton, who is flown to Moscow at the height of the Cold War to receive a peace prize for his anti-war activities.


The height of the Cold War??  What made it the HEIGHT of the Cold War?  The fact that the USSR had fallen appart by this point and time?  The fact that Russia had given up communism for capitalism?  Totalitarianism for democracy??

Offline miko2d

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Re: Re: Who's the bigger "liberal commie" ?
« Reply #2 on: January 30, 2002, 05:23:41 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Thrawn
The height of the Cold War??  What made it the HEIGHT of the Cold War?  The fact that the USSR had fallen appart by this point and time?  The fact that Russia had given up communism for capitalism?  Totalitarianism for democracy??


 Stop confusing us with facts.

 :) miko

Offline Toad

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Who's the bigger "liberal commie" ?
« Reply #3 on: January 30, 2002, 05:34:27 PM »
I think he is referring to Bill's trip to Moscow on December 31, 1969-January 6, 1970.

This wasn't exactly a time of good relations between the US and the USSR.

Never have seen anything about him getting any award though....
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Offline Soulyss

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Who's the bigger "liberal commie" ?
« Reply #4 on: January 30, 2002, 05:50:42 PM »
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Jane Fonda who possibly should have been tried as a traitor.


Jane Fonda could not have been constitutionally tried as a traitor since treason cannot be commited without a declared state of War which only Congress can make.  ;)
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Offline Thrawn

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Who's the bigger "liberal commie" ?
« Reply #5 on: January 30, 2002, 06:36:01 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Toad
I think he is referring to Bill's trip to Moscow on December 31, 1969-January 6, 1970.

This wasn't exactly a time of good relations between the US and the USSR.

Never have seen anything about him getting any award though....


:eek:

Sorry steakegle, I've never heard anything about this.

Offline Sandman

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Who's the bigger "liberal commie" ?
« Reply #6 on: January 30, 2002, 08:00:15 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Soulyss


Jane Fonda could not have been constitutionally tried as a traitor since treason cannot be commited without a declared state of War which only Congress can make.  ;)


Funny... I mean the law... Isn't it?

BUT... you can be tried for conspiracy to kill nationals of the United States if they can't make a case for treason.
sand

Offline streakeagle

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Who's the bigger "liberal commie" ?
« Reply #7 on: January 30, 2002, 08:58:59 PM »
I can't remember the source for the "award" part of the story... It might even be Rush Limbaugh from many years ago...

But read this if you want to know what kind of person Bill Clinton was...

http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a40091.htm

A pretty big snip from that link:

Quote
He traveled to Norway and Finland, then disappeared behind the Iron Curtain for a while, emerging in late January or early February 1970. Like his draft and ROTC files in Arkansas, records of this trip seem to have "disappeared." However, enough pieces of the puzzle still exist to establish the overall picture, which isn't pretty.


At a time when no one could go behind the Iron Curtain---let alone to Moscow---without KGB approval, Bill simply got on a train and went. Apparently without so much as a "by your leave" to American authorities, but with an "open arms" invitation and warm welcome from the Soviets, Bill made a pilgrimage to the "worker's paradise" with a significant stop in Scandanavia, where he participated in important, anti-American "peace" conferences.


On December 4, one day after Clinton wrote the letter to Colonel Holmes, American activist leaders met in Hanoi with the enemy's top leaders to plan an international conference/demonstration for January 1970 in Stockholm, Sweden.


Later that month Clinton left London for a "tour" of Scandanavia, his trip apparently coinciding with the conference in Stockholm and activist meetings in Oslo, Norway. During his presidential campaign, Clinton denied the Oslo meetings and said he had only seen Father McSorley there for a few minutes, having run into him "by accident in the train station."


McSorley, however, says that at Clinton's request, Bill and he spent an entire day togethere meeting with activists n Oslo. After visiting the Institute for Peace Studies and activists groups there, Clinton left Oslo.


Traveling to Helsinki, Finland, in late December, he spent Christmas there with a friend. In Helsinki he boarded a train for Moscow by way of Leningrad. Clinton's version of his trip to Scandinavia, Russia and Czechoslovakia is that he was just a member of a group of students taking an educational trip. The facts say otherwise. Except for his KGB escort, Clinton traveled alone. Dee Dee Myers, spokeswoman for the Clinton campaign and later Clinton's White House Press Secretary, was quoted in The Washington Times as stating that Clinton "rode alone from Helsinki, Finland, to Moscow."


Clinton arrived in Moscow on New Year's Eve and was in town seven days. What he did in Moscow is difficult to establish. After a week in Moscow, Clinton journeyed to Prague, Czechoslovakia, a center for important meetings between communist leaders (including Viet Cong/NVA) and American sympathizers. It was in Prague after meeting with Viet Cong leaders that Tom Hayden (Jane Fonda's husband of that era) raised his arms, fists clenched, and shouted, "I am Viet Cong---we are all Viet Cong!"


Little is known about what Clinton did during his stay in Prague except that he stayed at the home of one Bedrich Kopold, identified by the Czech Federal Security and Intelligence Service as a communist official and an agent of the Czech equivalent of the KGB. Comrade Kopold was also the father of Jan Kopold, one of Clinton's friends at Oxford.


After forty days, Clinton emerged from behind the Iron Curtain and returned to London.


In happily joining with his Soviet and communist Vietnamese friends in a massive anti-American propaganda effort, one which strengthened the enemy's resolve while weakening American resolve, Bill Clinton was clearly giving aid and comfort to the enemy in time of war. This is still the definition of treason.


I feel quite comfortable calling the 1968-1970 period the "height of the Cold War", though I would also consider the Cuban Missile crisis and the Reagan era to rank about equal.

Bill Clinton had no business being President of the United States. He was (is?) as far left as Oral Roberts, Pat Buchanan and the other fundamentalists are far right.

I never much cared about voting. I am fairly sure that my vote doesn't count. But from the time Bill Clinton got elected, I haven't missed a single election, local or national. Of course in this last election, one vote meant a whole lot here in FL :D Only I didn't vote Republican or Democratic. I don't think either party has the best interests of the people in mind. In fact, I suspect both parties only work to maintain their power rather than actually accomplish anything. But I will do everything in my power to prevent someone like Bill Clinton getting elected again. Of course what can you really do? By the 2nd election, everyone knew or should have known about all of his problems and history. But people vote based on their economic status rather than integrity. "Hmmm... economy is good and the press likes him, must be a good President that made it that way, guess I'll vote for him again."
« Last Edit: January 30, 2002, 09:01:56 PM by streakeagle »
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Offline easymo

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Who's the bigger "liberal commie" ?
« Reply #8 on: January 30, 2002, 11:27:04 PM »
They knew what he was the first time. And you will never see a Vietnam vet in the white house.  To many baby killer movies.

Offline Boroda

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Evil, evil Russians with their horrible KGB!
« Reply #9 on: January 31, 2002, 10:50:04 AM »
At a time when no one could go behind the Iron Curtain---let alone to Moscow---without KGB approval, Bill simply got on a train and went. Apparently without so much as a "by your leave" to American authorities, but with an "open arms" invitation and warm welcome from the Soviets, Bill made a pilgrimage to the "worker's paradise" with a significant stop in Scandanavia, where he participated in important, anti-American "peace" conferences.

Another interesting view on life in USSR. Maybe every Western tourist must have go to a local KGB office for an approval before buying a tour to Moscow?

Offline Toad

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Who's the bigger "liberal commie" ?
« Reply #10 on: January 31, 2002, 11:18:31 AM »
It is also my recollection that it was quite difficult for an American to get an Entry Visa to the Soviet Union at that time.

Boroda, do you have access to any statistics on Visas granted to US citizens in the 1966-1972 tune frame or thereabouts?
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Offline midnight Target

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Who's the bigger "liberal commie" ?
« Reply #11 on: January 31, 2002, 11:28:48 AM »
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Little is known about what Clinton did during his stay in Prague except that he stayed at the home of one Bedrich Kopold, identified by the Czech Federal Security and Intelligence Service as a communist official and an agent of the Czech equivalent of the KGB. Comrade Kopold was also the father of Jan Kopold, one of Clinton's friends at Oxford.


After forty days, Clinton emerged from behind the Iron Curtain and returned to London.


Translation............Clinto n met a guy in college who offered to let him stay at his house while traveling in Europe. Sheeesh!

Then he [low scary voice] Emerged from the Iron curtain[/low scary voice] hehe.

Traveling in Eastern Europe was not as restricted from some European countries as it was from here. It was even open in Canada during that time, as Canada and the USSR were trading partners in wheat and other farm products.

Offline Boroda

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Who's the bigger "liberal commie" ?
« Reply #12 on: January 31, 2002, 12:01:49 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Toad
It is also my recollection that it was quite difficult for an American to get an Entry Visa to the Soviet Union at that time.

Boroda, do you have access to any statistics on Visas granted to US citizens in the 1966-1972 tune frame or thereabouts?


Cant's speak about that time, but in my childhood years (late 70s - early 80s) there were many Western (i mean from capitalist countries) tourists in Leningrad and Moscow. When i was an exchange student in US in 1989 my host's father said he went on a bus tour to Moscow in mid-60s, when he served in West Germany, it was pretty easy and such tours were popular among US military personell.

Iron Curtain really existed for Soviet citizens, but Western tourists were always wecome because of ideological reasons (people who saw life here should never trust standard Western stereotypes), and because of valuable foreign currency they brought.

Offline Toad

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Who's the bigger "liberal commie" ?
« Reply #13 on: January 31, 2002, 12:12:14 PM »
"but Western tourists were always wecome because of ideological reasons"

I'm not sure this was true in the '60's and very early '70's.

I've been looking for data on Visas from that period for a long time.. never have found anything.
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Offline Boroda

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Who's the bigger "liberal commie" ?
« Reply #14 on: January 31, 2002, 12:54:21 PM »
Interesting question.

But a US Army soldier going on a bus-tour to USSR on a vacation around 1963-65 is an nice example ;)