Author Topic: SpitIX vs YAK  (Read 931 times)

Offline HocBao

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SpitIX vs YAK
« on: February 12, 2002, 05:56:17 PM »
I have been flying the SpitIX for several months now. I am new to online flight sims and I am barely a mediocre pilot on my best days. I am improving, slowly, and I'm even starting to understand a smidgen of Shaw's book.

The YAK (and the LA7 for that matter) gives me fits! I can't out run it, I can't out turn it, I can't out climb it. It seems to be superior to the Spit in every way!

I became so frustrated one day, I jumped into a Yak and took it for a spin. I had a kill in less than two minutes. The YAK felt incredible - what a ride!

Am I so green that I can't grasp, let alone use, the Spit's advantages? Or, is the YAK truely a better plane to be avoided at all costs except when E is clearly in my favor? And finally, if it is a superior plane, why is its ENY value so much higher than the Spit's?

Any help is greatly appreciated.

Hoc

Offline Tac

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SpitIX vs YAK
« Reply #1 on: February 12, 2002, 06:53:15 PM »
"Am I so green that I can't grasp, let alone use, the Spit's advantages"

No, I think that means you have great potential.

Spit will not teach you ACM.

Yak is a hard plane to get kills in because of its low ammo load, you getting kills in it means you got the stuff!

flying the planes that give you trouble is a great way to find their weaknesses.

I'd say you're on your way to greatness :)

Offline aknimitz

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SpitIX vs YAK
« Reply #2 on: February 12, 2002, 06:55:15 PM »
The SpitIX will outturn both the Yak and the La7 at most speeds.  Dont be afraid to yank on that stick and blackout a bit to get those tight turns, just be careful and dotn totally blackout like Drex always does.

Nim

Offline Dead Man Flying

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SpitIX vs YAK
« Reply #3 on: February 12, 2002, 07:01:37 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Tac
Spit will not teach you ACM.


That's the dumbest thing I've heard all day.

-- Todd/Leviathn

Offline Kweassa

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SpitIX vs YAK
« Reply #4 on: February 12, 2002, 07:06:28 PM »
If there really is a uber plane in AH, the Yak-9U is it. Almost as fast
 as La-7, but slightly more maneuverable, it is among the fastest
 planes at low altitudes, and does pretty well even up to about 15k.
 The acceleration, like other soviet planes, is incredible, handling
 is pretty easy. Not very good handling at extremely high speeds
 though, and the roll rates are about average. Also climbs better
 than 109s up to 5000 ft altitude. The Yak-9U in every way, is a
 devoted 109 killer. (except weakness at over 15k)

 But, it does not turn better than a Spit9. It is obviously an illusion
 that this plane can turn as well as a Spitfire. It has a decent turn
 rate at mid to high speeds, but low speed turn characteristics are
 pretty bad(I once remember being out turned by a 109G-10 at near
 150 mph).

 Why it feels that way is because, as I said, the plane has smooth
 handling and has very good temporary turn rate at mid-high speeds.
 And if the pilot is good, he can play the 'Cat and Mouse' game with
 the Spit. Chasing the Spit into a corner, letting him escape and blow
 E, follow the Spit, drive him up to a corner again, wait till the Spit
 makes a desperate move and blows E, let him go.. and on and on
 until the Spit blows all the Energy he has so he can be out turned
 even by P-47s. Then the Yak bites.

 Don't play the game.

 Against a Yak, the only advantage a Spit pilot has is guns and better
 turn rate. You have to try everything so the fight ends up low and slow.
 Trick the Yak into making hard moves to catch you. Tempt him to gain
 gun solution on you, then keep escaping just out of the reach with your
 superior turn rate. Drain the E on the Yak. That's your best shot.

Offline Urchin

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SpitIX vs YAK
« Reply #5 on: February 12, 2002, 09:23:20 PM »
It isnt really THAT dumb Lev...  The Spitfire cannot give you a 'complete' picture of how to fight.  At least not in my opinion.  There is almost an overwhelming temptation to turn and turn and turn when you are in a Spitfire, because that is what the plane does so much better than most of the other planes in Aces High.  

Also, just flying a P-51, La-7, Dora, or 109-G10 can't really give you a 'complete' understanding of how to be successful, because the urge in those planes is to just run away if you get in trouble.  You really never learn many defensive moves (creating an overshoot, timing your turn back into a bandit after he overshoots, etc.) if all you do is run away after you get into a bad spot.  

I honestly think the 'best' planes for a new pilot fly to improve their piloting skills quickly is one of the more mediocre planes.  P-38, P-47, 190A5 (very good planes, all 3), 190A8 (very challenging plane IMO), and perhaps the best plane overall that I'd recommend is the Yak-9U (because it isn't the 'best' at any one thing, but it is damn good in just about everything.  C202 and C205 are also very good 'newbie' planes in my opinion.  

Even you, who I (and probably many others) consider to be the best Spitfire pilot in Aces High, flew several other plane types BEFORE you settled into the Spitfire.  I think that flying those planes and learning the lessons they had to teach made you a far better pilot overall.  I think that is maybe what Tac had in mind when he said that the Spitfire won't teach you ACM.

Offline aknimitz

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SpitIX vs YAK
« Reply #6 on: February 12, 2002, 09:48:57 PM »
I think the Yak9U is pound for pound the 2nd best plane in the arena, second only to the Tempest.  The only limitation to the Yak9U is the ammo load.  If the yak had 400 rounds of 20mm like the La5, I bet you anything it would be dubbed the "dweeb" ride.

I love the yak, most underrated plane in the MA (next to the 205).

Nim

Offline bikekil

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SpitIX vs YAK
« Reply #7 on: February 13, 2002, 09:02:57 AM »
mmm.. YAK.... mmm...
just love to fly it :cool:

Offline Xjazz

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SpitIX vs YAK
« Reply #8 on: February 14, 2002, 03:13:37 PM »
At very first I fly Spits as a.... Yeah, Spits. Then I think something more and 109s step in picture and learn some more. Again back to the Spit. Ok, now we talk!

Hey wait! La7s  & Yaks! Dam those Tatjanas in next door! Still I have hard time with them.  

Any way I learn from LW stuff some energy things which I could bring to the Spit flying.  Nope, Im not ace at all but I still enjoy learn different things litle by litle...

br

Offline Widewing

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SpitIX vs YAK
« Reply #9 on: February 14, 2002, 04:31:14 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Kweassa
But, it does not turn better than a Spit9. It is obviously an illusion
 that this plane can turn as well as a Spitfire. It has a decent turn
 rate at mid to high speeds, but low speed turn characteristics are
 pretty bad(I once remember being out turned by a 109G-10 at near 150 mph).


Since I fly the various Spitfires on a regular basis, and use the Yak as well, my experience agrees with your comments. It's accelerated stall handling is poor. Be real careful at low levels when you reef it in. Despite its excellent acceleration, should you bleed off too much of your E, any Spitfire model will eat it alive.

However, keep it at corner speed and it's a monster. You really need to work on your gunnery if you fly the 9U. My suggestion is that you hold fire until you're withing 300 yards.

My regards,

Widewing
My regards,

Widewing

YGBSM. Retired Member of Aces High Trainer Corps, Past President of the DFC, retired from flying as Tredlite.

Offline Tac

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SpitIX vs YAK
« Reply #10 on: February 14, 2002, 04:56:35 PM »
Thats odd widewing. The Yak9U is the only plane ive found that is most capable of stallfighting with a 38.

Offline Kweassa

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« Reply #11 on: February 14, 2002, 05:38:54 PM »
That's probably because the acceleration factor covers up for
 the turn factor. Chasing a 38, a Yak would give it a very  wide
 angle lag pursuit in case a 38 turns tightly, the distance parts
 over 700~800 yards during this move, but those dang Yaks
 catch up almost immediately if the 38 stops turning.

 On the other hand a Yak is being chased by a 38, the Yak tries
 a tight turn, can't shake a 38.. it decides to evade the shots
 for just enough time, roll other way(since 38s don't seem to roll
 too good at low speeds).. shallow dive and the separation is like
 already 1000 yards by the time the 38 lines up again.

 It's probably like the instance of 109G-2 and Typhoon stall
 fighting I wrote on 'Typhoon' thread here.

Offline HocBao

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SpitIX vs YAK
« Reply #12 on: February 14, 2002, 05:39:06 PM »
Thanks all for these great responses. Keep em coming. I am learning alot.

Hoc

Offline Tac

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SpitIX vs YAK
« Reply #13 on: February 14, 2002, 07:33:52 PM »
That aint stall fighting kweassa.

What I mean is a very tight sciscors or constant turning.. the yak9U can keep up and in many times (especially if its loop fighting) it can gain angles only at VERY low speeds. And this is on the deck, where neither can nose down or dive to gain speed.

Offline Kweassa

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SpitIX vs YAK
« Reply #14 on: February 14, 2002, 11:34:03 PM »
Ouch! Hands up, I surrender.

 Must have been one helluva pilot you were fighting
 in that case Tac, because my experience with  Yak
 at low speeds were treacherous at best.

 It feels almost as bad as 190s at low speed to me.
 I feel more comfortable in a 109G-10 stall  fighting
 a Spit5 rather than a Yak doing low speeds.