Author Topic: Kill Shooter or PNG... Which One? (Read 863 times)

popeye · « **Reply #15 on:** February 25, 2002, 03:25:09 PM »

Could it be that you are 10X closer to the friendly than the enemy, when you hit him?

Midnight · « **Reply #16 on:** February 25, 2002, 03:29:56 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Tac
-Killshooter only "killshoots" if hit with more than 40 bullets (any caliber) in 1 second. Anything lower does no damage to the offending plane. If more than 40, the offender should get an instant BAD pilot wound. Make the sucker suffer on his way to the dirt.

Tac, this type wouldn't be as effective as what I proposed of the 'critical damage'.

Some larger guns (30mm) can kill with just three or four rounds. The cannon dweebs could fire all they wanted and not have to worry about hitting a friendly with 40 rounds.

hitech · « **Reply #17 on:** February 25, 2002, 03:34:05 PM »

The problem comes in how to apply the damage when you are shooting at different plane type , i.e. you could be shooting eng 4 on a plane with 1 eng.

To over come this all damage from kill shooter is applied to the center fuse.

It never ceases to amaze me how people love to blame the kill shooter on the other guy diving in.
If the plane is above you and he is diving in, he can't even see you.

It's realy simple.
It is the shooter responsiblity to make sure he is clear to fire. No if's, no ands, no buts.

For those complaning about some one flying infront of them.

Read this again.

It is the shooter responsibliyt to make sure he is clear to fire.

One more time.

It is the shooter responsiblity to make sure he is clear to fire.

And in case you are not clear on my views on the subject.

It is the shooter responsiblity to make sure he is clear to fire.

Think of it as an instant court marshal and a sentance of a firing squad.

HiTech

Tac · « **Reply #18 on:** February 25, 2002, 03:44:11 PM »

"Tac, this type wouldn't be as effective as what I proposed of the 'critical damage'.

Some larger guns (30mm) can kill with just three or four rounds. The cannon dweebs could fire all they wanted and not have to worry about hitting a friendly with 40 rounds."

Hmm, true. Perhaps make it a 40 rnd rule for mg's, 10 rnd for cannon?

"It is the shooter responsibliyt to make sure he is clear to fire. "

Unfortunataly responsibity ends when the tracers are flying. People fly into the bullet stream.

"It never ceases to amaze me how people love to blame the kill shooter on the other guy diving in.
If the plane is above you and he is diving in, he can't even see you"

Thats a bit off i'd say. Sure, they may dive into a con and not see you behind him, but they sure as heck can see the tracers you're firing his way. Point is, some people just dont give a damn and fly in there regardless. Accidents happen as well, toejam happens. But penalizing the person that didnt cause the accident by having 1 or 2 killshooter pings whacking him off the sky doesnt sound right. All I'd like to see is a few more leniency towards hits received before causing damage, give the victims a chance to stop firing before killshooting themselves (target fixation, press trigger, BIG green icon plane jumps in front split second surprise, trigger still pressed, *plinkplink* *BOOM* you go).

BTW, I see HTC staff posting a lot. Do I smell something coming up?

pimpjoe · « **Reply #19 on:** February 25, 2002, 03:58:08 PM »

i say we keep killshooter and not do the PNG thing. i have been tempted more than once to kill the feker that cut me off and stole one of my kills. with the PNG thing i could get my revenge. as good as it would make me feel to do that....its wrong.

Midnight · « **Reply #20 on:** February 25, 2002, 04:20:45 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by pimpjoe
i say we keep killshooter and not do the PNG thing. i have been tempted more than once to kill the feker that cut me off and stole one of my kills. with the PNG thing i could get my revenge. as good as it would make me feel to do that....its wrong.

Pimpjoe... with the way I am proposing, NEITHER friendly plane would actually take damage, the system would just determine you hit the other friendly enough to kill him, and then give you the message.

hitech · « **Reply #21 on:** February 25, 2002, 04:28:47 PM »

Unfortunataly responsibity ends when the tracers are flying. People fly into the bullet stream.

So you wan't the kill so bad,want points so bad, that you are willing to risk killingl a friendly.

Read again.

It is the shooters responsiblity to make sure he is clear to fire.

If some one is diving in you are NOT clear to fire.

Thats a bit off i'd say. Sure, they may dive into a con and not see you behind him, but they sure as heck can see the tracers you're firing his way.
Again .
It is the shooters responsiblity to make sure he is clear to fire.

Point is, some people just dont give a damn and fly in there regardless.
Again.
It is the shooters responsiblity to make sure he is clear to fire.

Accidents happen as well, toejam happens. But penalizing the person that didnt cause the accident by having 1 or 2 killshooter pings whacking him off the sky doesnt sound right.

This would be like blaming a guy for hiting your car after you just ran a red light, because "well he saw me".

Again.
You want the kill so bad,want points so bad, that you are willing to risk killing a friendly.

It is the shooters responsiblity to make sure he is clear to fire.

All I'd like to see is a few more leniency towards hits received before causing damage, give the victims a chance to stop firing before killshooting themselves (target fixation, press trigger, BIG green icon plane jumps in front split second surprise, trigger still pressed, *plinkplink* *BOOM* you go).

Again.
You want the kill so bad,want points so bad, that you are willing to risk killing a friendly.

It is the shooter responsiblity to make sure he is clear to fire.

Tac everything you are aguing is you wanting the kill no different then the guy diving in wants the kill.

Only thing is the other guy is in a better position for the kill than you are. What you are acusing other people of, you are more guilty of yourself.

The rule is simple.

It is the shooter responsiblity to make sure he is clear to fire.

HiTech

Midnight · « **Reply #22 on:** February 25, 2002, 04:38:19 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by hitech
It never ceases to amaze me how people love to blame the kill shooter on the other guy diving in.
If the plane is above you and he is diving in, he can't even see you.

It's realy simple.
It is the shooter responsiblity to make sure he is clear to fire. No if's, no ands, no buts.

HiTech

HT, I hate to be argumentative, but that sounds like BS to me.

Here is a perfect example of how others do the "Fly in front thing" to steel / get the kill.

I was in P-51 chasing a P47. we were on the deck and were going about 200 MPH. We were in a straight line flight, he was running for AA cover at the nearby depot.

Anyway, I check six and see a freindly N1K (Dweeb) coming in. I finally get within firing range of the P-47 (about 500 yards) and just as I open fire, the DWEEB KILL STEELER!!! flys RIGHT THROUGH my P-51 and causes me to be blown apart.

I think is is ridiculus to tell me that it is my fault the N1K dweeb flew through my plane while I had the trigger pulled. He saw me there and chose to fly through and get the kill without a care in the world.

hitech · « **Reply #23 on:** February 25, 2002, 05:15:19 PM »

Anyway, I check six and see a freindly N1K (Dweeb) coming in. I finally get within firing range of the P-47 (about 500 yards) and just as I open fire, the DWEEB KILL STEELER!!! flys RIGHT THROUGH my P-51 and causes me to be blown apart.

Tell me again how you were not trying to steel HIS kill of the DWEEB laser 50cal p47? And how the DWEEB RunStang should have had the kill instead of the DWEEB N1k?

And tell me again how that n1k didn't hold his fire until he was clear of you?

There is Only 1 form of kill steeling that I know of and that is shooting a plane after he is all ready spiraling to the ground.

whels · « **Reply #24 on:** February 25, 2002, 05:28:20 PM »

not when the other plane purposely flies through your plane from behind u and kill shoots u to get to the enemy, ive had that happen several times.

Whels

Quote

Originally posted by hitech
The problem comes in how to apply the damage when you are shooting at different plane type , i.e. you could be shooting eng 4 on a plane with 1 eng.

To over come this all damage from kill shooter is applied to the center fuse.

It never ceases to amaze me how people love to blame the kill shooter on the other guy diving in.
If the plane is above you and he is diving in, he can't even see you.

It's realy simple.
It is the shooter responsiblity to make sure he is clear to fire. No if's, no ands, no buts.

For those complaning about some one flying infront of them.

Read this again.

It is the shooter responsibliyt to make sure he is clear to fire.

One more time.

It is the shooter responsiblity to make sure he is clear to fire.

And in case you are not clear on my views on the subject.

It is the shooter responsiblity to make sure he is clear to fire.

Think of it as an instant court marshal and a sentance of a firing squad.

HiTech

Replicant · « **Reply #25 on:** February 25, 2002, 05:30:06 PM »

I don't mind the normal cannon/MG killshooter but what does annoy me is killshooter from bomb-blast. Numerous times I've dropped bombs on hangars and some guy then decides it will be fun to fly through the hangar just as my bombs connect! Booom!

At the time of release of bombs it was perfectly clear but by the time the bomb had reached it's target it doesn't take much for a friendly to stray into the path of the bomb blast... before you say "It is the shooters responsiblity to make sure he is clear to fire"!

Anyway, that's my 2 pence worth....

Regards

Nexx

whels · « **Reply #26 on:** February 25, 2002, 05:36:17 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by hitech
Anyway, I check six and see a freindly N1K (Dweeb) coming in. I finally get within firing range of the P-47 (about 500 yards) and just as I open fire, the DWEEB KILL STEELER!!! flys RIGHT THROUGH my P-51 and causes me to be blown apart.

Tell me again how you were not trying to steel HIS kill of the DWEEB laser 50cal p47? And how the DWEEB RunStang should have had the kill instead of the DWEEB N1k?

And tell me again how that n1k didn't hold his fire until he was clear of you?

There is Only 1 form of kill steeling that I know of and that is shooting a plane after he is all ready spiraling to the ground.

problem is KS only punishes 1 side, when both sides are at fualt.
the shooter is at fualt cause he fired when friendlies were too close to bullet paths. the other is at fualt for flying his plane
into a friendly fire stream. both are at fault. its a shame
only 1 gets the axe.

whels

Mathman · « **Reply #27 on:** February 25, 2002, 05:42:22 PM »

Lets see, we have had killshooter since the game came out in open beta a little more than 2 years ago. Why do I see more posts in the last 6 months than I did the first 2 years?

I guess things must be going good if people finally decide to squeak about something that works great the way it does. HT is right, learn some fargin discipline with you finger on the trigger.

The funny thing is, there is no real penalty for getting killshootered. Yes, you die and you have to replane. Oh well. If you decide to PNG people for this, now you have a penalty. Imagine you killshooter someone and then are forced to leave the arena or fly planes without ammo or whatever other hairbrained ideas you come up with. Do you think you are getting your $$$ worth out of the game if because of a mistake you made you can no longer really fly and fight in the arena for a specified period of time?

This idea is about as good as filling zepplins with hydrogen and putting smoking sections in the cabin.

Guys, killshooter is perfectly fine the way it is. If you don't like someone dropping in to kill your intended victim, then head to someother area. Despite how fun and addicting it is, it is only a GAME.

-math (who is trying to figure out how the hell some people die to killshooter so mucht hat they gotta squeak about it and try and justify by 2 or 3 examples out of thousands how it is bad and unfair)

Tac · « **Reply #28 on:** February 25, 2002, 05:43:51 PM »

"Tac everything you are aguing is you wanting the kill no different then the guy diving in wants the kill.

Only thing is the other guy is in a better position for the kill than you are. What you are acusing other people of, you are more guilty of yourself"

Indeed, you are right.

From now on I will strive to find people that are behind a con, d300 or less away from him and shooting away.. and I will dive in front of them on purpose, with no care in the world if they get killshot, just because ill be "in a better position for the kill" than he is. No matter if it means flying into friendly, undamaging (to me) lead. I will also strive to fly through other people's planes in the same situation if I have no alt to dive with, having no care in the world that the person im flying through is firing like crazy at a jinking con.. im just getting into a better position than he is... about 2 yds closer than him for example. Its not MY fault if the guy is shooting while I fly through him either. I love the La7.

*throws salt over shoulder*

Making the first 5 to 10 pings from killshooter do no damage would help a lot in preventing accidental killshooter from happening. After all, killshooter is in place to stop friendlies from shooting down other friendlies on purpose . If somoene is dumb enough to keep spraying at a con d600 away when there's 2 other friendlies in 100yds closer than he is.. well, he does deserve to get killshot.

But heck, I can only suggest, its your game. Cheers!

Mathman · « **Reply #29 on:** February 25, 2002, 05:47:00 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by whels

problem is KS only punishes 1 side, when both sides are at fualt.
the shooter is at fualt cause he fired when friendlies were too close to bullet paths. the other is at fualt for flying his plane
into a friendly fire stream. both are at fault. its a shame
only 1 gets the axe.

whels

Whels, the answer is in HT's post. He says that it is the SHOOTER'S responsibility to know when to shoot and when not to. Since he is the creator of the game, I would think his word is the law (whether you like it or not).

-math