Author Topic: My Biggest Problem  (Read 360 times)

Offline JoeCrip

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My Biggest Problem
« on: March 05, 2002, 05:02:14 AM »
There has been a lotta things going on in the MA lately...but this one stands out the most. I'm sure everyone has been in this situation one time or another:

- I will be deacking a base. When i de-ack a base I kill AI ack first, then mannable.

This is what annoy's me

When i am de-acking a base, someone Always hop's in the mannable ack. He just sits there, and wait's for the AI ack to kill me, so he can pick up a free kill.

Are people that desprite to get a single kill these days?
I'm not really sure how this can be fixed...but lowering the ack letality, so that 3 pings will kill you instead of 1 ping, IMO is a good idea

-Edited for spelling-

Offline Swoop

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« Reply #1 on: March 05, 2002, 05:57:49 AM »
The problem stems from having lots of 37mm aaa at a field and the AH damage model shedding wings/tails on 1 ping.

Either less 37mm and more .50cal aaa or a change to the damage model would solve your problem mate.  


And feel exactly the same way.



Offline Gremlin

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My Biggest Problem
« Reply #2 on: March 05, 2002, 06:13:59 AM »
JoeCrip,

How do you know its the AI ack and not the mannable ack which has killed you?

Gremlin.

Offline mrsid2

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« Reply #3 on: March 05, 2002, 06:51:38 AM »
Yeah especially since the manned ack has invisible tracers, there's just no way to tell which ack hits you - unless it's plain obvious like flying directly over ack which manages to ping you before its death due to lag.

Offline JoeCrip

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« Reply #4 on: March 05, 2002, 07:34:00 AM »
It doesnt matter which ack hit me, If you de-ack a base, and ack kills you (weather it be manned or AI), ifsomeone is in the manned ack, they will get the kill

Offline Fariz

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« Reply #5 on: March 05, 2002, 07:37:46 AM »
For me manned acks annoying due to one reason -- guy who fire them see tracers, you do not see them. Not sure if it is bug or feature. At least when manned acks were added tracers were seen.

Fariz

Offline JoeCrip

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« Reply #6 on: March 05, 2002, 07:50:09 AM »
Yea, forgot to mention that. There are no tracers for manned ack.
Is this a bug or a feature?

Offline Duedel

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« Reply #7 on: March 05, 2002, 07:50:56 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by JoeCrip
It doesnt matter which ack hit me, If you de-ack a base, and ack kills you (weather it be manned or AI), ifsomeone is in the manned ack, they will get the kill


Hi Joe,

but it's the same if you are in a plane and ack kills the enemy. If you are next to him you'll also get the kill, so i don't really find this annoying.
The "Tracer-Problem" is a problem for sure.

Offline Gremlin

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« Reply #8 on: March 05, 2002, 08:23:12 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by JoeCrip
It doesnt matter which ack hit me, If you de-ack a base, and ack kills you (weather it be manned or AI), ifsomeone is in the manned ack, they will get the kill


JoeCrip,

You see it does matter.  Your original post complained about guys picking up 'freebie' kills.  This is true if he just sits there until the AI ack kills you.  But if he kills you with mannable ack than thats fair enough?  The point fariz makes about tracers is spot on but its another argument.

My 2cents worth is that AI acks are far too accurate.  Basically if you get within 1click of a full field your dead.  Have you ever seen the old footage of planes straffing fields.  They often made multible passes without ack ever getting near them.

I just stay away from field ack now and leave it to the buff guys.

To add to your point JoeCrip, I am still to fathom the depths some people will go to to get one lousy kill.  All you have to do is just look at some of the gangbangs.  Last night I was in a P51D and counted 17 nits chasin me. I got two kills when some of them appeared to killshooter them selves to get to me. Out of that 17 12 were spits 3 were nikis.  I wish these guys would just go back to quake arena and leave AH to the rest of us.

The things that annoy me most at the moment are.
gangbangin,  la7's, co e bandits runnin for ack cause they dont have the skill to fight 1v1 co-e, b-26 laser guns, and bad attitudes (i.e 'ch1: fk u gremlin') just because I shot him down fair and square.



Gremlin.

Offline Apache

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« Reply #9 on: March 05, 2002, 08:46:25 AM »
Why is tracers an issue? You know the gun is up if you look, why not shoot it?

Is it because you don't have the crutch of using the tracers to acquire your target? Is it because you can't tell if the gunner is shooting at someone else so you can have a free pass at him? What?

As a side note, I haven't used tracers in over a year. You wouldn't see me shooting at ya anyway, unless of course it is forced in the code to ignore user settings.

Offline Gremlin

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« Reply #10 on: March 05, 2002, 09:00:18 AM »
Not an issue for me, like I said I steer clear nowadays.

Grem.

Offline Seeker

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« Reply #11 on: March 05, 2002, 09:31:55 AM »
Excerpt from The Big Show by Pierre Clostermann.
We were at 14,000 feet and kept straight on over to the left, as if we had no intention of attacking. I took a close look at the field: the small crosses parked just where we expected them showed up on the bright green grass of early spring. I particularly noticed one, two, four, seven flak towers. Their shadows clearly projected on the perimeter track by the sun

'Look out Filmstar Leader, flak at 6 o'clock!'

Sure enough, 200 yards behind us five big black puffs from 88 mm. shells had appeared. OK, five more seconds and then I would attack. The objective was behind us and we were facing the sun. Fear caught me by the throat and stopped me breathing. Aerial combat always found me calm - after the early stages - but flak was quite different.

'Drop your tanks, Filmstar'.

My stomach contracted and a wave of nausea swept over me - the advantage of a single-seater is that you can pass out with fear without anybody noticing.

'Quick. 180 port, go.'

This would bring us back facing the airfield, with the sun at our backs.

'Diving--full out, Filmstar!'

My nine Tempests were beautifully echeloned on my left although we were diving almost vertically.

'Smell of flowers,' came Bay Adams voice mockingly in the earphones. Flak! Christ, what flak! The entire surface of the airfield seemed to light up with the flashes from 20mm and 37mm guns. There must have been at least 40 of them. A carpet of white puffs spread out below us and the black puffs of the 37's stood out in regular string of eight.

What flak! Physical fear is the most terrible thing a man can suffer - my heart leaped into my mouth, I was covered with sweat, with sticky, clammy sweat. My clenched toes swam in my boots.

We dived desperately into the smoke…explosions and tracer to left and right crossing over and under us….bangs around our wings and sinister dazzling flashes.

We were a mile from the perimeter, 150 feet from the ground. Men were running hither and thither.

'Lower for Christ's sake,' I yelled hysterically. The broad expanse of grass, carved by the gray runways, tilted up before my eyes and rushed towards me. We were doing over 450 mph. First a hangar … a bowser … then the Messerschmitts, perched clumsily on their narrow gear, about thirty of them, with men crouching under their wings. Too far to the left, unfortunately, outside my line of fire.

A group of a dozen Arados loomed up in my sight. I fired, I fired frantically, my thumb jammed on the button. My shells formed a ribbon of explosion worming its way between the Arados, climbing up the fuselage, hitting theengines … smoke …one of the planes exploded just as I was over it, and my Tempest was tossed up by the burning gust. A Tempest touched the ground and the fuselage bounded up in a shower of fragments of smashed wings and tailplanes. More hangars in front of me. I fired a second burst-it exploded on the galvanized iron doors and the steel stanchions.

'Look out , Red 2' My No. 2 was coming straight for me, out of control, at a terrific speed. His hood had gone. At 470 mph 20 yards to my right, he went smack into a flak tower, cutting it in two beneath the platform.

The wooden frame flew into the air. A cluster of men hanging on to a gun collapsed into space. The Tempest crashed on the edge of the field, furrowing through a group of little houses, with a terrific flash of light; the engine had come adrift in a whirlwind of flames and fragments scattered in the sky.

It was all over … almost. One, two, three … the tracer bullets were pursuing me. I lowered my head and hunched myself behind my rear plating … twelve, thirteen, fourteen … I was going to cheat …a salvo of 37 burst so close that I got only the flash of the explosions without seeing the smoke…splinters rained down on my fuselage…nineteen, twenty! I pulled the stick back and climbed straight up into the sky. The flak kept on.

I glanced back towards Schwerin, just visible under my tailplane. A thousand feet below a Tempest was climbing in zig-zags, the tracer stubbornly pursuing him. Fires near the hangars, columns of greasy smoke, a fireworks display of exploding magnesium bombs. The lone Tempest caught me up, waggled his wings and formed up line abreast.

'Hallo, Filmstar aircraft, reform south of target, angels 10.'

'Hallo, Pierre, Red 3 here, You know, I think the rest have had it.'

Surely Bay couldn't be right! I scanned the 360 degrees of the horizon, and the terrific pyramid of flak bursts above Schwerin right up to the clouds, hanging in the still air. No one.

1304 hours. We had attacked at 1303 hours. The nightmare had lasted perhaps 35 seconds from the beginning of our dive, and we had lost eight aircraft out of ten….

Text source:
Through John Dullighan

Offline MrLars

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My Biggest Problem
« Reply #12 on: March 05, 2002, 09:40:06 AM »
Why worry who gets the kill? Kills while manning shore batterys, field guns and ship guns mean absolutly nothing to ones score...other than total kills. I personaly like to man a field gun just so I can kill the ack killers...here's a clue...IT'S FUN! That's why people do it, not for score. As far as killing ack from the air...it still takes a skilled pilot to do it succesfully but it sure isn't impossible.

Offline Widewing

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Re: My Biggest Problem
« Reply #13 on: March 05, 2002, 10:05:01 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by JoeCrip
There has been a lotta things going on in the MA lately...but this one stands out the most. I'm sure everyone has been in this situation one time or another:

- I will be deacking a base. When i de-ack a base I kill AI ack first, then mannable.

This is what annoy's me

When i am de-acking a base, someone Always hop's in the mannable ack. He just sits there, and wait's for the AI ack to kill me, so he can pick up a free kill.

Are people that desprite to get a single kill these days?
I'm not really sure how this can be fixed...but lowering the ack letality, so that 3 pings will kill you instead of 1 ping, IMO is a good idea

-Edited for spelling-


I wish all the field guns were human manned, because most of the human gunners are poor marksmen when compared to the AI.

As it is, when an AI ack knocks down an attacker, the nearest friendly, be it a manned ack, or GV will get the credit. The same thing happens with ship acks as well. Two tours ago, I recieved 3 kill credits while manning a cruiser's 5 inch gun mount. I never fired at a single plane....... I don't like the proximity system at all. If you don't kill the target, you should not get the credit, period.

For that matter, I dislike the "assist" system too. I would prefer shared kills, as in .5 or .33 kills rather than an assist. How many times have you shot the wing off of a damaged con, only to just get an assist. I despise assists...... I would have preferred to save the ammo.

I agree that the AI is way too deadly. However, I believe that's a result of the AI "never miss" programming. A single 37mm hit will kill most fighters. So, I don't fault the killing power of the guns themselves, but the over-accuracy of those guns.

I could go on about the response time of the guns... You know, why are the guns always fully manned? Doesn't happen in the real world. Moreover, if you could sneak in under the radar, you could catch a field undefended. As it is now, they always know that you're coming and the acks are always manned. Unrealistic in a real world sense.

My regards,

Widewing
My regards,

Widewing

YGBSM. Retired Member of Aces High Trainer Corps, Past President of the DFC, retired from flying as Tredlite.

Offline whels

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Re: Re: My Biggest Problem
« Reply #14 on: March 05, 2002, 10:34:31 AM »
actually for a single plane to come in and deack a field is far far to easy as it is now. a lone fighter  should be ded.  deacking a field
should require multiple fighters going in together to help
distract the ack or a buff coming in and egging the ack.

with the intro of mannable AA, field AA defence has been cut  anywhere from half to 1/3 of what it was.

for u guys who whine about Mannable ack has no tracers,
ur mistake is treating them as unmanned., i treat all ack
the same...... deadly threat needed to be killed equally.
cant count the times ive seen the enemy leave mannable AA
up just cause it doesnt have tracers wizzin past them.

id rather see part kills givin instead of assist also.

Whels

Quote
Originally posted by Widewing


I wish all the field guns were human manned, because most of the human gunners are poor marksmen when compared to the AI.

As it is, when an AI ack knocks down an attacker, the nearest friendly, be it a manned ack, or GV will get the credit. The same thing happens with ship acks as well. Two tours ago, I recieved 3 kill credits while manning a cruiser's 5 inch gun mount. I never fired at a single plane....... I don't like the proximity system at all. If you don't kill the target, you should not get the credit, period.

For that matter, I dislike the "assist" system too. I would prefer shared kills, as in .5 or .33 kills rather than an assist. How many times have you shot the wing off of a damaged con, only to just get an assist. I despise assists...... I would have preferred to save the ammo.

I agree that the AI is way too deadly. However, I believe that's a result of the AI "never miss" programming. A single 37mm hit will kill most fighters. So, I don't fault the killing power of the guns themselves, but the over-accuracy of those guns.

I could go on about the response time of the guns... You know, why are the guns always fully manned? Doesn't happen in the real world. Moreover, if you could sneak in under the radar, you could catch a field undefended. As it is now, they always know that you're coming and the acks are always manned. Unrealistic in a real world sense.

My regards,

Widewing