Bombers

[easymo]

 With the 20mm dumbed down. Its time to back off the bombers guns a little.

[Spatula]

I agree.
Read vulcans post on the documentaries he is watchin that has interviews and gun cam evidence of B-17s being shot at by 109s etc.

The main points seem:
- buffs in AH guns are far too lethal,
- buff in AH guns seem to be laser guided (too acurate).
- buffs in AH should be made tuffer to compensate.

this would seem to bring them into line with the points vulcan has raised.

my 2 cents.

[Weave]

   I agree with everything Spatula says with one exception, when I am gunning the buff the guns are by no means lazer guided lol. However it does seem to take too few hits to bring down a B-17.

...Weav

[Missile]

Just a point about the films...If they are the ones that I have seen, please notive the tail guns on the buff. The tail gunner id wounded or dead (as is the ball turret gunner).  


Yeah, I would approach a buff from the six with no gunner. Maybe killable gunners are an answer.

My thoughts and an attempt to correct a misconception.

Missile

[iculus]

Each gun position can be knocked out already

IC

[Maxopti1]

I don't understand your topic.

I use the B17 frequently and don't seem me absolutely that the guns of the B17 are overmodelled.
Before understand like use the guns correctly and learn to shoot in deflection, I have been shoot down dozens of times.

You are enough look at my kill ratio for become considers that the B17 is an easy prey, for whom he has understood like carry him attack to this type of airplane.

Absurdity seems me that you claim that flights almost disarmed.

If you are not able to individualize a technique for strike the B17, simply, avoid them.

You don't ask that comes transformed in C47, those, in the arena, there is already.

Is easy and comfortable, attach a big slow target, hoping that it don't defend, take yours correct portion of risk and, please, use the training arena.

Max

 




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When you are flown, there is an only certainty:
In a way or in the other, to earth you will return.

[CavemanJ]

if you dumb down the .50s on the bombers you're dumbing down the .50s on every bird in the arena that carries them.  A few of us have gone round and round with Pyro about the .50s (you cannon guys prolly dinnae pay attention).  The ONLY difference between the fighter mounted .50s and bomber mounted .50s is a slight increase in maximum effective range.  NOT max range, max effective range, and this is to keep fighters from parking off a bomber's 6 and plinking them to death because they [fighter] are inside thier lethal range while still outside the buff's lethal range due to netlag.

I think the .50s are adequate (no problems killing any aircraft w/ 4x.50 in P38) I still think they're a tad on the soft side.

[Wardog]

Ive killed b17 with 1 pass in a p51 with 2 .50s....... I can allmost allway take out a b17 in 1 pass with a p51.

Odd thing though,saddled up in an 190a5,made the same approach as i would in a p51,didnt kill it. Took 2 more passes & i still lost 1/2 my left wing.Of coarse i dont fly a5 much so i need work on gunnery,convergence settings and trim out..

Dog out.......

[RangerBob]

I agree with CavemanJ. We have been around and around on this since bombers were first introduced in Beta.

I think it's just about right now. You can't just sit on the tail of a bomber now and get that easy kill, but bombers can be brought down in one or two passes if proper attack tactics are used. This is good for both bomber and pursuit pilot.

Try flying bombers with the 50 cal gun lethality turned down. You won't see any of them up at all, and 50 cal gunned planes won't be worth anything either.

Ranger Bob

[hblair]

Bombers are very killable if ya hit 'em with enough punch. Ya just gotta be careful when & how ya do it.

[Graywolf]

I think there is a lot of confusion with the lethality of the B17 guns because people are under the, mistaken, impression ther when they are in the 5-7 o'clock area of a B17 they are being shot at by a single pair of .50cals, this is not the case.

In the 6 o'clock position you are likely being tracked by either the ventral or dorsal turrets as well (total of 4 .50cals). if you're off to one side then it's like one of the waist guns gan get you too.

What this means is that you now have 4 or five guns all blazing away at you from different parts of the B17 aimed perfectly[\B] together at a point in space which is nornally somewhere between you and the B17. Add in the dispersion of those guns and you end up with a sizable cone of lead coming in your direction.

The problem is not that the B17 has 'laser' guns, it's more a problem of it having a full auto 'shotgun' =) This makes hitting people at 6-800 yards quite easy and if they aren't already maneuvering when you first light them uup then it'll take about 1/4 of a second for the pings to sound on their FE, them to react, and the reaction to appear on the FE on the B17 gunner. In that 1/4 second they are going to take quite a few rounds of .50cal and that is going to hurt =)

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Graywolfe <tim@flibble.org>

[jihad]

The problem isn`t the bombers,it`s your gunnery.

 Kills of Fighters
 52
 
 Kills of Bombers
 6
 
 Fighter Assists
 15
 
 
 Bomber Assists
 1  
 
 Ordnance 0 Used
 25006  
 
 Ordnance 0 Hit
 689

 --- ---

 Hit % 0.0276