190 roll rate

[MANDOBLE]

Yesterday I got frustrated, again, being unable to follow a right roll of a SpitV (I was doing about 250 mph in a D9 and the Spit was slower in front of me). So, I switch my whine mode on and set up some whinning questions:

1 - What was (if any) the difference in roll rate between 190As and 190D9?

2 - Whitch % of roll rate has been substracted from AH's 190s for gameplay issues related to the net?

3 - If % > 0, has been this % also substracted from the rest of the planes?

4 - Isn't Spit roll rate exagerated?

[Wilbus]

Not sure how much worse the Dora rolled, it rolled worse judging from Pilot reports about it, it was still amongst the best rolling planes though.

Not sure if A's have been set down, the A5 with 4 wing guns had a roll speed of about 160 degrees per second, sure doesn't feel like that though.

IL2 190 Roll rate seems pretty nice

[Naudet]

There is an EAW webpage, were a couple of guys did an ultra-realistic EAW mod.

They took all charts etc. drag data and so on and calculated them for every plane in EAW planeset.

And here is there result, its btw the 1st chart i ever saw that differs between FW190A and D



The most funniest thing is, that spit IX and XIV roll way slower at speed than spit I-V.

FW190A roll at 164 °/sec
FW190D at 160 °/sec

the only planes that can ever match FW190 roll are P51 and P38 with powered ailerons at high speeds.

Edit: Just for in case anyone thinks they dont know what they do, one of this guys is an active aircraft designer, so i guess he has an idea of aerodynamics etc.

[leitwolf]

a short offline test reveals:

FW-190A5 135°/second
FW-190D9 130°/second
Spitfire MkIX 80°/second

all tests at 3000ft, 250mph IAS, 25%fuel, the A5 had it's outboard cannons removed, all rolls clockwise. These figures are somewhat inaccurate due to nosedropping after the initial roll and increasing speed. Actual rollrate might be a bit (~10°) higher. That's what my stick gives me

[Naudet]

Nevertheless, even if you add the 10°/sec, both FW190 would role at 20°/sec slower than in the chart. This would be a difference of around 12-14%.

This is from my standpoint to far away to be called a "small" inaccuracy.

Btw, anyway having an idea how to perform roletest without any nosedrop and speed increase?

[Erlkonig]

190 roll rate has been brought up several times already. I can't find the threads that had the tests and discussion, but it was found that the AH 190A rolls slower than NACA data for slower airspeeds (< 250mph?) and faster for higher airspeeds (> 300mph?). The image I'm thinking about had AH curves superimposed on the original NACA chart, if anyone happened to have saved it. It did not have data on the D9.

[illo]

190s should have their rollrate reduced at high speeds and added at low/med speeds.

This is very important to anyone who flies 190.

Hitech, do you agree or do you maybe have data from more trustworthy sources?

Here we have this usual naca roll chart

[Fishu]

The answer from HTC's side would be: "Because Fw190 has too fast roll rate and makes it warp"

[MANDOBLE]

No problem with that, roll rate reduced due warps, but then lets reduce also the roll rate of the rest of the planset instead of just having their roll rate slighly increased over NACA report.

[Nashwan]

Hristo did some tests of the rollrates some time ago.

The 190 was about 5deg a sec too slow below 250, bang on at the peak (about 255 mph iirc) and 25 deg a sec too fast at 300 +

Most of the other planes were similar, too slow at low speed, too fast at high speed.

The Spit was slow at low speed, and 21 deg a sec too fast at high speed.

In other words, no neutering of the 190 has taken place. AH either has it's rollrates wrongly skewed for high speed, or more likely there is a difference between the way rests are carried out here and by NACA.

[illo]

Thanks nashwan. I think it maybe just different stick forces modeled for high speeds then.

[minus]

crap about no neutering !!!   190 elevtor autority and E lose is so terible if u try anything alse like roll you imedaitaly lose  speed drasticly and slow  down and roll rate  at slow to low worth of nothing !!!!!! in 1.03 even niki teror have problem  to scisor with 190 , and  not includet  warpers, not all was warpy,  and the old notorios warper still warp even today they just dont fly 190 anymore


definitely 190 is not a 190 in AH:(  not anymore  for long time:(

[SageFIN]

Originally posted by Nashwan
Hristo did some tests of the rollrates some time ago.

The 190 was about 5deg a sec too slow below 250, bang on at the peak (about 255 mph iirc) and 25 deg a sec too fast at 300 +

Most of the other planes were similar, too slow at low speed, too fast at high speed.

The Spit was slow at low speed, and 21 deg a sec too fast at high speed.

Too fast, too slow, yes yes, but compared to what? The NACA test AFAIR had 50 lbs of stick force as the upper limit. But whatever the limiting stick force in the NACA test and AH, below both of those (ie. at the maximum aileron deflection) the planes should have identical performances. I remember that it wasn't quite so.

[Mark Luper]

Hehe, another Luftwhiner thread

Don't be mad at me, just funnin you guys.

Keep it in perspective, what difference does it really make? Just adjust to what is there and learn to work with it.

All 47's had field mods to them to increase turbocharger output but it's not modeled, so what, I work with what is there.

It's a game people, not real life, quit acting like it was.

[minus]

mark luper , if your prefered plane got be the 190 FM , i em sure you and other will cry out a new ocean about  it !:p