Author Topic: I have to say it.........  (Read 2930 times)

Offline Nifty

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I have to say it.........
« Reply #30 on: April 08, 2002, 12:15:10 PM »
simple solution to this.  send the map back to HTC and have them place shore batteries at EVERY base on the ndisles map.  Then try to park the TWO fleets in visible range of the field.

I have no problem with vulching in general.  I do have a problem with a CV being parked super close to shore to do the vulching.  In most every other setup we have, to vulch, you have to fly 20-30 miles to do it.   You can knock down a vulture and it'll take him some time to get back on station to do it again.  When the CV is right off shore, he can get back in a matter of minutes.  Plus, given the difference in plane performances, he can climb to a near untouchable advantage in his fleet ack umbrella (which is far more deadly than the ack at a field, especially if the 5 in guns are being manned by human players) AND get back over the defending field much faster than he would have if the fleet wasn't parked right off shore.

The nearest vulch free bases were 40+ miles away.  Given the speed that the Japanese planes travel and the fact that the Hellcats and Corsairs were less than 10 miles from the base, what was the point in even trying to come from a rear field.  Sure you might get there in time to knock down a few Hellcats, but they come right back up safe in their ack umbrella.   Without shore batteries, there's no way the Japanese can deal with CV fleets that park right off shore.

But wait, the Allieds could sink the Japanese carrier!  So how come the Japs can't do it back?  Well because it takes 4 suicide Hellcats vs 16 suicide Zekes.  Fully loaded Hellcats can outrun Zekes in level flight and can dive from Tonys.  From this it's easy to see why the Hellcats (or Corsairs) can get their 2000lbs over the CV then dive through the ack, drop and die 4 times before a Zeke could do it 16 times.  The Zekes on the other hand can't get away from the Hellcats to make a run on the CV, IMO.  TBMs and Ju88s are fodder for the Hellcats if they try torp runs.

But hey, far be it from me to tell anyone how to play the game.  If the majority of the players want to concentrate on capturing bases, then they should.  The best way to do it in this setup is to park a CV super close to the shore and just ack run until you get the defense down low over the field then commence to vulching while the LVTs run to the town.

It was so bad at one point that my strategy was just to spawn and sit there hoping they'd either run out of ammo or run into the ground (one actually did auger).  Of course it didn't matter as the CV was so close, the guy was probably back in under 2 minutes.  ;)

BTW, the N1K2-J being unperked and available at all fields wouldn't change this one bit, IMO.   They can't kill CVs any easier than the other Japanese planes.

Am I ranting?  yeah, it was frustrating at times because the choices for flying on the Japanese side were
1) get vulched
2) fly 20-30 minutes to have a chance in the fight at which point the Allieds would already have taken the base
3) milkrun bases since all the Allieds were busy taking one Jap base
4) watch from the tower
5) log off or switch to the Allied side.
None of those choices is much fun, so I picked 1, as it's the lesser of the evils, IMO.
proud member of the 332nd Flying Mongrels, noses in the wind since 1997.

Offline Kieran

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I have to say it.........
« Reply #31 on: April 08, 2002, 12:49:46 PM »
FWIW, Tac, both Ammo and I did immediately switch to the Japanese side- in my case, this occured right after I de-acked a field. I saw the numbers, augered, and re-upped at the very field I de-acked. I of course was vultched mercilessly, but no worries. ;)

I flew the rest of my time as a Japanese pilot, as did Ammo.

Wotan-

Yeah, that was a good time until the Gilligans moved the fleets together. FWIW, our CV was sunk before yours was. Our cruiser went down first, too. I knew then you guys wouldn't be back, because I wouldn't have bothered either under the circumstances.

Offline Kieran

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« Reply #32 on: April 08, 2002, 12:56:39 PM »
To the point of what the CT is about, and why I fly it...

I like the fact it is lesser populated. I like how you can go in and face opponents that are more-or-less balanced in terms of aircraft, or at the very least, contemporaries. I like the atmosphere; it's a friendlier place and much more like AH used to be back in the day. I don't have much time to play usually, so there can't be much strat for me. It's take a few hops, fight for a while, leave when the time is up.

Offline SKurj

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« Reply #33 on: April 08, 2002, 03:51:16 PM »
japanese dive bombers carried AP bombs (actually modified artillery shells) weighing over 1800lbs at pearl harbour...

The IJN gonna need something like the above, and real torps before any quazi-historical action can take place in the PAC..

SKurj

Offline hazed-

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I have to say it.........
« Reply #34 on: April 08, 2002, 04:52:57 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by eskimo2
Hazed,
You harped on vulching 3+ times at the BEGINNING of your original post.
It sure sounds to me like there's more to it than mentioning it "on behalf" of some other players.  Especially when your major gripe was the plane-set.
Spin it however you like.



About the only normal situations that I won't shoot at an enemy are:
* When he is airborne and missing a essential part to maintain controlled flight.  I.E. an entire wing, tail or horizontal stab.
* When he is in a chute.  The longer he is in a chute, the longer it takes him to become an effective threat again.

Other than that, I ruthlessly and mercilessly kill everything I see.
Chivalry is BS and only for those who are either trying to make others happy or trying to portray themselves as some kind of noble-gentleman-hero-wannabe, when in-fact they're just another dork playing on a computer (as am I).

In the exact situation that you described above, it would depend.
If a squadmate or countryman was approaching in a goon, no way would I let them up.
Otherwise, probably.

eskimo



eskimo read it how YOU like.YOU are totally wrong.its your misinterpretation more than its my poor explanation.The vulch comments i made originally:

'Not allowing players the chance to launch even when no capture is in progress'
'NO vulching just for kills!!!but for a capture only'

couldnt have been any clearer and was just one comment amonst many i considered more important. call it whatever you like YOU ARE WRONG.It doesnt matter how many times i explain things to you you interpret it totally different to anyone else in this post.Do me a favour  and stick to your own posts.I dont post in yours because i dont agree.If i agree i post an agreement.I dont post 5 bloody times telling YOU what YOU meant by what you said.

if you actually realised the original post is FIRST A LIST and then an explanation or comment on what each meant.ALL of them were mentioned TWICE minumum! YOU CHOSE to latch onto the vulch aspect alone not me.i also said
'A lack of interest in any organisation or missions etc.' AND
Squadron flying and tactics? Large bomber formations making the attack clear rather than solo milkrun behaviour in order to allow the few enemy on to have a chance of attack?'
also:
'Same kill no matter what attitude' AND
'allowing a severly damaged aircraft to ditch rather than totally destroy them as they scrape to a stop? do we want to piss off the few people we have in the CT?'


It couldnt be any clearer what my veiw was.I dont vulch people unless im on a capture.YOU just said the SAME BLOODY THING.stop pissing me off with your inane interpretations.spin? you dont know the meaning of it.I couldnt give a toejam what you THINK i meant.Im fed up with trying to drum it into your thick skull.

Ill make sure if youre online that i dont tell anyone to up safe. youre obviously one of these types who jump in and kill them regardless.Just the sort of MA mentality i despise.
When numbers are low in CT i tend to relax the kill or be killed attitude in order to get decent fights.I will allow people to get alt.I have had several fights in the ct with people where ive left 2 to fight alone until im requested to help.
You've never had this in CT?
Why dont we ask the others if they have done this?
Im 100% sure im not alone in doing this because ive talked to them on radio whilst its happening.1 on 1's allowing players to get off the ground even allowing an advantage when axis have 8 on and allies 4 in the BOB i organised a pure bomber mission with no escort and we TOLD the allies where we were going to attack, the 8 to 4 odds seemed fair bombers vs fighters and it worked really well,Everyone enjoyed it.Sure they died getting us one by one but they could climb back to us without fighter attacks.WE even kept the manifold at 40 so we didnt leave them behind!.when numbers are so low as they were theres not much point in capture as its uncontested.Uncontested capture is milkrunning.I dont do it unless im in there totally alone and theres nothing else to do, which i think has happened once!.

call this spin do you? i call it an explanation of how i like to play the game with a fairer ballance.
do you now understand the MEANING of the original post now? finally? Its not any one indiviadual thing or comment i want to be dragged up over and over, its the general lack of enthusiasm for any realistic  behaviour or re-enactment.There seems to be no interest in it and yet on you come teling me youre doing exactly this with your squadron!!and at the same time berating me for wishing for it.WELL what do you know...you enjoy it too???? well this is what i want to see MORE of in the CT.Squadron flying etc but if we havent got the numbers its damn wrong to bring huge squads in and POUND the few guys trying to have fun who DONT have a squadron to fly with. I think you have just played the typical BB part of picking a single quote, taking it out of context and winding up the person who posted it by bringing it up over and over and adding your own interpretation.Well way to go.really productive and positively fun for me explaining myself over and over.:rolleyes: sheesh. what a waste of my time.
« Last Edit: April 08, 2002, 05:06:04 PM by hazed- »

Offline Wotan

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« Reply #35 on: April 08, 2002, 05:16:29 PM »
yeah the fleets came together and boom 5 inch flack nailed me I logged right after. I dont know what was killed 1st. I do know I wasnt in a mood to fly 35-40 miles to find a fight.

I have lots of fun when I am on. I upped a niki yeterday got 7 kills before i was killed.

Had some ok fights till it became a race to fleet ack after every reverse. At that point I logged.

This is a much better set up then previous pac set ups. I really hope to see the early war pac stuff. The ct will only get better as we get more planes and more parity within the setups

Offline eskimo2

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« Reply #36 on: April 08, 2002, 07:18:46 PM »
Originally posted by hazed-

"YOU CHOSE to latch onto the vulch aspect alone not me."

Oh gee, I forget...
Who started this thread?
LOL dude, YOU brought it up!

Originally posted by hazed-

"couldnt have been any clearer and was just one comment amonst many i considered more important. call it whatever you like YOU ARE WRONG.It doesnt matter how many times i explain things to you you interpret it totally different to anyone else in this post."

I'm not interpreting anything differently Hazed, I CHOSE to comment on vulching and player mentality.
Others chose to comment on plane-set.
There are different themes running throughout your thread because you brought up many topics.

Look at my second post:

It was a response to your comment on my first post.  Here you harp on me and my squad for not flying IJN after we only flew ONE DANG NIGHT!

Not only are you TELLING ME WHAT TO FLY AND WHO TO FLY FOR, but you expect me and my squad to switch sides in the middle of our squad night?

That's total B.S.

_____________________________ __

quote:
Originally posted by hazed-

no Tac this obviously is a figment of our imagination.According to eskimo and his 'buccaneers' this sort of thing just doesnt happen

we apparently need to 'get over it'.

funny, dont see too many buccaneers on the ijn side do you?

joking aside if people choose not to admit or accept the ijn are at a disadvantage then, well , what can anyone do.
Like i said i flew on both sides and found the allies enjoyable if a little dull because you cant really dogfight in them too welland it means bnz all the time(apart from in f6fs) and the ijn side frustrating. If you dont agree eskimo id appreciate it if you actually tried flying on their side first.I checked your stats and you have flown mostly f6f and no IJN at all.No wonder you dont agree.

I think that I made it clear that I was refering to last night.
You were refering to last night in your original post.
I have logged in to this weeks set up once, and I flew with my squad. We flew the mission that we planned earlier in the week.
I can't really tell you much about the ballance in this week's set-up because I only have flown last night.

Personally, some set ups I fly one side all week.
Others I always log onto the side with lesser numbers each time I log on.
And often, I log onto the side that my squad mates are on.
But overall, I certainly have spent plenty of time as the underdog.
Much of it axis.

The big difference is,
I've learned not to whine about it.

I just take it or leave it, as it is.

eskimo

_____________________________ ___
Originally posted by hazed-
"Do me a favour and stick to your own posts.I dont post in yours because i dont agree.If i agree i post an agreement.I dont post 5 bloody times telling YOU what YOU meant by what you said. "

Oh great, let's all agree to only agree.
That'll make the BB really worthwhile!
Drop the Sunday school attitude Hazed.

Originally posted by hazed-

"youre obviously one of these types who jump in and kill them regardless.Just the sort of MA mentality i despise.
When numbers are low in CT i tend to relax the kill or be killed attitude in order to get decent fights.I will allow people to get alt.I have had several fights in the ct with people where ive left 2 to fight alone until im requested to help. "

If anyone is playing the "Holier than thou" card it's you.

You apparently "despise" anyone who does not fly to your oh-so-honorable standards.

This attitude is what I've really got a problem with.  The "play my way or not at all" thing is really getting old and annoying.

Hazed,
When you tell other players: how, what, when, where, and why they should fly, you can't expect not to get nailed for it.

You may think that people hate the "kill or be killed attitude" more than anything.
I believe that most people are even more annoyed by the "Fly my way only" attitude.

Whether you realize it or not, this is a theme of yours throughout your thread.

eskimo

Offline hazed-

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I have to say it.........
« Reply #37 on: April 09, 2002, 07:51:52 AM »
ahhhhhh diddly off.
lets both agree not to ever diddlying talk again eh? you've just got the honour of being the first ever on my ignore list.

Hell, if it gets me banned from AH so be it.Im fed up with talking to you.
total diddlyin' waste of my time and effort.


p.s. go find one of your posts eskimo where ive done to you what youve done here, or disagreed and ripped into your opinions.

sunday school? I think you've barely graduated from it.
« Last Edit: April 09, 2002, 07:55:58 AM by hazed- »

Offline eskimo2

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« Reply #38 on: April 09, 2002, 08:11:56 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by hazed-
ahhhhhh diddly off.
lets both agree not to ever diddlying talk again eh? you've just got the honour of being the first ever on my ignore list.

Hell, if it gets me banned from AH so be it.Im fed up with talking to you.
total diddlyin' waste of my time and effort.


Hazed shows his true colors and mentality.

It sounds to me like you can't deal with the truth bud.

No attempt to either say "I was wrong" or to try to provide an intelligent response to my above post, which clearly shows how you are not making sense.  You've tried to spin this into, "I was speaking for someone else" and "eskimo doesn't know Jack because he didn't fly IJN his first night in the CT."

You let this snowball, I just didn't let you get away with it.

eskimo

Offline Yeager

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« Reply #39 on: April 09, 2002, 09:28:21 AM »
Ahhh  hehe      my creedo:

RELAX, ITS JUST A GAME
"If someone flips you the bird and you don't know it, does it still count?" - SLIMpkns

Offline eddiek

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Dangit Yeager!
« Reply #40 on: April 09, 2002, 10:01:16 AM »
Cut back on the Valium, or Ativan, or whatever it is you're taking!  :p