Author Topic: Looking at getting new system, advice needed.... (Read 666 times)

Skuzzy · « **Reply #15 on:** May 05, 2002, 10:15:43 AM »

Bloom, no offense intended, but how long has it been since you actually installed and used an ATI card?

The latest ATI driver for the Radeon family is rock solid. At least for every app I can find. Even Maya works flawlessly on the latest driver. NVidia has yet to produce a driver that does not have issues with Maya.

Look at some basic stuff. NVidia drivers are a pain to update. You have to go through some third party utility to get rid of thier drivers if you want to upgrade drivers. Not so with ATI.
NVidia has that stupid refresh rate bug in XP and W2K, not so ATI.

ATI released a new DX8.1 driver for the old Rage line of cards, so longevity of support is not an issue. ATI's hardware interface is based on the Rage line. The Radeon line just extended it, so it is not painful for ATI to update the Rage drivers when they update the Radeon drivers.

Driver updates for the Radeon family has been coming about once every 2 months and with each one they actually fix problems without introducing new ones. That is a feat in of itself.

I never think twice about upgrading an ATI driver, because it is so painless to move back to an older driver. I cannot say that for NVidia.

I have both line of cards here, as I use what works best for any given application. I have more troubles with NVidia cards than any of the Radeon systems here. Typically we have to go through 3 or 4 drivers for a NVidia card to find one that works in the application we need it for. Never have had that problem with the Radeon cards.

Animal calls me pro-ATI. I really do not care what video card it is. I use what I have to to make an application work best in my environment. I have a pretty good mix of ATI and NVidia products here and we do have fewer issues with ATI right now than NVidia.

bloom25 · « **Reply #16 on:** May 05, 2002, 08:34:56 PM »

It has been a while Skuzzy. I've been busy for the past few months on other projects, so I haven't spent any time with ATI cards newer than the first generation Radeons.

I'll take your word that they have improved. I'll give them another try when I get the chance. I've just had so many bad experiences with ATI drivers in the past that I have a hard time recommending them to others.

Performance wise, the Radeon 8500 doesn't stack up well versus the GeForce 4 Ti 4200 (let alone the 4400 and 4600).

You are right about the post-23.xx series Nvidia drivers being troublesome though.

funkedup · « **Reply #17 on:** May 06, 2002, 12:56:01 PM »

BigGun I was looking at the Alien website last week. The machines look cool but you can get an equivalent machine for ~$500 less at places like mwave.com.

funkedup · « **Reply #18 on:** May 06, 2002, 01:29:10 PM »

For example, this is the same system except for the case and the video cooler. Same system at Alienware is over $1600. Video cooler is like tits on a boar anyways unless you are an overclocker.

funkedup · « **Reply #19 on:** May 06, 2002, 01:40:37 PM »

The rest of it...

BigGun · « **Reply #20 on:** May 06, 2002, 01:45:14 PM »

Hmm...thanks..i think i will check that site out too.

funkedup · « **Reply #21 on:** May 06, 2002, 02:00:15 PM »

Mwave not might have the support of Alienware though. I have never bought a complete system from them, just barebones machines and motherboard/cpu combos. Everything I have got from them was first class though.

DAVENRINO · « **Reply #22 on:** May 06, 2002, 02:10:58 PM »

Funkedup is right, there are many places cheaper than Alienware and Mwave is a good company, but I don't believe Mwave offers any warranty at all. I can afford the extra $500 (actually $695 with 3 year warranty) and it is worth it to me for the service they provide. For 3 years I don't have to worry bout ANY components failing. They Fedex the parts and a local tech installs them in my home. I don't even pay for shipping. Troubleshooting often requires trial and error replacement of expensive components. I am sure glad I don't have to worry bout that. Of the bigger OEMs I am impressed with Alienware. I have a Dell laptop and their service is no better than Alienware and it costs more. If you want to save some $$$ and aren't concerned with warranty, then Mwave is an excellent choice.
DJ229

DAVENRINO · « **Reply #23 on:** May 06, 2002, 02:28:40 PM »

...cont Only complaint with Alienware tech support is that sometimes it can take up to a couple hours for them to get back to you, but at least they don't put you on hold and it is toll free. They are open 24/7 and an operator takes your name ,etc and they WILL get back to you. It just depends how busy they are.
DJ229

funkedup · « **Reply #24 on:** May 06, 2002, 02:58:24 PM »

Good point Dave. I am a build-it-yourself guy so that stuff doesn't matter to me. But if I didn't feel confident building and troubleshooting it myself then it would be nice to have the security of that warranty and tech support & service from Alienware. Their computers look damn cool too.

BigGun · « **Reply #25 on:** May 09, 2002, 11:18:23 AM »

I ended up going with Alienware system, actually my wife purchased it for me. Thanks for the comments everyone. It actually ended up being a good deal. BestBuy is currently getting all the demo models upgraded from Alienware. They still have some demos that are in warehouse, new in box. The price from BestBuy is over $500 less than if I tried to purchase from Alienware. Now I just have to wait till Monday!!!

Area 51 System Specs:
Dragon Full-Tower Case (340-Watt PS) (Conspiracy Blue)
Intel® Pentium® 4 Processor 2.0GHz 400MHz FSB w/ 512KB Cache
256MB RDRAM PC-800
107-Enhanced Windows Keyboard (Conspiracy Blue)
Microsoft IntelliMouse Explorer USB (Conspiracy Blue)
60GB Seagate Barracuda ATA IV 7200RPM 2MB Cache
NVIDIA GeForce3 Ti 500 w/64MB 4X AGP
KoolMaxx Video Cooling System (Standard Chrome)
SoundBlaster LIVE! 5.1
16X /48X IDE DVD-ROM Drive w/Software MPEG-2 Decoder
AlienAutopsy: Automated Technical Support Request System
Aliencare Toll-Free 1-Year 24/7 ONSITE Warranty
Microsoft® Windows® XP Professional

Lephturn · « **Reply #26 on:** May 09, 2002, 11:32:23 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by bloom25
Hmm, coming from you Lephturn I know you suggested the hardware decoder for a good reason. What is it exactly?

Whoops, missed this one a while back.

Well, basically, hardware decoders just are generally higher quality, smoother, and you'll have less problems watching movies in my experience. If you really want to watch DVD's on your computer, I think it's worth getting a hardware decoder for the extra features and better quality. However, I have not tried the software decoders on the more modern CPU's... like over 1.5 Gig. It may well be that you'll get decent performance with a software decoder if you've got lots of RAM and a beefy CPU. Generally speaking though, I feel that most computer vendors are selling DVD drives just because it's an easy sell, and most folks will never use it. But, now that the price of DVD drives is coming down, the difference is becoming less of a big deal. Still, up here in Canada, a cheap CD-ROM is about $49, while a cheap DVD drive is $85. Forty bucks is forty bucks... I'll spend it on other parts of my system.

I still don't own a single DVD drive at home... and I've got 4 machines. One day I might renew my MS Technet subscription and have to break down and buy a DVD drive I suppose. But other than that, I have not seen a need for one.

BigGun · « **Reply #27 on:** May 09, 2002, 11:37:27 AM »

I pretty much agree on the DVDrom, i can't say I plan on watching movies on computer, but the demo system came with it, no ability to customize.

One question I have is what is RDram vs. SD or DDram? This system only came with 256k RDRAM, I figure I can easily add more if needed.

bloom25 · « **Reply #28 on:** May 09, 2002, 12:20:46 PM »

Looks pretty good overall. I personally would have gone AMD, but that's mainly because once again Intel has made the original Northwood chipsets incompatible with future P4s as of this past Monday.

(That means your motherboard isn't going to be able support anything beyond a 2.4 Ghz 400 Mhz (100 Mhz QDR) FSB P4. This is the 3rd time Intel has done this with the P4 since its release. In the time that Socket A has been in use for all AMD Athlon based CPUs, Intel has used 6 incompatible socket designs. Specifically Slot 1, Socket 370 (coppermine), Socket 370 (tualatin), Socket 423, Socket 478 (A type P4s), and Socket 478 (B type P4s) have all been used and are not compatible. The 2.533 GHz P4 and the 2.4B and 2.2B released Monday have a 533 Mhz FSB (133 Mhz QDR) and are not supported on "older" socket 478 boards. It *may* be supported on boards with the new SiS chipset though... )

RDRAM = Rambus DRAM. This is a high speed serial bus ram design that gives top performance on Intel P4 based systems (around 5 - 10% faster than PC2100 on i845D boards). That's the good news. The bad news is that RDRAM MUST be installed in pairs and is currently more expensive than DDR SDRAM per module. Intel may also be dropping RAMBUS by the end of the year.

The only real complaint I would have is only 256 MB of ram and a GF 3 (rather than GF 4) video card. You should be happy with it though.